Reality Check - Would you really pre-order on a KS?

[EssoAir]

Wow. Ok. Welcome to "derailed thread central"


(yes I realize I contributed to this)


Might I suggest a discussion about a P2 kickstarter? That seems more relevant.

 

[Binky]

I doubt ED would take 18 Months to start production from a fully-working kickstarter prototype - should the poll be changed?

 

[EssoAir]

I bet it would be less than 6 months after the kickstarter before every backer had a P2 in their hands

 

[rohezal]

Remember kickstarter needs some time (i think it wasa month or more) before they give the money to project. But ED said, GC trusts him, so it wouldn't be a delay I think.

 

[WizardStan]

A number of kickstarter projects have also used their successful campaigns to secure loans so they can start production before the funds clear.

 

[fusion_power]

"Pandora 2"? Yes but $500? No.

I'd say 250€ for a P2, so much more people can afford one, which brings more money at the end.  And I don't mean to cut the corners just because the Handheld costs only 250€.  I guess there is alot of room for optimizing the entire design/production process. We should not forget, the major costs of the Pandora 1 are because of all the delays and false promises, incapable third party companies etc...

If these issues can avoided, the P2 really could be cheaper than the P1 and still much much better.

 

[Franko]

^ I think that (price) is just unrealistic.  The production costs for the Pandora 1 as it is right now is around that figure.  The costs for cutting edge tech parts probably won't be any cheaper than what they are sourcing now (for the P1).  Maybe a huge company with massive resources might be able to pull it off, if they can sell hundreds of thousands of units, but I don't really see that happening here.  For all that we seem to be demanding - as Pandora consumers - in a future product, $500 seems about right to me.  Don't you want the OP Team to make at least a small profit?

 

[DAP]

If there is one thing Pandora taught me it is this: NEVER PREORDER. Pay 3 times & wait more than 2 years is not an experience I wish to repeat.

I'll wait until they are shipping this time.

 

[_wb_]

I'm fine with any CPU architecture, x86 or ARM or whatever. The single most important thing is perf/W, and to some extent price and availability. Compatibility with closed-source binaries is something I don't care about at all - it would be nice if Pandora 1 PNDs work without emulation, but that's not absolutely necessary since about everything in the repo can be recompiled quite easily (you would lose assembler optimizations though). I don't care at all about being able to install Windows natively on a Pandora 2, that is something I wouldn't want to do.

In terms of price: I think $500 is quite cheap for a mini-laptop. You can pay way more for a decent normal laptop, and although that one will have better performance, it lacks features like super battery life, being a handheld (pocketable, no need to bring a backpack), dual SD slots, built-in gaming controls, etc.

 

[ShleeDragon]

I think the $500 for great is better than $400 for less than.

 

[klapse]

Those numbers are completely imaginary. It could end up costing considerably more than $500.

 

[EssoAir]

Those numbers are completely imaginary. It could end up costing considerably more than $500.

Or it could cost considerably less. The fear of a high cost is irrelevent until we know exactly what's going in it

 

[Franko]

Those numbers are completely imaginary. It could end up costing considerably more than $500.

Hopefully not.  What I'm suggesting is that this "imaginary" price point seems to be a good one (IMO) to shoot for.  A "sweet spot" for the OP Team in general, considering what they have charged (in the past for the varying generations of the Pandora 1) and what most people might be willing to pay for a niche device like this.  Obviously $300-$350 isn't going to cut it - the OP Team already tried that and considering what they have to pay for parts and such, that's just not leaving them any room for error(s).  Take away ALL mistakes of the past - no need to go into them at this point - that still would leave the OP Team no wiggle room, and there are inherent costs that us as consumers don't see.  Replacing defective parts/units under warranty.  Administrative costs...repairs, labor...server and bandwidth costs for running this website and hosting the Repo which allows us to download great software for free.


Big companies (like Sony, Apple, etc) can have a lower price point for their hardware, because they can make money in other areas.  I like the idea of not being charged extra for certain games and applications.  That's a rare thing nowadays.  We need to support this project with our open minds as well as our wallets.  $500 dollars for what sort of value you get for a Pandora 2?  If it's better than the first one, then I'm throwing my money at the OP Team.  I'll even do a Kickstarter pledge...but I'm not so sure of a blind pre-ordering thing.  I'm confident that this Team knows what to do now.  They have my business and for any foreseeable future.

 

[Grench]

I'm fine with any CPU architecture, x86 or ARM or whatever. The single most important thing is perf/W, and to some extent price and availability. Compatibility with closed-source binaries is something I don't care about at all - it would be nice if Pandora 1 PNDs work without emulation, but that's not absolutely necessary since about everything in the repo can be recompiled quite easily (you would lose assembler optimizations though). I don't care at all about being able to install Windows natively on a Pandora 2, that is something I wouldn't want to do.

In terms of price: I think $500 is quite cheap for a mini-laptop. You can pay way more for a decent normal laptop, and although that one will have better performance, it lacks features like super battery life, being a handheld (pocketable, no need to bring a backpack), dual SD slots, built-in gaming controls, etc.

I have a personal exception to that.  I don't want to run Windows on anything - but I'd like to run X86 Linux on it so I can run the X86 Linux binaries for Neverwinter Nights.  Again, that's just one game for one person - not a basis for changing a machine's architecture.

I think your perf/W figure is one half of the key - the other is max W used which leads to minimum battery life expectancy - but that is all very hypothetical.

We could always artificially throttle the CPU back to force minimum run time to X hours...  Sony did that in some of their Vaio laptops.

 

[TrashyMG]

Likewise I gave up on windows over a decade ago, I use it when I must.. but that's it. Personally I'd rather see some of these projects like Neverwinter Nights decide to open source their code or compile ARM friendly binaries. I don't like the idea of jumping architectures..

 

[EssoAir]

Likewise I gave up on windows over a decade ago, I use it when I must.. but that's it. Personally I'd rather see some of these projects like Neverwinter Nights decide to open source their code or compile ARM friendly binaries. I don't like the idea of jumping architectures..

You gave up on Windows at jts peak?? WinXP was amazing! What did you not like about it?

 

[mcobit]

Viruses.

 

[TrashyMG]

Likewise I gave up on windows over a decade ago, I use it when I must.. but that's it. Personally I'd rather see some of these projects like Neverwinter Nights decide to open source their code or compile ARM friendly binaries. I don't like the idea of jumping architectures..

You gave up on Windows at jts peak?? WinXP was amazing! What did you not like about it?

• It isn't a(n) *nix based OS. 
• I have to pay for simple programs that are free in Linux..
• There has been no true improvements since Windows 98..
• Why do I need to reboot so much for installing things. XP and above still have this problem.
• It's too resource hungry.
• Like mcobit said Viruses and malware.
• I'm not supporting a closed minded developers.
• Why can't Microsoft create a decent progress bar when copying files.. It seems that these files with take thirty seconds to copy.. no wait two days.. now it's a half hour..
• Also why is it always preparing to copy, preparing to move files. why isn't it just doing..

 

[Asiyura]

• It isn't a(n) *nix based OS. 
• I have to pay for simple programs that are free in Linux..
• There has been no true improvements since Windows 98..
• Why do I need to reboot so much for installing things. XP and above still have this problem.
  
• It's too resource hungry.
• Like mcobit said Viruses and malware.
• I'm not supporting a closed minded developers.
• Why can't Microsoft create a decent progress bar when copying files.. It seems that these files with take thirty seconds to copy.. no wait two days.. now it's a half hour..
• Also why is it always preparing to copy, preparing to move files. why isn't it just doing..

I just reinstalled windows 7, it took me about two days and an innumerable amount of reboots to have it up-to-date.

Viruses are a real pain in the arse : having an antivirus running on top of an already bloated OS is making the computer sluggish.

More on-topic: I wouldn't back a pandora successor on kickstarter. I would rather have ED getting each and every cent on his bank account than having a third party keeping a part of the money for themselves.

 

[thatgui]

More on-topic: I wouldn't back a pandora successor on kickstarter. I would rather have ED getting each and every cent on his bank account than having a third party keeping a part of the money for themselves.

I wouldn't too, simply because I have no creditcard. I also have bad feelings about involving a third party, but (given that kickstarter is still popular when the P2 capaign is about to start) this could give the project an significant boost in awareness. Also with the "preorder mess" still beeing in some peoples mind by that time, it may convince them to back the project as there is a "third party safety belt" they can hold on to if the P2 does not work out.