Comprehensive Status update!

[elvissteinjr]

Yay, final stretch it seems.

So, what's the official case colour now?

 

[EvilDragon]

Don't they say:

• Speed
• Cost
• Quality

Pick any 2 of the above, i.e.:

• Want it fast and cheap? Sure, it'll be pretty crap though.
• Want it fast and good quality? Sure, it is going to have a serious cost though.
• Want it cheap and good quality? Sure, it is going to take a long time though.

Sums it up: https://goo.gl/ARhLfx

Yep, exactly. That's also what I learned regarding video production.
It's the same thing for every business.

 

[pyrat]

RAM is not so difficult, actually. Yes, you need to make sure your bus is compatible with the RAM, but that can be checked upfront.
So we know the RAM should be compatible. Power supply is not a problem here as well.

The Pandora actually had three or four different RAM / NAND-Chips during it's lifetime, and every chip needed an update of U-Boot (to include the timings and set it up properly).
It never took too long.

With the 4GB chips, it's a bit more complicated as we need an LPAE kernel. But that's not impossible.

Yes, it's 100% sure no PCB changes are needed.

I see. Fine, then. I guess it's not only time but also cost, so much the better if the CPU PCB is already final.

Yes, one CPU board had been reworked.... but only with 2 of the new chips.
So it's a frankenstein board, with two old and two new chips. AND it's reworked, so we don't even know the hardware is 100% intact.
So not the best board to try to get the software to work.

It's better to wait for real produced prototypes.

I see, hopefully the frankestein board served the purporse why it was built.

So having something to keep the SoC a bit cooler for a while is a good idea, and it will only cost a couple of cents.

sure. Nice that it's cheap.

What we need to do is find out the optimal resistor value for the compensation. This can be done by measuring the reception quality of a Wifi signal under the exact same conditions each time while changing the resistor value.
[...]
Then you know the resistor for best possible reception. That value doesn't change, it depends on the board layout.
[...]
Of course, reception also gets worse when you move away from the access point, but that is not being compensated with resistor values but with increasing / decreasing the Wifi power (which is what the Wifi chip and the router does automatically).

Ah, ok. I misunderstood your original post. It's very clear now.

There are rules you have to follow during development to improve the chance it will pass on first try.
Of course, there can ALWAYS be something that radiates too much, and that needs to be fixed.
But if you are carefuly during development, you can really minimize the risk.

Good, thanks for explaining.

To produce 1000 more units, at least 380k EUR is needed. So yes, we either need a business angel who would like to provide us with that payment so we can produce and sell the next batch, or we need another round of preorders.
It should be easier once we delivered the first 1000 units, as then the device will already exist, but some popularity by using some crowdfunding platform should be helpful as well

Whatever you find best. I kind of thing doing it like the first batch should work, but I don't know.

Thank you for your answers, it's even clearer now. And yes, it looks like this is a very capital intensive business.
Let's hope we can somehow change it someday. Thanks for your efforts.

 

[Caine]

Even though it took much longer than planned, I only had a couple of refund requests - and most of them were people who had some misfortune in life and urgently needed the money.

I am REALLY grateful for your support and your patience, I am happy you've been with me here during the development, kept us going and the spirit alive.

No need to be so humble friend. I am sure that I speak for many when I offer you many thanks for taking the risk to realize a common dream held by this community. It has been a long road, but your dedication, openness and commitment to quality is what ultimately makes this project possible.

So... thanks a lot

 

[fusion_power]

Being fast is easy, if you have enough money to throw.

Does this also count for Airports built in Berlin?
Well, most of the issues the Pyra had were not directly releated to Money I think. You can't solve every problem with money and "many cooks" and so on. I guess good connections and the right decissions how and where to build what can bring more benefits than just throwing money at an Project. So the Pyra has actualy a good stand for it's circumstances I would say. Others achive less with more money for sure.

 

[sm0kew0n]

No need to be so humble friend. I am sure that I speak for many when I offer you many thanks for taking the risk to realize a common dream held by this community. It has been a long road, but your dedication, openness and commitment to quality is what ultimately makes this project possible.

It's that which unites us, no? We all took a risk (with our money) to reap the reward of a device no-one else is going to make. Long live tiny computers, opensource or otherwise [runs for cover]

 

[Trezker]

I think being able to follow the progress with so much detail by itself is more than worth the preorder money.
Thank you very much for the regular and thorough progress reports. It's been a joy to know what's going on and learning how hardware development works.

And even if mass production can't happen in time for Christmas, at least we get the satisfaction of knowing it's close.

 

[PowerGod]

I always understand less than an half about what the people of the forum are speaking about, but luckily you alway put things in a simple comprehensible way, and that, plus the openness about the project stages is really a must to see.

Thank you for your work (I really can't understand how you can survive all this...), and even if could be cool to have a Christmas gift, don't rush things

 

[Silent-Hunter]

I think the post made very clear that it's unlikely, but we'll try

However, that also depends on what you define as "mass production year".
It's very probably we START with the mass production already (for example, the CPU boards are candidates to be mass produced in December, maybe even the mainboards), but it might be we're missing LCD Cables or the keymats so we can't assemble them in December.

Mass production doesn't happen in one day, but if nothing bad does happen, it's likely to start in December.

But it's too early to tell - it depends whether the prototypes and remaining samples will work out of the box or not.

Is that when we'll make our final payments? Or is that not until they're ready to ship.

 

[TeDaDeS]

You know we love you ED

Keep up the great work!

 

[tarator]

…
What might still need some tweaks is the DPad - as I'm very, VERY picky with that
…

Good to hear! Bad D-Pads can make some games unplayable…

 

[SneHebNor]

I don't care about Christmas, but I would be very happy to hold a Pyra in my hands during FOSDEM!

If the ones to sell are not ready by FOSDEM, that's OK, but let us at least see and touch a prototype in action in Bruxelles!

But do it like Debian: Release, when it's ready!

Thanks in advance!

 

[comradekingu]

I think it is focus on three:

• Speed
• Cost
• Quality
  
• Ethics

 

[EvilDragon]

Does this also count for Airports built in Berlin?
Well, most of the issues the Pyra had were not directly releated to Money I think. You can't solve every problem with money and "many cooks" and so on. I guess good connections and the right decissions how and where to build what can bring more benefits than just throwing money at an Project. So the Pyra has actualy a good stand for it's circumstances I would say. Others achive less with more money for sure.

I think you would be surprised
If money is there, you wouldn't just do one prototype run. You would do multiple revisions which helps bugfixing a lot.

Also, multiple people would review the schematics and everything so that you would have less issues from the start.

Everything could be triple-checked, so it's more likely it'll work with the first prototype run.

Is that when we'll make our final payments? Or is that not until they're ready to ship.

When they're ready to be shipped. Once the final payment is there, the unit will ship right away!

I don't care about Christmas, but I would be very happy to hold a Pyra in my hands during FOSDEM!

As I'll most probably be at the FOSDEM next year, you could even play around with one when yours has not been delivered at that time

 

[ekianjo]

You can't solve every problem with money and "many cooks" and so on.

LOL what are you talking about? Do you ever see Apple failing to launch their new designs every single year? No, never. Do you see PC manufacturers screwing up their hardware revisions ?

OF COURSE Money matters. Money buys you brainpower and more brainpower leads to higher quality overall. There are diminishing returns in having 200 engineers vs 150, but between 5 and 100 there's not even any question about which one is more effective in terms of results.

 

[levi]

LOL what are you talking about? Do you ever see Apple failing to launch their new designs every single year? No, never. Do you see PC manufacturers screwing up their hardware revisions?

Not apple, although we did see them have to send a free case to anyone who asked after the launch of the iPhone 4, and we have just seen Samsung fail to release a new revision of the Galaxy note. And there have been plenty of motherboards released with buggy ports that only ever half worked.

I guess Fusion_Power is talking about component delivery lead times and such things though. More money can speed those things up I guess, but there are limits. And to a certain extent, more beta testers mean more people moaning that something doesn't work exactly the way they like, which can make more work to try to sift through.

 

[rSl]

thanks for this awesome news-update ed!
as we enter singularity soon, i ordered more lung ching dragonwell tea to stay calm and relaxed while waiting.

 

[comradekingu]

Apple just gave up on major parts of their car project. And if bendgate, antennagate, touchgate and the various other issues isn't enough to remind one of issues plaguing recent iphones, which is their bread and butter, they also managed to make a joke of the latest iteration.

Apple isn't in the business of revision. For what that company is worth, they need to innovate.
They have previously gotten away with selling a lot of industry-first made-by-others because they demand a high price-point, but that is not their market alone anymore. This post would be long if it went into what is wrong with their laptops, but the most damning feature is they used their engineers to covertly over-underengineer it.

Those are the engineers you don't want in a quality product. You want someone who knows it all.
Ferdinand Porsche was one guy, you can fill up Toyota with even more people than they have now, it will not help them get anywhere close if the ones they already have are doing their thing. With the culture they have, it's hard to see it being or becoming anything other than it is.

You start out with one engineer, or fall victim to the shortcomings of the best one, at their best.
Money solves rigorous testing, it does not tell you what to test for, any more than it tells you what to build for, or how.

This is what what 4 million + 500k dollars gets you in terms of a joke.
Not because that money couldn't otherwise be spent any more effectively, but because money is wasted from the top to the bottom in terms of scale.

Microsoft, another giant with more money than sense, used 100 million on designing a game-controller and then decided to stick with what they had.
Their kin line of cellphones too was costly (US$1 billion) and forgotten, and the Pandora has outsold it.

When ED says it's easy with money, he is taking for granted that you have a clue.
What he sees is how it was possible with so little.
To me it is inspiring that it is possible at all, and then for such a small team, and then with such effective use of funds, and then with so little thereof.

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

I'm happy with Pyra's being produced early next year. Though I'm not in the pre-pre-orderer batch - so I'll have to wait a bit, but hopefully not much.
Really looking forward to this. I think you must have learned ALOT on this journey and such experience is invaluable and can be put to good use on other possible hardware projects.

I'm looking forward to getting the word out and helping out in the community here too. it will be fun to set up the pyra, software etc.

 

[senorgomez]

What do I need to do to make sure my preorder will happen as soon as possible? I purchased w/ a guest acct. I have received the code voucher for 330 euro, is there a way to pay in full right now so I don't have to worry about it?