Reality Check - Would you really pre-order on a KS?

[_wb_]

I'd prefer a situation where the P2 at some point is simply available for purchase and immediate shipping (no preorder queue).

Of course there will be a big initial cost to get production started, but instead of covering that via some third-party like KS, maybe it's a better idea that the existing community members provide ED with loans to cover those costs; the loans would be for example at 0% or low interest, with a specified payback date, and with a partial payback in one or more P2 units instead of in money. If the loan equals the selling price of a P2 then this is essentially the same as a preorder, but I suppose some of us could afford to give ED a (much) bigger loan than that, while others might be able only to afford a small loan, lower than the P2 selling price, which means they basically pay part of their P2 in advance and the rest when it is available. I think ED's reputation is good enough to attract a significant sum this way; the rest he could get from the bank (at nonzero interest, but if planned well and the community loan is big enough to cover most of the early costs, the loan could be quite short-term) and/or by getting GC to start production and get paid only when the units are sold.

I wouldn't overestimate the extra marketing kickstarter gives - many news-sites are tired of the endless "yet another KS project" stuff so putting it on KS can also be counterproductive, and in the end we'll mostly have to spread the word ourselves anyway.

 

[Super Roach]

I'd back it straight away.

But I'm not going to be unrealistic and say 720p screen!  and whatnot. Each part needs to play into itself. For example, the perf upgrade of 720p will make emulation much harder unless there is a perfect hardware scaler which runs at a lower res anyway. Part of the reason for the excellent emulation on the OP besides its processor is the Screen gives its well matched hardware and plenty big battery a lot of breathing room.

 

[vcoleiro1]

Depending on specs, price, os, configuration and who ran the project I would consider it.


In regards to KS, I think that's the best way to go, the x percent cut that is taken is well worth it for the marketing it provides and much needed new customers it would bring.

 

[Franko]

Yeah, I think that the Kickstarter approach is also the way to go.  _wb_ really hit on a great point - the EXPOSURE that the product will get.  That may be the biggest bonus of them all (to the OP Team).  5 years after the initial Pandora was released and we still are fighting that problem.  We don't have the advertising dollars, and ED is trying to get units out to the right type of reviewers, but mostly this product is reliant upon word of mouth.  Hoping that people will put in the right keywords in a Google search is also helping I guess...   :rolleyes:  

Kickstarter for me...

 

[konqithedragon]

The name of the project would really have to be different tho.

From a marketing point of view calling it "Pandora 2" would be a bad idea..

Past issues would probably have to be addressed and explained in an honest concise way.. otherwise you'll get loads of people saying "lol this is going to take another 5 years".

 

[Franko]

The name of the project would really have to be different tho.

From a marketing point of view calling it "Pandora 2" would be a bad idea..

Past issues would probably have to be addressed and explained in an honest concise way.. otherwise you'll get loads of people saying "lol this is going to take another 5 years".

I agree.  First off, the OP Team should strive to be in the black and have at least fulfilled all of the outstanding preorders.  Only then would it be a good idea to take on this project.  Secondly, the OP Team might have to distance itself somewhat from the mistakes of the past.  A new product name and stressing where and who is running a "P2" project now would help the credibility problem.  This may unfortunately mean that this is where Craig and the project may have to separate - man, I really hate speculating in this stuff - it gets a bit dicey here, but I her what you're saying, lemondragon (about the whole "past issues" thing) at any rate...

 

[zapman]

I'm missing the option "No, if Craig is involved. Otherwiese: Yes"

that would be my choice

 

[xiongxioi]

The name of the project would really have to be different tho.

From a marketing point of view calling it "Pandora 2" would be a bad idea..

Past issues would probably have to be addressed and explained in an honest concise way.. otherwise you'll get loads of people saying "lol this is going to take another 5 years".

I agree.  First off, the OP Team should strive to be in the black and have at least fulfilled all of the outstanding preorders.  Only then would it be a good idea to take on this project.  Secondly, the OP Team might have to distance itself somewhat from the mistakes of the past.  A new product name and stressing where and who is running a "P2" project now would help the credibility problem.  This may unfortunately mean that this is where Craig and the project may have to separate - man, I really hate speculating in this stuff - it gets a bit dicey here, but I her what you're saying, lemondragon (about the whole "past issues" thing) at any rate...

With all due respect I disagree with you.

First of all, changing the name will not fool any one. Unless there are stupid people around who will buy a $500 electronic without doing any research. 

Secondly, Pandora's name is well known, just not many people paid money for it. Because it was first announced back in 2008 or even earlier, so people would think it is dated. There are not as many people as you would presume that are involved in Pandora's crush landing. Many of the potential customers that want to buy pandoras does not have it. So, by keeping the name, will help the marketing. I will state as many times as needed that only us that are running around the forum a lot will care about who to deliver P2. For an outsider, they don't care, as long as its done in a timely fashion. So kicking Craigix out, and changing the name is not that good of an idea once you think about it. We need more rational reasons to make that decision. Like, pandora is copyrighted by Craigix, or Craigix will make P2 into another bloody android UMPC with battery time like 2 hours and will fail to deliver the product on time.

Thirdly, the pandora team does not have that much cash kicking around. If they can get an extra like 50k euros, they will be able to ship the original pandoras much more quickly. So, by starting that kick starter will help funding the original pandora. From what I know, pandora team does not have much more income other than ED's little shop and the sale of ICP (which is not a lot).

Last but not least, making pandora 2 helps bring in new wonderful people ( I know most people are uneducated bullies), and keep the community going strong. If we can have something that can rival the project shield and still has 10 hours of battery time, then we can speak out to the entire world how pandora does and nvidon't. Right now, even pandora has dated really well, people can still bash it for its processing power and inablility to play youtube or something. If we are to make it, we should make it good and fast. 

 

[Neelix]

With all due respect I disagree with you.

First of all, changing the name will not fool any one. Unless there are stupid people around who will buy a $500 electronic without doing any research. 

The point isn't to fool anyone.   The point is to get past the kneejerk reaction of an immediate dismissal based on the product name and the past reputation.    If we can get them to the point of actually doing the research, then they will find both the bad and the good, see how the project was recovered,  and be able to make an informed decision.     If, on the other hand a potential customer sees,  "Pandora"  and doesn't pursue it because of preconceptions based on the name,  then that potential customer is lost.

I'm not saying we should completely disassociate,  and I think It makes sense to keep the OpenPandora brand,   but the product name should be something new. 

- Neelix

 

[Binky]

Don't forget the danger that people will think that the name change is a sneaky cover-up of a attempt to repeat the original preorder "scam"

 

[Neelix]

I'm not suggesting a coverup.  If done correctly there would be no reason for anyone to assume that was the case.   I'm suggesting that just like Microsoft doesn't call all it's products windows,  there's no reason for all OpenPandora products to be called Pandora.  

- Neelix

 

[xiongxioi]

With all due respect I disagree with you.

First of all, changing the name will not fool any one. Unless there are stupid people around who will buy a $500 electronic without doing any research. 

The point isn't to fool anyone.   The point is to get past the kneejerk reaction of an immediate dismissal based on the product name and the past reputation.    If we can get them to the point of actually doing the research, then they will find both the bad and the good, see how the project was recovered,  and be able to make an informed decision.     If, on the other hand a potential customer sees,  "Pandora"  and doesn't pursue it because of preconceptions based on the name,  then that potential customer is lost.

I'm not saying we should completely disassociate,  and I think It makes sense to keep the OpenPandora brand,   but the product name should be something new. 

- Neelix

We can't really control what people would see in their researches. If they don't have P1, its hard to understand what P2's all about. In fact, from my experience, if some one feels some sort of grudge against something, their research will be really one sided. They are more likely to over look many of the pros and focus on the cons. So, if they have a "kneejerk reaction", is more likely that they would continue to hate on P2 for no better reasons.

If we are to make pandora 2 kickstarted, we should help these simpletons by doing their researches for them, ie: by just state everything on the up front. Including what pandora has gone through, what pandora is capable of, what measures we are to take to make P2's production smoothier, we should rule out any chance in hell that haters could still putting out half truth and trying to ruin us. 

 

[vcoleiro1]

Yeah, I also think it shouldn't be called Pandora.  Brand erosion is a massive thing  to overcome.  Is it sneaky to call it something else, I don't think so.  ED, with a new company and setup is as far removed from the P1 as needed IMO to call it something new.  ie even if people did the research they would only find he wasn't the guy that started the P1 and wasn't involved with anything negative with it.

Imagine trying to launch a product called the Phantom 2 - that's about the luck you would get with the Pandora 2.  Everytime I mention the Pandora on other forums its the same reaction - and its not a good one. 

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

^^^^^^theres a phantom 2? Yipeee.what about pandora illusion?is it real?throw down some money and find out.it could make a very nice retirement present for oneself.lol

 

[WizardStan]

Yeah, I don't think anyone ever actually thought it should be named "Pandora 2", that's just a working title until we all agree to go with the OpenWally.

 

[xiongxioi]

^^^^^^theres a phantom 2? Yipeee.what about pandora illusion?is it real?throw down some money and find out.it could make a very nice retirement present for oneself.lol

Lol.

Pandora team is not doing too poorly, I think.

At least ED is doing his best to fill in the gaps, if ED would rather just start a new product and company, he could just say F it, and leave all Craigix's pre-order customers to rot. 

People wouldnn't find out, right? I think all of the team's struggle should mean something. 

 

[xiongxioi]

Yeah, I don't think anyone ever actually thought it should be named "Pandora 2", that's just a working title until we all agree to go with the OpenWally.

OpenWally sounds so good, but I think capcom will sue us.

If we need to make this, let there be day 1 dlcs and on machine dlcs. Like 5 bucks to change your wallpaper, and 2 bucks to turn on the keyboard backlight. 20 bucks to access the repo. 

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

^^^^^^yeah sure eds a good guy and i dont think he will rest till all pre orders are filled.personally id buy a p2 made by craig or ed.time will tell as to what happens

The wizard? As per stans name.

 

[Franko]

Whatever the OP Team decides to do, it obviously won't change the past and rewrite history.  Nor will it be hidden from inquisitive people.  I'm not delusional here.  ED has already restored quite a bit of credibility (IMO) to the Pandora brand name with his tireless efforts.  He's making us all proud.  I just think that a different name to the next generation of console can only help matters.  Of course people will find out about the Pandora's past, but if things continue on at it's current rate, ED will have gotten the Pandora out of it's current predicament in a year or two's time.  Prospective customers will see who is behind the project AND it's resurrection, and where the stable production is happening.  I'm just thinking of several factors and what might help the OP Team's ability to sell more unit's of the next generation of "Pandora".  And like always...it's just this gnome's opinion...

^^^^^^yeah sure eds a good guy and i dont think he will rest till all pre orders are filled.personally id buy a p2 made by craig or ed.time will tell as to what happens

The wizard? As per stans name.

Hhhmmm... maybe I should have gone with "WizardFranko" as my profile name...

 

[xiongxioi]

And like always...it's just this gnome's opinion...

How dares a gnome to have his own opinions? Go back to stand in gardens and get pissed on by dogs and cats. 

In all seriousness, I personally would like to have P2 asap. Pandora is all great and such, but the spongy keyboard and its awful good-for-nothing wifi have made the machine quite useless. 

Maybe there should be a pandora 1.7 or something, with good wifi and better keyboard.