The Pyra is crying!

[pmprog]

Elw3: Want the non-paying job?

Couldn't you just write a script that repackaged it? Transfering the programs over would be easy enough (Mount, then Re-squashfs or whatever), parsing PXML is easy enough.

 

[bzar]

If you need to recompile it for hardfloat it's not that simple.

 

[pmprog]

If you need to recompile it for hardfloat it's not that simple.

True, but things that are scripted (Shell script/Zenity/Python) or have a common runtime (Java/Mono) could quickly be rebatched. I'm not sure what percentage of PNDs are like this though

 

[ptitSeb]

As far as I'm concerned, most Java/Mono/Python games are also using native libs, that need to be recompiled too.

 

[CFWhitman]

Well, besides the theoretically possible switch of architectures that TrashyMG mentioned (and he is correct about the implications), it depends on how the software is packaged/installed. PND packages like we use on the Pandora would transfer fine. Packages that you installed from apt-get would end up on the eMMC, and so would have to be re-installed.

Incidentally, it's also possible that a newer generation ARM chip could create issues, but they would most likely be confined to system files and not likely to affect things like games. Of course, programs compiled for the new architecture generation would most likely make more efficient use of it.

PNDs will NOT transfer fine as they're soft float instead of hard float and are stuck with libraries that were built in from years ago. There's also the fact that the PND system isn't going to be implemented into the PyraOS because of all this.

DBP is now the new standard and it's based on Open Desktop which is already built for purpose.

Well, apparently there have been some developments with packaging that I wasn't yet aware of. Thanks for mentioning DBP.

My not being aware of the new package format is probably responsible for the confusion. I didn't mean PNDs from the Pandora. I want to make it clear that I wasn't saying that Pandora packages would work in the Pyra without modification (though it would be theoretically possible for some to do so if PND were still supported). I was talking about transferring programs between the first CPU board and the theoretical second CPU board (which is what the question was about). I hadn't realized that the PND system was being superseded by a new one (DBP).

I also don't expect the Pyra to ever use soft float libraries, so I thought we were going to be past that particular problem. However, in principle something like that could come up again which could theoretically be sidestepped in most cases by bundling libraries in the package.

 

[Rockthesmurf]

A potential release plan:

• Make a low spec Pyra
• Take money
• Don't deliver
• Up the specs
• Make people queue
• Tell people they can get it quicker if they pay a premium fee
• Take the fee
• Don't deliver
• Up the specs
• Buy a 3D printer
• Say the new model costs more, and anyone buying it has highest priority, allow people to pay more money to get it quicker with a premium fee
• Take more money
• Make a few units, send them off
• Any complaints just delete them from the order queue, leave the scene, silently wrap up the company

It is a proven strategy.

 

[Grench]

A potential release plan:

Spoiler

• Make a low spec Pyra
• Take money
• Don't deliver
• Up the specs
• Make people queue
• Tell people they can get it quicker if they pay a premium fee
• Take the fee
• Don't deliver
• Up the specs
• Buy a 3D printer
• Say the new model costs more, and anyone buying it has highest priority, allow people to pay more money to get it quicker with a premium fee
• Take more money
• Make a few units, send them off
• Any complaints just delete them from the order queue, leave the scene, silently wrap up the company

Spoiler

It is a proven strategy.

And why so many people feel the need to taint the forums of the current project with repeated odes to the past project and the antics of he who should not be named is puzzling at best.

This isn't that project.  This won't become that project.  That person is not involved in this project.  You're scaring the tourists.

 

[FaeMinx]

There should be a way to make posts that are only visible to veteran forum members.


It's a shame poking fun at he who shall not be named is such a potentially dangerous pastime... afterall, his antics are certainly meme worthy in this community - right up there with two months. Hell, his antics *inspired* two months...

 

[Grench]

There should be a way to make posts that are only visible to veteran forum members.


It's a shame poking fun at he who shall not be named is such a potentially dangerous pastime... afterall, his antics are certainly meme worthy in this community - right up there with two months. Hell, his antics *inspired* two months...

And my favorite:  "What's your order number!?!?"

 

[Luke-Jr]

The downside is it increases power consumption a lot (and power consumption is already on the high side since it's not a low-power DDR technology)

Linux supports memory hotplug - is it possible to get this working for the Pyra maybe?

And I would suggest to make two models of the Pyra, a cheap base model and a more expensive premium model.

Features of the base model:

- 4GB (or maybe 8GB) fast eMMC, enough to install a decent base OS (after all that's still much larger than the Pandora NAND), but not much spare room

- no 3/4G

- wifi with 2.4GHz only

- cheaper than the premium model (e.g. 450 EUR)

Features of the premium model:

- 16GB (or maybe 32GB or even 64GB) fastest-possible eMMC

- 3/4G module

- wifi with 2.4GHz and 5GHz channels

- all other tech specs identical to the base model

- 250 EUR more expensive than the base model (e.g. 700 EUR)

This is just a completely made-up proposal, and just my personal opinion.

I would personally want to get the premium model, but I think it's good to have a more affordable option that still has all the essential features, in particular for people who intend to still use a phone or tablet as primary internet device. Or if you're mostly interested in retro-gaming/emulation, then there's no need for lots of internal storage and fancy internet options.

I'd go for the premium model too, but I'd really like to see the RAM upgraded on it... if memory hotplug is workable, 8 GB would be ideal

 

[Rockthesmurf]

@Gench you are probably right; just having a little fun; but wouldn't want to scare anyone away!

 

[FaeMinx]

The downside is it increases power consumption a lot (and power consumption is already on the high side since it's not a low-power DDR technology)

Linux supports memory hotplug - is it possible to get this working for the Pyra maybe?

And I would suggest to make two models of the Pyra, a cheap base model and a more expensive premium model.


Features of the base model:


- 4GB (or maybe 8GB) fast eMMC, enough to install a decent base OS (after all that's still much larger than the Pandora NAND), but not much spare room


- no 3/4G


- wifi with 2.4GHz only


- cheaper than the premium model (e.g. 450 EUR)


Features of the premium model:


- 16GB (or maybe 32GB or even 64GB) fastest-possible eMMC


- 3/4G module


- wifi with 2.4GHz and 5GHz channels


- all other tech specs identical to the base model


- 250 EUR more expensive than the base model (e.g. 700 EUR)


This is just a completely made-up proposal, and just my personal opinion.


I would personally want to get the premium model, but I think it's good to have a more affordable option that still has all the essential features, in particular for people who intend to still use a phone or tablet as primary internet device. Or if you're mostly interested in retro-gaming/emulation, then there's no need for lots of internal storage and fancy internet options.

I'd go for the premium model too, but I'd really like to see the RAM upgraded on it... if memory hotplug is workable, 8 GB would be ideal

I personally would have been very happy with 4GB.


I'm sure the 2GB will take us far... but I intend to use the Pyra as my primary computing device, and 2GB to do heavy graphics work has me concerned.


we shall wait and see

 

[Caine]

And why so many people feel the need to taint the forums of the current project with repeated odes to the past project and the antics of he who should not be named is puzzling at best.

This isn't that project.  This won't become that project.  That person is not involved in this project.  You're scaring the tourists.

It just takes one look at the service that ED has provided and still does provide (beyond the call of duty) to Craig's customers to see just how different this project is.

Why he should not be named is beyond me. His name is Craig, he fucked up and screwed over a lot of customers.

 

[FaeMinx]

^ It was a further jest likening Craig to 'The Dark Lord'...


Yes, all it takes is one look to see the vast difference between how things are run under our saviour ED, and how 'he who shall not be named' managed things.


But one look is often one look too many to ask of a bumbling tourist. We know how the internet works...

 

[Xcl4m4t10n]

Returning to the on-topic, ED tell us yesterday this on Twitter:

Nikolaus receives some CPU board with replaced memory chips on and will test it tonight. Wish a like for a working prototype!

So maybe we have some news soon .

 

[Caine]

So maybe we have some news soon .

We do:

RAM is not yet working properly - but the Debug output is different. Either it has a broken trace OR the bootloader needs an update.

<edit>

The #Pyra BOOTS! Nikolaus successfully booted up a kernel on the devboard! We're getting there!

Woohoo!!! The next milestone. This is great news.

</edit>

 

[Luke-Jr]

I personally would have been very happy with 4GB.

I'm sure the 2GB will take us far... but I intend to use the Pyra as my primary computing device, and 2GB to do heavy graphics work has me concerned.

4 GB is far too little for primary computing device IMO.My desktop has 16 GB and I'm constantly swapping it to 24-25 GB.

Maybe 2 GB will be sufficient for my intended use (VNC + minimal local stuff like Uber), but the more the better IMO...

 

[Wally]

I personally would have been very happy with 4GB.


I'm sure the 2GB will take us far... but I intend to use the Pyra as my primary computing device, and 2GB to do heavy graphics work has me concerned.

4 GB is far too little for primary computing device IMO.
My desktop has 16 GB and I'm constantly swapping it to 24-25 GB.


Maybe 2 GB will be sufficient for my intended use (VNC + minimal local stuff like Uber), but the more the better IMO...

I totally disagree, 4GB is more than enough (intact it's mostly standard these days as 2GB chips are cheap as chips now!) 16GB is only useful if you have super high resolution demanding games or are intending on running Memory Leaking browsers like Google Chrome.

If ED gets 8GB that probably would do us fine but seeing the CPU board can be upgraded at any time the amount of memory can change to suit the future chipsets

 

[TrashyMG]

I personally would have been very happy with 4GB.


I'm sure the 2GB will take us far... but I intend to use the Pyra as my primary computing device, and 2GB to do heavy graphics work has me concerned.

4 GB is far too little for primary computing device IMO.
My desktop has 16 GB and I'm constantly swapping it to 24-25 GB.


Maybe 2 GB will be sufficient for my intended use (VNC + minimal local stuff like Uber), but the more the better IMO...

Windows user? I have yet to use more than 1GB on the devboard even with a heavy amount of multi-tasking. Not sure what graphic work you plan on doing, but I think you will run into CPU loading issues before the memory becomes a problem.

Edit: For my typical Linux gaming/desktop I still don't think I needed 4GB let alone the 8GB...

 

[WizardStan]

My desktop has 16 GB and I'm constantly swapping it to 24-25 GB

HOLY CARP :blink: What are you doing that you consider "normal" to use that much? I've got 8GB and the only time it ever hits swap is when I open up 50+ tabs in Chromium.

Even non-"normal" stuff like compiling massive projects or loading large models in Blender generally stay below 4GB.