One week with the Pyra

[Christoph.Krn]

The other option is glossy, but that's horrible

Not necessarily (read the "Glossy screens" section) (more examples).

(...and as you probably know, matte screens without special coating do also impair display quality, because they diffuse light, and that, at least in my experience, is particularily bad for readability of physically small text.)

[...] I don't understand what means "grainy", the back light didn't spread evenly?

It usually means that there are tiny little red, green, and blue dots everywhere on the screen. Visit http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/panel_coating.htm and scroll down to "Panel Manufacturer Trends". The "AG" images show closeups of different types of matte screens.

 

[Jumpman]

Super glad to hear preorders are coming soon, I can't wait.

Also ED, can you please make sure to detail the ICP2 vouchers from Link, and how that will work? I have a rather large one, and it should cover most of the Pyra's cost, but I just need to know the specifics so I can get in line proper when the time comes.

Chris

 

[fusion_power]

Ha, I knew there were possibilities to reduce the size/weight of that huuuge LCD-PCB.
Not sure about the Touchscreen-issues, I never noticed any "grain" on my CC Pandora and it's actualy a very matte screen. My PC Monitor in front of me is also pretty much matte and non reflective and it looks superb. I don't expect alot of issues there on the Pyra screen, I'm sure the final screen will look decent enough. Everything is better than a glossy screen!

Heat issue? Well, ED says that the Pyra runs more or less under load at the moment (minus the GPU unit maybe), which is actualy good to test these problems. Would be worse if the SoC can't be stresssed at all in the pre production phase so we can't have any hint how hot that thing will be under load.
I'm still convinced that there is enough room in the Pyra for a decent cooling solution, the Blend File doesn't include a PCB so I can't see how much space there really is left but I can imagine even a small heatpipe to the outside fit in, if needed.

 

[TrashyMG]

Not sure about the Touchscreen-issues, I never noticed any "grain" on my CC Pandora and it's actualy a very matte screen.

If it was a First Batch screen it was really vibrant compared to the later model screens from my experience.

 

[EvilDragon]

If it was a First Batch screen it was really vibrant compared to the later model screens from my experience.

Actually, we had four or five different throughout the Pandora area, with the last one being my favourite one.
[doublepost=1458399320,1458399042][/doublepost]

Ha, I knew there were possibilities to reduce the size/weight of that huuuge LCD-PCB.

The size doesn't change, it still supports the LCD at the edges. It will be more like grid (or the Windows logo ) now.
And that's nothing new, we always mentioned there's plenty of space on the LCD PCB for all the parts, so of course there's also plenty of space that can be cut out.

Not sure about the Touchscreen-issues, I never noticed any "grain" on my CC Pandora and it's actualy a very matte screen. My PC Monitor in front of me is also pretty much matte and non reflective and it looks superb. I don't expect alot of issues there on the Pyra screen, I'm sure the final screen will look decent enough. Everything is better than a glossy screen!

Yes, that was also one of the reasons we didn't test that so much (only the accuracy of the LCD, etc.)
I've never seen so much grain on ANY touchscreen so far.

I'm still convinced that there is enough room in the Pyra for a decent cooling solution, the Blend File doesn't include a PCB so I can't see how much space there really is left but I can imagine even a small heatpipe to the outside fit in, if needed.

Depends on what you are planning.
We planned from the very beginning to have some options for heat dissipation / spreading, but we always mentioned we will test how much will be needed when everything is assembled.
I don't think your solution would be much different than one of our options.

In fact, we left enough space between the PCB and the battery compartment to put a full insulation / heat spreading mat inbetween, just in case we need it.

 

[Hồng Thất Công]

I don't mind grainy screen. Retro stuff looks awesome on grainy screens. You don't have to change mine, so one less order to concern for you. I can always change out the screen later if I want .

 

[EvilDragon]

I don't mind grainy screen. Retro stuff looks awesome on grainy screens. You don't have to change mine, so one less order to concern for you. I can always change out the screen later if I want .

Yes, that's one of the awesome things.
Replacing the screen is dead easy and can be done within seconds!

Open three screws in the lid, remove the frame, unplug the old screen, replug the new screen, put three screws back in.
Takes about 1 - 2 minutes

 

[Christoph.Krn]

Actually, we had four or five different [screens, remark Christoph.Krn] throughout the Pandora area, with the last one being my favourite one.

I thought there were just two, and was worried that there might have been production variances. But this explains it then...

 

[TheOldOne]

The size is no issue for me. Of the 10 pockets in my shorts 2 are large enough to carry my 9" nook HD+ with keyboard case and 4 others can carry 7" tablets without a case. I actually like the size of the XL versions of the Nintendo handhelds.

 

[Alec]

Every matte screen has grain, as that's the reason they're matte. The other option is glossy, but that's horrible

From what I understand, the smaller the pixels get, the closer they get to the size of the size of the grain of the finish, and so instead of just diffusing the light (as it does with larger pixels) it starts bending the component colors in different directions, making the screen appear speckly and grainy. But with smooth glossy screens, the light goes through undistorted. Something like this:

Considering Pyra's pixels are much smaller than Pandora's, I'm not sure Pyra's screen with Pandora's touchscreen would not look as good.

Are there any other options? Is it possible to apply anti-glare coating to glossy a resistive touchscreen? My monitor Dell has really nice anti-glare, but I'm not sure it would work for a touch screen.

 

[PowerGod]

Maybe, instead of change every touchscreen, there could be an option to sell those pyra for less ? As far as i know an option like that was done for broken Pandoras too

 

[Blue Shadow]

Maybe, instead of change every touchscreen, there could be an option to sell those pyra for less ? As far as i know an option like that was done for broken Pandoras too

Well, ED said reworking the 1000 assembled screens would probably cost 5 000 to 10 000 $, so if he would not want to loose more through discount that would just be -5$ to -10$ per unit. I doubt that such a small discount would attract that much customers.
Of course, the oppurtunity to sell it faster might be worth more, but even than I'm not sure if that work out.

I don't mind grainy screen. Retro stuff looks awesome on grainy screens. You don't have to change mine, so one less order to concern for you. I can always change out the screen later if I want .

Similar here, i guess. Not sure how grainy a screen have too be to bother me.. sandblasted?
Not sure, but I guess as long as it doesn't affect the readability I'm fine for the start. But the majority might feel different.
A hires video/image of the screen indeed would be interesting here.

 

[b_o_b]

ED mentioned the screen was very grainy and picture quality decreased quite a bit. You don't want that, so IMO a wise decision to fix it. Depending on the quality agreement with the company he bought it from, it might be possible to ask for compensation.

 

[lukey]

Maybe ED could additionally include an bad touchscreen with every Pyra as replacement.

 

[Hồng Thất Công]

ED mentioned the screen was very grainy and picture quality decreased quite a bit. You don't want that, so IMO a wise decision to fix it. Depending on the quality agreement with the company he bought it from, it might be possible to ask for compensation.

Can't be worse that my old CRT TV
I'm OK based upon this video.

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

Super glad to hear preorders are coming soon, I can't wait.

Also ED, can you please make sure to detail the ICP2 vouchers from Link, and how that will work? I have a rather large one, and it should cover most of the Pyra's cost, but I just need to know the specifics so I can get in line proper when the time comes.

Chris

Yes, me too- I have a large voucher with Link also and it should cover the majority of cost. Can you please let us know when you have that organized ED. I want to get in on the next pre-order round.

 

[Luke-Jr]

5" 720p displays seem non-existent for the Raspberry Pi (I looked). Can just anyone produce them easily? Is there a risk that ALL such LCDs have the graininess problem?

More importantly: Is there any possibility of adding a camera (or a connector for one) to the back of the new LCD? Even if the cases can't be changed to accomidate it, having even just a place for it there would allow those of us who want it to 3D print or cut up the case for it...

Also, I am not very familiar with 3D printing, but I noticed in one of your videos that there was a difference between the 3D printed case and the mass-production case. Will it still be practical to 3D print replacement cases for the production Pyra, or would that negatively impact the size/form?

Is the hardware interface for CPU boards finalised? Can that be released so people can start making upgrades even before the Pyra ships?

 

[rygD]

Display graininess doesn't seem bad to me based on the video, either. I doubt it would be mentioned if it wasn't bothersome in actual use, though. On one hand I don't want the price to go up, or for ED to lose a bit of money to get them changed, but on the other I want it to be of the quality that the average person would find acceptable to help with sales. I don't think I would mind the current grainy screen (my desktop is usually dark anyway), and as mentioned, I can always change it later if I need to. I know it is probably too much hassle to have only some of the screens changed, so we will probably get what he feels is best.

 

[Xcl4m4t10n]

@EvilDragon can you please post a picture of the grainy?

 

[___]

hmm I remember my gamegears display. that was hella grainy. if it's that bad, then no that will not look ok with retro games. Of course the gamegear display was much more horrible in oh so many ways then what we are used to today... it's probably a bad comparison. Is it even possible to take a photo of the grainyness?

Anyway, since ED says it's not going to delay the release and wants to replace the screens, I am all for it. If it'd slap an additional 50$ onto the retail price, I'd still want the better display. I use my pandora for text work and terminal work all the time, and that alone justifies investing in the best possible display option for me.

EDIT: forgot to say, overall very exciting news. great to hear it's working out so wll and I am really excited about the improved nubs.