Action button labels

[Neelix]

Personally I'm all for labelling the buttons Home, End, PgUp, PgDn, Ins and Del (assuming those functions are assigned to the last two keys)  That has several things going for it:

• Easily read and recognised symbols
• A, B, X and Y can be mapped as needed, without clashing with the labels.
• No clash between keyboard key names and gaming button names.
• Don't need a reference to initially find those keyboard functions.

 Not bad, but I'd much rather have my game buttons read as game buttons.

Yeah, I get that.  (which is the main reason I never really considered posting that suggestion until now)

on front page of the wiki,  in a pinned topic on the forums,

Yes, because that worked so well to stop the posts requesting we port X closed-source software to GP2X/Wiz/Pandora.... -_-'

-God Ginrai

 I hardly think that's comparable...   the context is completely different.  The names of the buttons is something the user is likely to want to know  if they want to communicate about it.  A pinned topic with the subject line,  "So what are those buttons called again? (and other FAQs)" should nicely draw attention.    In any case, I wasn't suggesting they be the only places to put it. 

- Neelix

 

[Hồng Thất Công]

@ God Ginrai: I like your 3 guys and 2 girls example. It's different 'cause I usually only see 2 guys and 1 girls or 2 girls and 1 guy

 

[Natsu]

God Ginrai pretty much posted what I was going to say.

 

[Saber]

On the contrary, I've shown it's possible to keep four big normal size face buttons and add two smaller ones for fighting game aficionados in the first post of the "Unofficial Keyboard Layouts" thread.


As I've said before, imagine there's two smaller buttons to the left and right of the "Y" button, or the North buttons of any good game controller, and you'll see it could work without shrinking the regular ones down in size.

 
Absolutely not. Your idea for the layout of the buttons was absolutely miserable, and the only reason I didn't address it before is because I didn't want to drag the keyboard topic you posted it in offtopic. If you had actually participated in the six button topic, you would have realized that the consensus is to keep a 6-button layout that was close to the Saturn layout that also allowed 4 of the buttons to have a cross pattern so that those who want their 4 cross buttons can still have them. 

I did look that thread over about the six button layout. I still don't see it being realistically possible to have the Saturn layout you so fervently believe in given the space constraints.

 

[Saber]

I noticed on page 3 of the "6 buttons AB/CD/XY and 4 shoulder buttons" thread Wizardstan came up with the 6 button layout I've been advising we use before. Very good. I'd also like to mention that I love playing fighting games. They've been a casual interest of mine for decades so I have my own desire for a 6 button layout(although I'd be okay with 4 face buttons and 4 shoulder triggers). So having said that I urge anyone who believes you can't get the layout that Wizardstan and myself proposed to work to actually try it out on any handy game controller you have nearby. You'll see it could be realizable and non-straining to the thumbs given what we have to work with spacewise. A big plus here too is it doesn't interfere with the cross pattern when you only need 4 buttons, as most users will, and it requires only minor thumb travel. Try it out and see.

 

[Foxgod]

No symbols please, reminds me too much of low quality chinese knock off devices, lets keep it the way it is on the panda.

 

[Kiga]

[...]


That's why I said:


-Greek letters are the Future,


but also


-romanian letters & numbers & square/triangle/circle/X are the Past,


-others options are Off-topic.

 
It is utterly ignorant posts like these that make it hard for me to take you seriously. Are you honestly trolling?

Nobody care about how you take me. What could be interesting is some arguments. I understand that you don't wanna try to arg with me, your previous attempts was painful, sorry. Thanks God you didn't try to arg about your clown symbols again, I will not have to humiliate you also on this thread. Ad hominem attack is all left you to feed your huge ego, so I don't blame you.

 

[God Ginrai]

I did look that thread over about the six button layout. I still don't see it being realistically possible to have the Saturn layout you so fervently believe in given the space constraints.

 If you read further, you would see that I had specifically mentioned how we could fit that layout on the device. Multiple times in that topic, I believe.

I noticed on page 3 of the "6 buttons AB/CD/XY and 4 shoulder buttons" thread Wizardstan came up with the 6 button layout I've been advising we use before. Very good. I'd also like to mention that I love playing fighting games. They've been a casual interest of mine for decades so I have my own desire for a 6 button layout(although I'd be okay with 4 face buttons and 4 shoulder triggers). So having said that I urge anyone who believes you can't get the layout that Wizardstan and myself proposed to work to actually try it out on any handy game controller you have nearby. You'll see it could be realizable and non-straining to the thumbs given what we have to work with spacewise. A big plus here too is it doesn't interfere with the cross pattern when you only need 4 buttons, as most users will, and it requires only minor thumb travel. Try it out and see.

 I have tried it. It doesn't work. The reason the 4 button layout works, and the 6 button sega saturn layout works, is due to the buttons forming 2 lines that follow the natural pivot of the thumb in the same way. This allows you to move your thumb back and forth to easily hit the buttons on one row, and then you move it up and move back and forth the same way to hit any button on the second row. The left-right axis is easy for the thumb to move on, but the up-down axis takes more effort. Having only 2 rows minimizes the difficulties of the up-down motion because you only have to move a little. However, your idea involes using 3 rows, which requires an exaggerated up-down movement of the thumb which is much more difficult to do while playing a game.

Nobody care about how you take me. What could be interesting is some arguments. I understand that you don't wanna try to arg with me, your previous attempts was painful, sorry. Thanks God you didn't try to arg about your clown symbols again, I will not have to humiliate you also on this thread. Ad hominem attack is all left you to feed your huge ego, so I don't blame you.

I could hardly be humiliated by someone who doesn't even understand the difference between Romanians and Romans, especially when you have already been previously corrected that what you are referring to is called the Latin alphabet, not Romanian. However, I have realized that you will just ignore any facts that don't fit with the way you want things to be (like the battery issue) or try to drive out the competition through sheer obstinance. (Like your constant attempts to suggest that other options are off topic in a topic about the button labels)

That is why I asked if you are trolling.

-God Ginrai

 

[Kiga]

I could hardly be humiliated by someone who doesn't even understand the difference between Romanians and Romans, especially when you have already been previously corrected that what you are referring to is called the Latin alphabet, not Romanian.

Lol, thanks for mentinoning that it's Latin and not Romanian or Roman or wathever, sorry it was a copy/past. But seriously who care about cosmetics fact like that. Allright, you're a genius, you know the right name and I am ignorant. So what? How is this help us to find the right  button label.

However, I have realized that you will just ignore any facts that don't fit with the way you want things to be (like the battery issue) or try to drive out the competition through sheer obstinance. (Like your constant attempts to suggest that other options are off topic in a topic about the button labels)

 

That is why I asked if you are trolling.

The only thing I ignore is useless things like letters name. I just can't waste my energy when fact are obvious. Nobody said that 8000mah battery is impossible, on the contrary ED said it could be possible, so don't substitute yourself for ED please.

Shit, I'm done with you, I can't support sophism I don't have time to arg when I'm the only one who seeks the truth (which I already find). Just find someone else to feed your ego.

 

[God Ginrai]

I could hardly be humiliated by someone who doesn't even understand the difference between Romanians and Romans, especially when you have already been previously corrected that what you are referring to is called the Latin alphabet, not Romanian.

Lol, thanks for mentinoning that it's Latin and not Romanian or Roman or wathever, sorry it was a copy/past. But seriously who care about cosmetics fact like that. Allright, you're a genius, you know the right name and I am ignorant. So what? How is this help us to find the right  button label.

 Neither does claiming every option other than the one you like as off-topic.

The only thing I ignore is useless things like letters name. I just can't waste my energy when fact are obvious. Nobody said that 8000mah battery is impossible, on the contrary ED said it could be possible, so don't substitute yourself for ED please.

I'll just leave this here:

All I see is blablabla and bold letters. ED said that it can (or could if you want) be done, so till he say the contrary it can be done to me. That's why I wrote on this topic to point that 8000mah would be better.

And he's saying now that 6000 mAh is what he thinks will work given the constraints. This is what he found after looking into it more. You shouldn't make the older comments take precedence over the newer ones just because you like them more.

 

Shit, I'm done with you, I can't support sophism I don't have time to arg when I'm the only one who seeks the truth (which I already find). Just find someone else to feed your ego.

You accused me of making Ad Hominem arguments in your last post. Well, I'd much rather be making those than trying to invalidate someone with libel like you are trying to do right now.

-God Ginrai

 

[bzar]

Can we get back to discussing the issue now? Continue that line of conversation in PM if you must, but polluting useful threads with it is not constructive.

EDIT: And please neither of you say "but he started it!"

 

[_wb_]

No symbols please, reminds me too much of low quality chinese knock off devices, lets keep it the way it is on the panda.

The way it is on the Pandora is 4 buttons, labeled Y B X A (clockwise starting from the top). You want to keep that? No 6 buttons?

If you want to keep the ABXY Latin letter labels, in the same order as on the Pandora, and you want to add two buttons also with Latin letters, then please tell us which letters would make sense for the extra keys. Keeping the ABXY labels but in a different order as on the Pandora is a bad idea.

 

[bzar]

Ö and Ä. They come after X and Y, but not immediately. Like X and Y come after A and B.

 

[Kiga]

And he's saying now that 6000 mAh is what he thinks will work given the constraints. This is what he found after looking into it more. You shouldn't make the older comments take precedence over the newer ones just because you like them more.

Why the hell want you to talk to me, are you some kind of fan? ED never said he chose 6000 because otherwise can't be done so why don't you **** and ask him to precise? I guess it's because your ego is sick, it's not suprising for someone who named himself "God" and precise at the end of each post that what he said is God's word. You want to feed that sick ego no matter what you say, that's why I am the only one who seeks truth, and that's why I'm not going to argument anymore.

Enough off-topic.

 

[Saber]

I did look that thread over about the six button layout. I still don't see it being realistically possible to have the Saturn layout you so fervently believe in given the space constraints.

 
If you read further, you would see that I had specifically mentioned how we could fit that layout on the device. Multiple times in that topic, I believe.

I noticed on page 3 of the "6 buttons AB/CD/XY and 4 shoulder buttons" thread Wizardstan came up with the 6 button layout I've been advising we use before. Very good. I'd also like to mention that I love playing fighting games. They've been a casual interest of mine for decades so I have my own desire for a 6 button layout(although I'd be okay with 4 face buttons and 4 shoulder triggers). So having said that I urge anyone who believes you can't get the layout that Wizardstan and myself proposed to work to actually try it out on any handy game controller you have nearby. You'll see it could be realizable and non-straining to the thumbs given what we have to work with spacewise. A big plus here too is it doesn't interfere with the cross pattern when you only need 4 buttons, as most users will, and it requires only minor thumb travel. Try it out and see.

 
I have tried it. It doesn't work. The reason the 4 button layout works, and the 6 button sega saturn layout works, is due to the buttons forming 2 lines that follow the natural pivot of the thumb in the same way. This allows you to move your thumb back and forth to easily hit the buttons on one row, and then you move it up and move back and forth the same way to hit any button on the second row. The left-right axis is easy for the thumb to move on, but the up-down axis takes more effort. Having only 2 rows minimizes the difficulties of the up-down motion because you only have to move a little. However, your idea involes using 3 rows, which requires an exaggerated up-down movement of the thumb which is much more difficult to do while playing a game.

-God Ginrai

The strangeness continues. First of all, I did read the entire thread and even if absurdity was multiplied over a hundred more pages, it would still remain absurd. Your last post in that topic was post 243, which was the Neo Geo layout. Right before it you said we could add a "tilt" to the buttons without shrinking them in size to fit on the Pyra case(which you also said earlier in the thread did not need to be extended horizontally). Sorry, but the solution is not physically possible in reality no matter how much wishing is done. 

As for my proposed layout, as someone who plays fighters often, I had no difficulty moving my thumb to the left and right of the "Y" button. It felt very natural without any exaggeration or strain to my thumb. I didn't need to follow this supposedly natural path of my thumb as we see on other 6 button controllers.

 

[Klumpen]

 

[Foxgod]

Actually, i do think 4 buttons would be fine, i dont know why i would need 6, as 4 shoulder buttons is plenty to map all required keys to.

 

[Hồng Thất Công]

No i want 6. Don't change it. Ed said it's possible so Saber please don't keep on saying it's not posible

 

[PokeParadox]

Seriously... this is still an issue... I thought it was already decided on the 6 face buttons... if you don't want to use the 6 buttons then don't use them...

 

[WizardStan]

Ö and Ä. They come after X and Y, but not immediately. Like X and Y come after A and B.

That does make me think a little, why not two letters in the middle?AB-NO-XY in whatever configuration.

AB -> home/end

XY -> pgup/pgdn

NO -> insert/delete

Actually feels kinda comfortable, thinking about it. N... insert. O... delete.