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[mali]

^This

 

[zounder1]

Sheesh, does anyone remember how crap-didly-appy Apple iPhone OS 1.0 was in a lot of ways? Or the slew of problems with iPhone OS 2.0 (with a desperate need to go to 2.01 quickly). Even the iPhone OS 3.0 release had some issues for some folks. Apple has made the iPhone leaps and bounds nicer from the day the first model was released. This whole Appstore mania created by Apple did not even exist with the 1.0 release!! It took subsequent upgrades released by Apple to get to one of the defining features of the iPhone.

To be very, very clear. THE FREAKING JESUS-PHONE IPHONE DID NOT RELEASE WITH THE APPSTORE FUNCTIONALITY. The feature did not appear until a FULL YEAR after the release of the first iPhone.

Get a grip with the expectation that everything to be perfect and everything be implemented at release. Apple didn't do it with the iPhone. Sony didn't do it with the PSP. Base functionality with a booting OS is what should be expected at release of the Pandora. (And based on videos seen, we are WAY, WAY, past base functionality in a lot of areas and already moving towards pretty slick.) WiFi functionality is obviously important and it is pretty obvious that the powers-that-be fully understand how important it it and will make it a priority.

 

[MonkeyChops]

Some of you people need to stop shitting on the devs who have actually stuck around this project for two years taking time away from their wives, girlfriends and families to help out, not to mention any relaxation time away from their full time day jobs. All for free and for a few dev boards to play with...

^^ This

It is getting worse and worse here. I thought it was one of the nicest and politest forums around when I joined. And indeed people always seemed helpful and mostly ontopic. Now it seems to turn in to more and more into a race who can point out weaknesses of the project (nothing wrong with that) and then blaming somebody for it (really incredibly wrong from a community standpoint) Please stop blaming something, if you can help, offer it. If you can find sources that might be interesting please do. If you want to point fingers please point them at your self or at the off button of your PC.

It make me sad seeing this happening. And even more sad that I am probably part of it since I have nothing to contribute except a lot of interest in the project.

I instantly though of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1yfVKsB8wU#t=01m23s
and of MWeston singing it to the naysayers and I laughed.

sorry, carry on...

 

[mali]

Tool

 

[Consequence_9]

Tool

 

[kingoddball]

I dont know who MWeston is referring to but, to be honest, OP Are a company providing a device. The owner of a device expects a working OS.

Nobody as far as I can see is ****ing on the community; they're ****ing on the OP team for simply expecting other people to develop the OS for them. Support in OS development in an OS system should always be appreciated, but not expected - especially if you are a commercial company.

Correct.
I dare say he is referring to my last post.
It was NOT an attack, it was a question - Maybe it was worded too harsh!

$400 (conversion rate) for a device is dammed expensive. It should be running great when it's received.

 

[Dead1nside]

Most of the devs, I believe, that are working on the OS are not being paid for their work. I'm so grateful to everyone who's worked on this - all of you. I'm sorry if you don't feel appreciated.

 

[peca]

@ED: S-Video out question - Can I get full 576p25 out (720 x 576 pixels progresive scan) or even 800x600? It will be good enough for productivity. I mean for connecting to PC monitor and making a desktop session.

EDIT: I know that I possessed with those "productivity" things. But time flying and I looking for as much answers as I can get.

Anyway, good work. I'm with You all (You all devs) and get some sleep, as You collapse is not helping.

 

[bradleyb01]

I am looking forward to the OS as is. I remember just a couple of years ago getting Ubuntu 8.04 running on my HP tablet with native drivers for WiFi and the touchscreen took a couple of weeks and several posts on Ubuntu help, but when it all was working 100%, I had alot personally invested in making it the machine that I wanted and liked it all the more for the experience. I can go on about compiling linux in the 90's and even getting stoopid *&$$ DOS games working in the late 80's/early 90's, but you get my point. This is part of the fun of a project like this.

Progress is made incrementally and rarely does everything work 100% straight out of the box.

Thanks for all of your effort, devs.

 

[davidgro]

I dont know who MWeston is referring to but, to be honest, OP Are a company providing a device. The owner of a device expects a working OS.

Nobody as far as I can see is ****ing on the community; they're ****ing on the OP team for simply expecting other people to develop the OS for them. Support in OS development in an OS system should always be appreciated, but not expected - especially if you are a commercial company.

Correct.
I dare say he is referring to my last post.
It was NOT an attack, it was a question - Maybe it was worded too harsh!

$400 (conversion rate) for a device is dammed expensive. It should be running great when it's received.

Actually... 1.0 firmwares, even from the big players are often not as functional as one would like, then they get better. Seriously, the first thing I do when I get a device like a router, media player, or even cellphone (Not even smartphone!) is check online to see if there's a firmware update. And usually there is.

For a device like the Pandora, a good comparison would be (once again) Nokia's internet tablets. The OS that came with the first N800s for example didn't support USB host mode. Stereo bluetooth (A2DP) Still requires a kludgey community written solution.

For an even more obvious example, look at videogame consoles. From what I hear the PS3 has a really decent firmware - now remember what the first reviews were like in 2006. The same applies to the 360, and even the Wii (SDHC anyone?)

 

[EvilDragon]

I'm ok with 1200kbps wifi speed.
ED, drop us a line when you have info about it.

You can be sure about that
It's the thing we hope for

Are there any plans to implement a disable option for WiFI for when I don't want it on?

Sure, it's off by default and you switch it on when you need it.

I dont know who MWeston is referring to but, to be honest, OP Are a company providing a device. The owner of a device expects a working OS.
Nobody as far as I can see is ****ing on the community; they're ****ing on the OP team for simply expecting other people to develop the OS for them. Support in OS development in an OS system should always be appreciated, but not expected - especially if you are a commercial company.

You haven't been here for long now, have you?
We're not a ****ing company, we're basically just a bunch of people who have been on this board since years.
Yes, we've been selling some consoles as owner of small shops, alright. I never made any money out of it (couldn't even make a living from it), it was just for fun.

Basically the MAJOR reason we're a commercial company is that no company will sell you thousands of parts if you're a normal individual. We would've never gotten an OMAP, for instance.
Still, we're the same people that have been here since years. We didn't have any fundings for this whole project - and from the VERY BEGINNING it was clear that the OS will probably need a lot of tweaks when it's released.
The OpenMoko (an Open Source TELEPHONE) wasn't even able to make PHONE calls at the beginning.

Sorry for not being a big enough company to have enough cash lying around to pay thousands of dollars per month just to get some coders - don't forget the devboards which are probably about 1500 USD each.
This would've meant we needed you to pay at least TWICE the money you paid for the device...

Please forget all this commercial company crap as we're definately not some big company. We're us, trying to produce one of the coolest handhelds for you with a bunch of really really really nice and helpful devs!
And the OS turned out pretty good already-

Besides, ever seen a device with a completely working full OS on first release?
The PSP had WiFi, yes. But what could you do except for updating the firmware? You didn't have a messenger, browser, networked mediaplayer... nothing.
The iPhone... yeah, didn't even support Bluetooth headphones. But it was featured of being a phone with an iPod built-in.

People sometimes seem to think we'll do miracles. A device at half of the price that the other devices with the same SoC have, with a perfectly working firmware... and that as a very small company.
Welcome to Wonderland...

 

[Rathum]

@ED: S-Video out question - Can I get full 576p25 out (720 x 576 pixels progresive scan) or even 800x600? It will be good enough for productivity. I mean for connecting to PC monitor and making a desktop session.

EDIT: I know that I possessed with those "productivity" things. But time flying and I looking for as much answers as I can get.

Anyway, good work. I'm with You all (You all devs) and get some sleep, as You collapse is not helping.

576i50 or 480i59.94 are the maxes for S-Video. Same for composite, too.

Just read into S-Video and, oddly enough, it was made for S-VHS. :blink:

 

[EvilDragon]

Just read into S-Video and, oddly enough, it was made for S-VHS. :blink:

Yep, that's why we call it SVHS here in Germany instead of S-Video. That's the reason I confused it

It's not that odd: SVHS recorded Y and C divided. Same as the SVideo

 

[r00tw00t]

All new devices have childhood diseases and the OS is not a problem. It works, the only thing that doesnt work is wifi. Its okay. It can and will be fixed.


The REAL problem is that we still haven't got our Pandoras. Any other problems comes in second imho.

So pretty please ED, Craig, Mweston, Faith etc etc. Can we have them soon?

 

[Paradox]

No offence but whether you are a huge company or not you've got paying customers who are going to expect working OS on their handheld.. it's even been delayed like what at least a year? more? and WiFi still doesn't work properly or something, which was one of the bigger draws to it?

I actually considered not posting this incase I would be threatened with an order cancellation or something but whatever.

 

[renegadechic]

if its that ****ing easy why dont you do it whizz kid? if it was straightforward it would be done.

 

[EvilDragon]

So pretty please ED, Craig, Mweston, Faith etc etc. Can we have them soon?

You can't imagine how happy I am when I finally ship them... probably more happier than ANYONE receiving one

No offence but whether you are a huge company or not you've got paying customers who are going to expect working OS on their handheld..

Hello? The OS is working. It's just WiFi and some optimizations that aren't working.
As said, the PSP wasn't really usable for anything except gaming at the beginning.

The OpenMoko Freerunner (a TELEPHONE) still has problems with WiFi - and for the first six months, not even GPRS was usable.
So we're in a pretty good state here.

it's even been delayed like what at least a year? more? and WiFi still doesn't work properly or something, which was one of the bigger draws to it?

Well, WiFi was really troublesome. DJWillis spent countless hours to fix the driver (what did work out well).
Now he's implementing SDIO transfer into the driver to make it work at proper speed.

Sorry, we can't afford a few devs fulltime. We are happy we managed to pay the Pandora with the money we had.

 

[Rathum]

 

[mali]

if its that ****ing easy why dont you do it whizz kid? if it was straightforward it would be done.

What's your order number?

 

[wuwtk]

Thanks for the constant updates Ed, Its truly appreciated to have the constant updates and complete honesty about the Pandora. I cant wait to get my Pandora and Ill be waiting patiently to get wifi working to have easier tethering with my Droid.