A further update on preorders (18th of November 2012)

[skeezix]

Ed seems to listen to disruptive people like Skeezix, Notaz etc. who like nothing more then to simply encourage Ed to just say 'no' to me, not for the benefit of Ed or the Pandora project, but just because they don't like the existence of me - this is exceptionally disruptive and should not be happening.

And as usual, back to this.


These ungrateful people like notaz and skeezix who worked for hundreds or thousands of hours for free, how dare they Those bastards who supported the applications and device and answered trouble tickets and wrote code, just to spite Craig


No, I think ED is a big boy who makes his own decisions, as you are. Really, ED is more clever than I .. he's survived quite nicely, pulling in investors and so forth. Good for him.


Anythign yuo've asked for, I've tried to do in good faith; but you do tend to turn on people and now I'm rather sour (as I've publicly posted recently that I'm done with working wtih you. you do that to a man, you know.)


The evidence is simple -- how is it that fatih, notaz, myself, and most of the other devs, half the community etc, have all gotten upset with you? IF it was one or two people sure, but its quite a lot of people.


Oh, right, notaz' mind control.. he's gotten to us all!


No, the answer is simple .. the situation is _messed up_, and thats rough, and makes it hard on people.. mostly you and ED.) Its not time to throw fingers around, its time to man up and work through this, or get out if thats what you prefer. But you have to stop jerking around.. stop screwing with people. How big is the darned preorder queue(s), how much does ED need tro do for you? What can you do to keep going and improve?


You make people beg for answers to help you with. Come on dude, thats low.. no one owes you anything, you owe a lot of people everything, but you make people beg to help you.


Whatever. Anyway, a lot of us are through helping after these years, but lucky for you, some people liek ED are bigger men than me, they keep taking it


Help others to help you, for gods sake


jeff


Can't count how many times the last month or two I've thought to get off the boards.. I've got too much in RL with small kids, I don't need this But I stick around, I support my code, I do what I can for people in the time I have. I do my part.. do yours, you're the father of all this (and ED is the mother?

 

[TrashyMG]

Notaz has mind control... it all makes sense now..

 

[palstyo]

Can't count how many times the last month or two I've thought to get off the boards.. I've got too much in RL with small kids, I don't need this But I stick around, I support my code, I do what I can for people in the time I have. I do my part.. do yours, you're the father of all this (and ED is the mother?

Yes


Please don't leave us, we really need you

 

[Yoyobuae]

Have you guys considered having video call like once a week or every two week? Talking to someone face to face does wonders to clear up misunderstandings.


Email, chat, forums are quite convenient, but they only allow text. These forms of communication are totally emotionless and makes it very easy to misinterpret each other. Not to mention the slow back and forth make it difficult and slow to have a dialog.


Give it a try at least, you'll probably like it.

 

[Mr_Loon]

But with the current joke that is openpandora.org I don't believe I can sell many units, the website is just too horrible to encourage decent sales

@ Craig : There is nothing / nobody stopping you getting the new website up and running for OP Ltd and then Drop Shipping the units sold as per above.


As far as I see it you don't need 3rd party approval to set up a website selling Pandoras via OP Ltd, it's baffling to me what has prevented you from doing this.


What you do need to do is Pay ED what you owe for the 1Ghz units & then fulfil your 1Ghz pre orders, when this is done a general look at a more sensible pricing level for 1Ghz units can be undertaken. Thereby increasing sales & profits.


As I've stated before by not promptly fulfilling the 1 Ghz pre orders you leave a sword of Damocles hanging over the project, as ED will know that any price reduction will just lead to mass cancellations from your queue and likely bankruptcy for OP Ltd.

 

[vcoleiro1]

Didn't the money for those 70 - 1 ghz orders with Craig go into unexpected refunds?. That was my understanding.

 

[Galaxis]

I understand what's keeping the price up at this time is the attempt to save Craig (or more precisely, Craig's customers).


My personal opinion on this:


ED, as long as you don't even know the extent of this problem (how many open orders Craig has), this is futile, and it will be a neverending story. You absolutely have to know the details to be able to make a decision. It could well be that Craig is sitting on so many orders that it turns out impossible to save the situation anyway. But if you can't get precise information from him, you can't even make a plan - and then it's time to just plan for yourself and try to get out of this whole mess somehow.

 

[b_o_b]

Ed seems to listen to disruptive people like Skeezix, Notaz etc. who like nothing more then to simply encourage Ed to just say 'no' to me, not for the benefit of Ed or the Pandora project, but just because they don't like the existence of me - this is exceptionally disruptive and should not be happening.

Maybe you should have listened a bit more to Skeezix and Notaz too


I don't like the all against one approach and this is like convincing someone grass is green and not blue. If he sees blue it will never change to green.


Time to end the marriage, file for divorce and make sure it will not turn into a mess.

 

[quartercast]

I own a bar-restaurant in Amsterdam. I have an office next to it. I can offer privacy, food and drink. That will be my donation.


There is a new Easyhotel at 1 minute walking (affordable and brand new and clean) and I can pick the guys up from the airport.


They need facetime, this much is obvious.

The trip from Newcastle looks quite nice, it involves a ferry ride to NL


http://maps.google.com.au/maps?saddr=newcastle-upon-tyne&daddr=ingolstadt&hl=en&sll=51.87196,4.90196&sspn=7.069083,23.269043&geocode=FczmRgMdjFDn_ynNZG8MfoV9SDGRYadysFLiCw%3BFUce6AId2leuACm7CjaIUf6eRzHqinQTIn5d7A&dirflg=w&mra=ltm&t=m&z=6

 

[Abanest]

Well judging by Craig's head-in-the-sand responses he is certainly not interested in trying to work with anyone to resolve this problem... "It's everyone else's fault but mine!"


Nothing is going to move forward here until he can pull his head out of his arse, lick his wounds, and move forward with the rest of us.


Craig: I keep reading solutions/ideas from Ed and other members here. I think it's time to start paying attention mate and get over yourself.


Edit: Good grief, Tapatalk is a stupid app.

 

[bismuthdrummer]

...


Here you go. As a reminder for everyone: Here is the new website in its current state.


Here were the few changes I requested:


1. On contact page: Add a link to the ticket system. It's already online for a while, but shows "tbc @ op (ticket system here)".


2. While the focus should be on the 1GHz unit, there should also be information about the other units. Somewhere.


3. Add a page where we can offer the latest instruction manual and firmware for download. Maybe change the structure of the old one as a portal to provide more in-depth information and link to that from the new website.


I would've ignored the first three and put it online anyways (we could've worked on those and included that later), but there was one major issue which hasn't been changed yet.


That is the "Order" page.


It shows a nice "Choose your location" screen which is neat - but when you click it, the trouble starts.


My suggestion was to show the different distributors and shops for the various Pandoras we offer and link to them (i.e. ithic.com for Rebirth Pandoras, etc.)


This would be the professional way.


Right now, if you click on Mainland Europe, it directs directly to my shop (www.dragonbox.de) without telling the user that he's being directed to a different website.


Not sure how legal that is, but the main issue is the following:


When you click on any of the other locations, you can order directly on the website.


The website is registered on my company, yet orders placed there are being done through your company without letting the user know.


This is a legal issue. I would take the full responsibility for your orders placed there, as I own the site and you never leave it.


...


Fix it and I'll bring it online immediately.

Craig, can you please fix this or find someone to fix it?

 

[Abanest]

I love the look at that new website. Yes, definitely get that thing fixed and put up live!

 

[chosen]

New site needs platform/browser testing in Linux/Firefox possibly more. Looks like it needs a CSS tweak to font-size, perhaps use a CSS reset file?

 

[zounder1]

First off, thank you for replying to me Craig and taking the time to explain your position.


On a positive note, I think you are ok with Ed drop shipping your orders directly as long as you feel your frustration with other issues are dealt with? (Correct me if I am wrong, I am NOT trying to put words in your mouth here.)


As for you issues I think the two biggest issues you have are:


1) Not doing what was agreed to. Specifically not receiving units from Ed promptly..


I'll tackle this one and I'm not sure you will like my opinion. But the problem with the unpaid 1GHz units shipped to you from Ed has unfortunately changed the situation; Ed it rightly concerned about sending anything to you without payment now. I understand you are going through a horrible cash flow situation but Ed is also managing cash on his end. And it probably looks like Ed is controlling things now more than to you liking.


On a positive note, I believe that Ed said he expects to be able to start shipping those units to you some time in December if his sales continue at a good pace. You won't receives units as quickly as you want I suspect, but I think Ed is willing to do that. And remember that is in spite of you still owing him money on those 1Ghz units. That is from my point of view Ed handing you a very nice olive branch with that offer. I think you should consider it and I would like you to agree to this as a workable but truly crappy situation for both parties.


2) The website.


Ok, you want the website up. Ed has expressed some changes that need to be done before that can happen. I think Ed's requests seem reasonable and not too hard to implement?


Now some honest questions:


Are you willing to allow someone else to help do these changes for you?


There are likely some folks on this board with the skills required to do this final changes required. I know you like to control things tightly, but I think you need someone to help you with this. This is on the assumption that you are too busy or don't want to do the changes from Ed. But they need to be done and Ed is willing to put the site live ASAP if they are done.


If you don't want to show the code, I can likely find a NDA that anyone working on the site would need to sign first. I know this is taking a leap of faith, but you can make NDA's pretty clear on you retaining ownership and full rights to the code of the site you created. You can't NDA the visible content on the site just the backend.


If you are not willing to delegate these changes then you need to find the time to make the changes requested. (And then the launch of the new site is dictated by you.) But maybe there is some issue with the requested changes so my next question;


Are you somehow in disagreement about the changes that Ed wants done?


Are there technical issues that make the changes hard? Is there something requested that is making you not want to do the work to finish the website? Be honest here. (And other folks on this board, please just listen rather than belittle any issue Craig may have here. I am very impressed he answered my earlier question and I am trying to broker a way to get things moving here.)


Again, thanks for replying to my question.


You will notice I am not going to address your frustration with other parties influencing Ed's decision making. I simply won't address jabs and complaints about parties on this forum. If you can keep those frustrations in check publicly I think it will help. In exchange for that from you, I also will STRONGLY ask that folks here check their emotions too. I think there has been enough venting of built up frustration here (myself included) and it is time to work towards a solution.


So Craig, hopefully you can answer my questions above. Explain your concerns and thoughts on how to get the website up. I know you are frustrated with Ed the website is not up yet - I know I am it looks nice.


Please discuss.

 

[Gotham]

This is ridiculous. I regret ever getting involved with this project. Thanks, Craig.

 

[skeezix]

/thread before it gets nastier?

 

[elwing]

lol, once more some bashing, poor excuse and NO INFORMATION on your queue.... that's so nice.


and you even go as far as calling other people disruptive? that would be so funny in other circumstances...


about the website:


it looks great, but I can't understand why only 1GHz unit are mentioned, they are too costly for the vast majority of the people while you might sell a few 600MHz units to theses peoples...

 

[vcoleiro1]

Must admit this makes me nervous about the ICP2.

 

[SoleGrave]

Ed seems to listen to disruptive people like Skeezix, Notaz etc. who like nothing more then to simply encourage Ed to just say 'no' to me, not for the benefit of Ed or the Pandora project, but just because they don't like the existence of me - this is exceptionally disruptive and should not be happening.

And as usual, back to this.


These ungrateful people like notaz and skeezix who worked for hundreds or thousands of hours for free, how dare they Those bastards who supported the applications and device and answered trouble tickets and wrote code, just to spite Craig


No, I think ED is a big boy who makes his own decisions, as you are. Really, ED is more clever than I .. he's survived quite nicely, pulling in investors and so forth. Good for him.


Anythign yuo've asked for, I've tried to do in good faith; but you do tend to turn on people and now I'm rather sour (as I've publicly posted recently that I'm done with working wtih you. you do that to a man, you know.)


The evidence is simple -- how is it that fatih, notaz, myself, and most of the other devs, half the community etc, have all gotten upset with you? IF it was one or two people sure, but its quite a lot of people.


Oh, right, notaz' mind control.. he's gotten to us all!


No, the answer is simple .. the situation is _messed up_, and thats rough, and makes it hard on people.. mostly you and ED.) Its not time to throw fingers around, its time to man up and work through this, or get out if thats what you prefer. But you have to stop jerking around.. stop screwing with people. How big is the darned preorder queue(s), how much does ED need tro do for you? What can you do to keep going and improve?


You make people beg for answers to help you with. Come on dude, thats low.. no one owes you anything, you owe a lot of people everything, but you make people beg to help you.


Whatever. Anyway, a lot of us are through helping after these years, but lucky for you, some people liek ED are bigger men than me, they keep taking it


Help others to help you, for gods sake


jeff


Can't count how many times the last month or two I've thought to get off the boards.. I've got too much in RL with small kids, I don't need this But I stick around, I support my code, I do what I can for people in the time I have. I do my part.. do yours, you're the father of all this (and ED is the mother?

Indeed. You cannot bite the hand that feeds you and when you do, you get slapped hard.

 

[ekianjo]

Must admit this makes me nervous about the ICP2.

Yeah, good luck for those who ordered this. I'm sure Craig will have many excuses and people to blame for delays