Reality Check - Shipping Date

[renegadechic]

i really just cant wait til the pandoras are all finally out and we dont have any more pointless posts like this. no one will care about any of this any more and we will stop arguing and i will have less of a headache. does anybody actually find these discussions interesting or are they just vehicles for grumpy people to let off some steam? go for a run or something.

You get rusty if you don't make forum posts for a while. It's like keeping in shape mentally. ;"]

-God Ginrai[/quote]i know! i've only just managed to get back on here because of some DNS thing that a nice person on openhandhelds helped with and my claws are all retracted and my defences down. still, i look forward to the dawn of the pandora release after the long restless night of the pre-order wait where the trolls have been out to play.

i refuse to make predictions on the release date until i know the board testing is done and mass production is properly started, and the case moulds are ordered and completed. then i think we will get our pandoras within 6 weeks of that time.

 

[Asmo]

as to how or why the LCDs were delayed, all that is important from his point of view is that OP said they were "waiting on" the screens then like they say they are "waiting on" the case moulds now, and how that epplies to the current situation not NECESSARILY meaning that the case moulds have been ordered, the factory has been given the big green "GO NOW" button, and all that is to be done is sit and complain about how slow Apple are at getting things done, but how that delay will result in a bigger, better, more expensive game.

Correctly interpreted.

That quote from the blog says they didn't have the money at the time. If the bank was supposed to pay, or Craig and Co. were supposed to pay, either way it would be their money, which means either way they didn't have the money. Because there are two possibilities, it is therefore vague, and can't be proof of your point, because if the bank was supposed to pay, then it is proof of my point.

-God Ginrai

Look at the date.
It wasn't until this year that we learned that the LCD issue was cash related - it was a 'supplier problem' until that slipped out. There were quite a few posters grumbling about the 'unreliable' supplier of screens 'letting them down' and holding things up, during the latter months of last year. The funding issue is irrelevant therefore because it was 'assumed' (without correction) for several months that the problem was all on the manufacturers end. All this example is being used to illustrate is the fallacy of taking 'waiting on' at face value.
The Bank doesn't pay the supplier, they either facilitate or refuse your attempt to send money. Months would not pass without you being informed by either party!

I hope they are underway, I just wouldn't pin my hopes on those words.

 

[WizardStan]

That quote from the blog says they didn't have the money at the time. If the bank was supposed to pay, or Craig and Co. were supposed to pay, either way it would be their money, which means either way they didn't have the money. Because there are two possibilities, it is therefore vague, and can't be proof of your point, because if the bank was supposed to pay, then it is proof of my point.

That is EXACTLY the point, though. The first quote I posted was from just a few months ago, where we learned that the reason the LCD screens were delayed was because they weren't paid for, regardless of who was responsible. The second quote was from shortly after pre-orders where Craig said they were just waiting for the LCD screens. He didn't say they were waiting on the bank to pay for the LCDs, he said they were waiting on the LCDs themselves, in much the same way that he has now said they're waiting on the mould. Are they waiting because the mould is already in progress, or are they waiting because payment still needs to be arranged? My post proves that Craig has used the word "wait" in a way inconsistent with your understanding, so it's impossible to say that he hasn't done so again.

 

[God Ginrai]

That quote from the blog says they didn't have the money at the time. If the bank was supposed to pay, or Craig and Co. were supposed to pay, either way it would be their money, which means either way they didn't have the money. Because there are two possibilities, it is therefore vague, and can't be proof of your point, because if the bank was supposed to pay, then it is proof of my point.

-God Ginrai

Look at the date.
It wasn't until this year that we learned that the LCD issue was cash related - it was a 'supplier problem' until that slipped out. There were quite a few posters grumbling about the 'unreliable' supplier of screens 'letting them down' and holding things up, during the latter months of last year. The funding issue is irrelevant therefore because it was 'assumed' (without correction"] for several months that the problem was all on the manufacturers end. All this example is being used to illustrate is the fallacy of taking 'waiting on' at face value.
The Bank doesn't pay the supplier, they either facilitate or refuse your attempt to send money. Months would not pass without you being informed by either party!

I hope they are underway, I just wouldn't pin my hopes on those words.[/quote]Yes, that is a problem with assuming. However, that doesn't change the fact that they were waiting. It just means that people blamed it on the supplier rather than the bank, because they didn't have more information.

That quote from the blog says they didn't have the money at the time. If the bank was supposed to pay, or Craig and Co. were supposed to pay, either way it would be their money, which means either way they didn't have the money. Because there are two possibilities, it is therefore vague, and can't be proof of your point, because if the bank was supposed to pay, then it is proof of my point.

That is EXACTLY the point, though. The first quote I posted was from just a few months ago, where we learned that the reason the LCD screens were delayed was because they weren't paid for, regardless of who was responsible. The second quote was from shortly after pre-orders where Craig said they were just waiting for the LCD screens. He didn't say they were waiting on the bank to pay for the LCDs, he said they were waiting on the LCDs themselves, in much the same way that he has now said they're waiting on the mould. Are they waiting because the mould is already in progress, or are they waiting because payment still needs to be arranged? My post proves that Craig has used the word "wait" in a way inconsistent with your understanding, so it's impossible to say that he hasn't done so again.

I see what you mean, but my point is that even if the money needs to be paid by the bank, Craig and Co. are still waiting, because everything on their end has been done, everything else needs to be sorted out by the bank, case manufacturer, and anyone else who would be involved in the process.

I will admit that I was wrong to say earlier that the clock should be ticking, because if, say, the bank has not paid the manufacturer yet, then they may not have started working on the moulds.

-God Ginrai

 

[Monk]

I am reminded of this quote from early April:

QUOTE (Chip)
we have everything we need to start manufacturing now.


Persoanlly I found only one way to interpret THAT, but it was wrong. I've given up waiting per se - I've moved on to playing with other toys and will hopefully be able to keep my excitement on those until/unless my Pandora arrives.

Oh - do we not have the "Pandora1" and "Pandora2" "smileys" any longer?

 

[God Ginrai]

we have everything we need to start manufacturing now.


Persoanlly I found only one way to interpret THAT, but it was wrong. I've given up waiting per se - I've moved on to playing with other toys and will hopefully be able to keep my excitement on those until/unless my Pandora arrives.

Oh - do we not have the "Pandora1" and "Pandora2" "smileys" any longer?

He was talking about manufacturing the boards, no case involved.

-God Ginrai

 

[(naw)mcx]

we have everything we need to start manufacturing now.


Persoanlly I found only one way to interpret THAT, but it was wrong. I've given up waiting per se - I've moved on to playing with other toys and will hopefully be able to keep my excitement on those until/unless my Pandora arrives.

Oh - do we not have the "Pandora1" and "Pandora2" "smileys" any longer?

andora2: andora1:
These?

 

[Monk]

He was talking about manufacturing the boards, no case involved.

Was he? From what he said (fuller quote below)... how does one tell that?

QUOTE
The first company we contracted to design an early version of the Pandora charged us $20,000 and came up with something just as limited as the GamePark handhelds had been. We had to cut our losses and move on with designing things ourselves. The first batch of analog control pads (which were custom designed and manufactured for the Pandora) were defective and had to be redone. One of the first batches of completed dev boards was destroyed in shipping and we lost over a month waiting for them to be replaced. We've had multiple problems with availability of several parts along the way, but we have everything we need to start manufacturing now.


In that paragraph he mentions the whole unit, analog control pads, and the dev boards that the postal service damaged. How does one tell that "we have EVERYTHING to start manufacturing now" is limited to the boards, and not the nubs or the keyboard mats or the cases (or...)? Only, I suspect, with hindsight and people making excuses.

Remember, it was early April that this interview went live. During which he also said:

QUOTE
With some luck we could fire up the assembly line in as little as 3-4 weeks.


If just making the mould takes 30 days and the case mould hadn't been produced back then, starting the assembly line... oh - that was the assembly line for just the boards as well?

What these folks say, for the most part, really consists of just enough to let you guess at things - it doesn't, in and of itself, inform you at all. They probably have not dared to give a reasonable estimate for delivery date for fear of having too many people say "I'm not waiting THAT long, I'll have a refund please".

I am reminded of this quote from early April:
Oh - do we not have the "Pandora1" and "Pandora2" "smileys" any longer?

andora2: andora1:
These?

That's the ones - the ones that used to be in the little smiley control panel on the left, but aren't there any more. Ah! I see - they're relegated to a "hsow all" popup window now!

Personally I always found it amusing that members would take posters to task for mentioning what "might be" in Pandora2 on a board that has a Pandora2 graphic for instant insertion into any message...

Ta

 

[ninjawiz2x]

just get a wiz to hold you over , its less than $200.

 

[gibberish]

They probably have not dared to give a reasonable estimate for delivery date for fear of having too many people say "I'm not waiting THAT long, I'll have a refund please".

thats what i think as well.
i dont care anymore anyway, im in it for the long haul. when its done they'll send me one.

 

[Nova]

I for one am just glad that the age-old(kinda) "Pandora or Duke Nukem Forever?" question has been answered.

 

[sebt3]

"Pandora or Duke Nukem Forever?" question has been answered.

So you actually mean that th pandora projet will still be there in 5 years.
I'm still a preorder-guy, and still happy this way

 

[Sonict]

My parents and family don't believe it will be out or it is does come out, It will be crappy. Main reason: 8 months after paying for something and it isn't out yet. Good thing it is my money, I bet I would be forced to wait for the second batch otherwise.

I also suck at explaining stuff too. Even if I had all of the information to prove that this is real and the delays isn't just made up, they wouldn't "buy" my info.

At any rate. Nice scam you guys got going here.

 

[Monk]

Well one of the supposed reasons that it isn't out is because they want to do it RIGHT, not quick. For which I have a certain amount of sympathy/support.

I'd also be concerned at this point, with them still offering batch #1 pre-orders, that there might never BE a second batch to order from

Get 'em while they're hot!

 

[renegadechic]

Well one of the supposed reasons that it isn't out is because they want to do it RIGHT, not quick. For which I have a certain amount of sympathy/support.

I'd also be concerned at this point, with them still offering batch #1 pre-orders, that there might never BE a second batch to order from

Get 'em while they're hot!

i reckon theres a whole wealth of people who will jump on board when they realise this isnt vapour. second batchers, especially if theres credit card ordering, will definitely be there.

 

[michaeljustman]

Well one of the supposed reasons that it isn't out is because they want to do it RIGHT, not quick. For which I have a certain amount of sympathy/support.

I'd also be concerned at this point, with them still offering batch #1 pre-orders, that there might never BE a second batch to order from

Get 'em while they're hot!

i reckon theres a whole wealth of people who will jump on board when they realise this isnt vapour. second batchers, especially if theres credit card ordering, will definitely be there.

Not to mention the second batch will probably go with a lot less hitches, because they'll have been through the process of getting them together before.

 

[God Ginrai]

He was talking about manufacturing the boards, no case involved.

Was he? From what he said (fuller quote below)... how does one tell that?

QUOTE
The first company we contracted to design an early version of the Pandora charged us $20,000 and came up with something just as limited as the GamePark handhelds had been. We had to cut our losses and move on with designing things ourselves. The first batch of analog control pads (which were custom designed and manufactured for the Pandora) were defective and had to be redone. One of the first batches of completed dev boards was destroyed in shipping and we lost over a month waiting for them to be replaced. We've had multiple problems with availability of several parts along the way, but we have everything we need to start manufacturing now.


In that paragraph he mentions the whole unit, analog control pads, and the dev boards that the postal service damaged. How does one tell that "we have EVERYTHING to start manufacturing now" is limited to the boards, and not the nubs or the keyboard mats or the cases (or..."]? Only, I suspect, with hindsight and people making excuses.[/quote]Ok, my mistake, you took boards more literally thatn I meant. I meant everything that would be connected to the boards minus the case. (and possibly the mats) Chip was saying that they had everything else they needed to start production, so they only needed to wait for the cases. Also, I read it the way I am saying now back when Chip first made that post, so no hindsight involved at least on my part.

oh - that was the assembly line for just the boards as well?

Yes.

-God Ginrai

 

[WhiteBat]

^_^

 

[renegadechic]

oh internet...

 

[God Ginrai]

^_^

lol. Did you draw that?

-God Ginrai