Here Is What Will Be Happening.

[Jumpman]

Yeah, I'm canceling my preorder. Thanks for all the fish.

that's really sad. you were one of the first to order and so enthusiastic back then.

Everyone has a breaking point, I just haven't reached mine yet. I'm sure for every order that's cancelled, there is another new customer to take that spot! Although I'm sure that will change more over time! So the sooner the better for a full release.

I really hope the team can get that MP run before the holiday. I would still love a unit within the next few weeks! :lol:


Chris

 

[Drethon]

Michael will make a video and take some photos of a cased Pandora using the latest case.

We will then ask people if they want to go with this or wait for another revision. We know all that some of you care about is that the controls work.

We will probably look at making 500 of these to get some units in to the wild, but we understand that some of you will want to wait until the case is 100%.

Either way is cool.

That's the plan.

If the issues are cosmetic I'd be more than happy to take one of these, especially with the option to buy a "perfect" case later. Thought I'm so far down the line it probably doesn't even matter...

 

[verm71]

The more overbearing the OP team get, the less inclined the (now fully paid) company will be to assist.

(snip)

As I said before, if the company decide they've had enough of OP they will simply stop responding to calls and emails. And there will be NO cases. At all.

I've worked often with folks from China and I've noticed the harder I pulled, the deeper they dug in their heels. When I treated them with respect, they returned it in kind(ness).

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_finger_trap

The Chinese finger trap is also a commonly-used metaphor for a problem that can be overcome by relaxing, i.e., not trying too hard to solve it, or for a belief system that includes punishment for disbelief in itself. For example, in Acceptance and Commitment Therapy.

 

[mali]

.

 

[sparkymark]

Just to say, I'd also be happy to take on a rough case. Damn, I'll take the think apart and get out my toolbox and make it look nice myself If I have to, I just want it in my hands.

Plus, I'm sure the cases can't cost that much later on to buy a better one.

I think best idea is to do a run of a thousand (as I'm in the first thousand I reckon ), check them, then decide whether any changes need making.

I JUST WANT IT NOW GNNNNNNNNNNN! I don't bear any grudges sh*t happens, firt time for these guys, it can't be easy. I must admit, I'm looking forward to a year or so time, when Pandora Mk2 comes out, that'll be ace, the guys will know how to handle things, and they'll have access to even better tech.

Anyways, on we go

 

[borgqueenx]

yes i also want my pandora, but not if it will have scratches and holes like someone shot an air rifle on them.
When it looks fair, but not superb, i want the cases to be accepted and used for the batch. I dont wanna wait much longer.

 

[Creature XL]

From what I have seen of these new mouldings, your moulding company needs to run a small batch to validate thier parameters, things like mould temperature, injection pressures, cycle times etc.

These coupled with venting added in the correct positions (tiny modifications 1- 2 days max) will sort out your sinkages, short fills etc.

The greasy finish you mention is most probably due to excessive release agent used when running the mould for the first time (reduces the risk of the moulding sticking in the tool).

I have been designing plastic components for over 10 years now, and alot of your issues with Chinese moulding companies are well known, regardless which company you chose over there, they just work diferently to us.

I am very optimistic though, when these parts are run to the correct production processes, perhaps with extra venting, your cosmetic issues will be resolved.

i vote for sending this guy to China. Maybe along with MWeston.

 

[Jumpman]

Agreed!


Chris

 

[droneb]

OMG, as long as you pay the tickets, hotel and other expenses i bet no one is going there.

they have stated several times its no use to send someone there

 

[verm71]

I have been designing plastic components for over 10 years now

i vote for sending this guy to China. Maybe along with MWeston.

<silliness>
I can see it now. We all pitch-in to buy Madcad77 and MWeston plane tickets to China (or a really big auger to drill through the Earth), the PayPal account gets suspended because it'll take more than 30 days to get enough money at this rate, then we won't know if Madcad77 and MWeston will arrive on a Friday or Monday because their tracking numbers aren't showing up on DHL's website. Then when they finally make it to China, their luggage has been lost and they can't get to their nice clean suits to visit the factory. So they're forced to show up in their REV2-like greasy T-shirts with rough edges, misaligned arm and neck ports and discoloured recycled denim jeans... in Two Months™.
</silliness>

 

[Monk]

OMG, as long as you pay the tickets, hotel and other expenses i bet no one is going there.

they have stated several times its no use to send someone there

They've siad the Pandora is made in America (no cheap Chinese rubbish HERE!), they've said the Pandora is NOT made in America (and, incidentally, that they've found a cheap Chinese factory to make the cases and keymats and TV-out cables, and another cheap Chinese factory to make the PCBs), they've said that Pandora will ship before Christmas. 2008 AND 2009. They've said "I'm pretty confident about July" and "I don't know why you'd cancel now, where we're so near to the end!" for over a year. They've said the rev 3 cases are a horrible insult AND that they are good enough for us.

It may well be that there is no point in sending anyone to China - but I'm unconvinced that "they said so" would prove that to me.

 

[Butterman]

OMG, as long as you pay the tickets, hotel and other expenses i bet no one is going there.

they have stated several times its no use to send someone there

They've siad the Pandora is made in America (no cheap Chinese rubbish HERE!), they've said the Pandora is NOT made in America (and, incidentally, that they've found a cheap Chinese factory to make the cases and keymats and TV-out cables, and another cheap Chinese factory to make the PCBs), they've said that Pandora will ship before Christmas. 2008 AND 2009. They've said "I'm pretty confident about July" and "I don't know why you'd cancel now, where we're so near to the end!" for over a year. They've said the rev 3 cases are a horrible insult AND that they are good enough for us.

It may well be that there is no point in sending anyone to China - but I'm unconvinced that "they said so" would prove that to me.

I thought the PCBs were made and populated in Texas?

 

[Trevsweb]

i think all the problems with the case might be plastic related. not so much the molds. looks fine (a bit off here and there) im hoping its just the recycled plastic cracking and not the final stuff.
finishing and silkcreening will sort any issues with scratching etc.

 

[droneb]

hey, dont take it against me, just do the math,
there are several options besides taking them to china, also im pretty sure there are several amounts of Plastic injection experts already there in china, not to say there are consultancy firms, and if they actually went there (MW) he would be spending all time on the hotel waiting because i dont thing they would allow him go right next to the injection machine to wait untill a acceptable case goes popped out. not to say he would need to hire a translator.

also theres CNY already here so he would end up crammed somewhere in his way to the factory (no train tickets) or taking a bus/shuttle into the place.
may i add that he would need also to know how to deal with chinese directly since they can be using any tricks to get him doing nearly nothing.

they could just hey we just made this case looks great and when he sees the rest of the batch end up like REV 3 cases. yes i've seen it happen in live, not in one of those lousy documentals with some brit crying out mean words every 3 seconds. (sorry all my brit friends im only talking about one).

at this point all we can expect and hope, is that FATIH actually knows what the hell is going on and get these cases done ASAP with desirable quality.

i really think Chinese wouldnt be that dumb to send overseas 7 cases with a huge crack and say they are good, theres gotta be some good answer to that.
either got damaged on shipping, cracked after bad cooling design (some days after while shipping), or maybe he did know that big huge crack was there and they are only checking about the requested last changes in order to start with real MP with real materials and finishing silkscreen and all.

 

[Monk]

They've ... said ... that they've found a cheap Chinese factory ... to make the PCBs

I thought the PCBs were made and populated in Texas?

It's an easy enough impression to get, but no. The PCBs are being populated in Texas, I believe, but they were actually made in China. The assembly company suggested the specific company that they used, and MWeston seemed happy with the results.

 

[senorgomez]

I suggest sending someone who speaks the language.

 

[CodeTwister]

i vote for sending this guy to China. Maybe along with MWeston.

I think people should stop complaining until we have exactly understood what happened. Neither the OP team nor the forum crowd knows enough about the moulding process, and the communication with the chinese factory is very limited.

The main problem is that we all expected to see final, finished cases. Therefore Michael Westons pictures are scaring a lot of people. Please don't forget that the cases have no finish and we have no idea how a "finished MP version" of them would look like. Instead of giving answers the pictures bring up more questions, and without the answers we simply can't complain.

Maybe the chinese factory expects that it is self-evident to the OP Team that these cases only show the mould enhancement and in no way a "final" case, and that the cracks are simply the result of a wrong setup. If you are used to work with experienced people, a lot of things remain unspoken. We all have to wait for answers.

 

[mali]

I think people should stop complaining until we have exactly understood what happened. Neither the OP team nor the forum crowd knows enough about the moulding process, and the communication with the chinese factory is very limited.

The main problem is that we all expected to see final, finished cases. Therefore Michael Westons pictures are scaring a lot of people. Please don't forget that the cases have no finish and we have no idea how a "finished MP version" of them would look like. Instead of giving answers the pictures bring up more questions, and without the answers we simply can't complain.

Maybe the chinese factory expects that it is self-evident to the OP Team that these cases only show the mould enhancement and in no way a "final" case, and that the cracks are simply the result of a wrong setup. If you are used to work with experienced people, a lot of things remain unspoken. We all have to wait for answers.

Good post

 

[Monk]

To further illustrate my point, here are some direct quotes.

All the test FDM CNC etc. cases were. But the moulds, well, China is the only place to do them right now. Everything else is done in the west.

The PCBs are being made in China (otherwise why would I even have brought up the holiday again?). The company in Texas makes nothing. They just put stuff together.

For clarity, all prototype PCBs were made by a company in California and they did a good job but they couldn't come close to the pricing we got for production in China and the assembler said the quality from this China company was about the best they have ever seen so we weren't going to argue with any of that!

Aside from the Case it's all USA.

And so on. Well, you get the picture.

 

[Kyo]

Yeah, I'm canceling my preorder. Thanks for all the fish.

Cancelling? Wait for the week and find out about their decision, that's what I'm gonna do.
If I feel that I dont want to wait longer, and they decide they want to spend time getting better molds, then I'll cancel.
Here's what I did in the meantime to ease the stress!

Bought a grey PSP-2000 on eBay for $AU145, good condition came with a cool case.
Hacked it with latest CFW. Installed web browsers, flash players, themes and homebrew games.
Also backed up the 6 games that came with it.
Bought a 8Gb card, loaded it with all the iso games, (22) homebrew games, (~400)music and (3)movies.
Right now just downloading new iso's (got 5, still searching for the other 8 I want).
It feels like I will have much more fun with this than Pandora (the huge library of games)
I think its benefits will outweigh the disadv (no 2nd Nub, no word processing--> i only word process on my laptop ne ways)

Eh, honestly I've had enough of their bull****. It's very apparent that Openpandora have no idea what the hell they are doing and I'm tired of hearing a prediction of a release date being smashed to the grounds every month for over a year now. I got this as a birthday present over a year ago and frankly I've had enough. No pandora for me. I got an iPod touch this christmas anyway, so whatever.

it's not just about the cases, it's about the whole way they do their business.


***Kyosys, you need to tone your language down, it's becoming tiresome. Please don't morph into a Gerald1/Silent One clone.***

Fine, i'm just gonna censor the word. Didn't think this was such a problem, seeing as how lulzfish has swear words in both his sig and usertitle, and no one seems to really mind. maybe it's just when they're used in a negative context against openpandora