Re: A further update on preorders (18th of November 2012)

[Klumpen]

 

[_wb_]

TrashyMG: I don't have any problem with your use of language. I was just trying to illustrate how English can be hard to parse for non-natives. I'm not a grammar nazi and I can live with people making typos. I do get pissed off by people who don't use capitals or punctuation and who deliberately misspell words because they think it looks "cool".

darkborn: The difference between spelling errors and grammar errors is maybe not what you think it is. Your use of "contest" instead of "context" is a spelling error; although "contest" is also a correctly spelled word, it's clear from the context that you meant to write "context", but misspelled it. It's not a grammar error because both "contest" and "context" are nouns, so grammatically they are interchangeable and both correct. In "(and certainly you are)", the "are" is a grammar error (it should be "do"), because "you are understand" is not grammatically correct, it should be "you do understand".

 

[klapse]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="_wb_" data-cid="208872" data-time="1356106710"><p>


<br />


<strong class='bbc'>"I am upset, but <em class='bbc'> would be happy with im [instant message?]. Sorry I messed up instead of blaming everyone. And there, brothers, for misjudgment on his part! "</strong><br />


<br />


</blockquote>


Haha, exactly. There, brothers, was an excellent post!


I apologize if the tone of my criticism was upsetting to some people. But using the wrong words in the eggplants you write leads to the reader yellow a step back mentally, and that is avoidable with just a little effort and respect for your reader.

 

[_wb_]

Since this is probably the official pedantry thread of the forum, I'd just like to point out that writing "there" instead of "their" is a spelling error. There's nothing wrong with the grammar.

No, it's a grammar error. The word "there" and "their" are both spelled perfectly correctly, it's just that they're different words, with grammatically different roles, and one of them doesn't belong there according to English grammar.

I'm pretty sure the writer's error doesn't lie in confusing the grammatical roles of the words <their> and <there>. He simply misspelled the word <their>. The misspelled form is also the correct spelling for an existing homonym, and that's certainly more confusing to the reader than a plain wrong spelling; but it doesn't turn a spelling error into a grammar error. You might argue that the error can cause a grammar problem for the reader trying to parse the sentence; but that argument would work better with a more ambiguous example of an error than the one we had here.

Whatever the intentions of the writer were, the error caused the sentence to become grammatically flawed, while a spell checker would not see any problems. So I would call that a grammar error. If he would have written "their brodders", that would be a spelling error. The way I see it:

tokenizer fails -> spelling error

parsing fails (syntax error) -> grammar error

compiles, but program does not what you want it to do -> semantic error

 

[darkborn]

@ _wb_

You are just saying that YOU DO understand what author wants to say, so you are pointing at pointless.

You know for sure that when I do type "contest" instead "context" it is typo / misspelled, and nothing is wrong here for real.

But when you COUNT other typos instead of valid arguments, it is prove that you are doing it as forethought.

Quantity != quality (of arguments), so all your attempts are worthless.
You do not convince me of your noble intentions... "cause OCPD is not you are" (please, correct my Yoda spelling)

 

[darkborn]

 

[TrashyMG]

I apologize if the tone of my criticism was upsetting to some people.

If it was just tone it would be one thing, but not only pointing it out on the thread, but sending multiple private messages essentially calling people illiterate is another. This behavior is harassment. 


It almost made me quit this forum and community.

 

[vcoleiro1]

Christoph.Km, it's very hard to take what you are saying seriously when in the very paragraph you say people should write correctly , there are mistakes (See below)

"Regarding the grammar thing: Texts which are poorly written are more difficult to read that those which are not. If one would like whatever it is that one is about to write to be read and understood by others, then well, riddling it with errors is not exactly the best thing to do.Regarding the grammar thing: Texts which are poorly written are more difficult to read that those which are not. If one would like whatever it is that one is about to write to be read and understood by others, then well, riddling it with errors is not exactly the best thing to do."


As you have clearly demonstrated , mistakes are made in everyone's posts, even those arguing (like yourself) for proper grammar etc.


Tolerance is the name of the game here. It is often a rule in Forums that Spelling Police antics won't be tolerated, quite often on other forums it's enough to get booted as it starts this kind of crap. Also , it is a rule that posts are to be on topic, commenting on Grammar etc is off topic. The rule is there for a reason, it's there to prevent the crap and thread derailing shit that happened with the thread in question. Keep on topic - No grammar policing


The fact of the matter is , pretty much everyone makes grammar and spelling mistakes in pretty much every post - Learn to tolerate it. We all try our best to write correctly - leave it at that.


Also, Don't even attempt to defend Klapse. Even if you were to go down the path of correcting someone, there is a correct and wrong way to do it. Klapse likes to go down the wrong way and is rude about it. I have even received PM's from him calling me stupid for using the wrong word. I know others have received similiar PM's also. There is no excuse for his behaviour , I don't give a shit what country he comes from , rude is just rude.

 

[hedwards]

Agree with that 100%. EDIT: if you are talking about "OCPD", how do you call Craig's behaviour?

Nobody ever raped me like this, and I'm not the only one. We are talking here about CC problems, volcanos, Chinese New Years (!) and all of other excuses... but the fact is that Craig's behaviour is intolerable. With this (lack of) communications, or should I say lack of decency, Craig should be out of any normal business, and sued if possible.
Did you see any apology to community on this thread? And look at the name of it. No, and you will not. (Well, ED will do it twice in Craig's name, as always. And that makes ED - ironically - accomplice). Instead, he boasts himself a great seller.

I'll repeat: "Sorry people, I s*rewed up, I'll make my best to get things done" will be enough for most.

This "noble" game against people that refuse to be quiet lasts for years. I was probably the first said that thing publicly to Craig (with really insulting words!) because Craig was so arrogant at the time. He called other "loyal servants"(!) to make fun of anybody who is "rumbling" about rights to know what's going on...
"Troll hunting for his majesty Craigix" was the game. Those honourless people are today at forum, but they think all of us have memory like fish.
That was blasphemy then when I did it... but after some time, Craig was lost his rights at forum and was banned because of abusing.
Now he is crying about "hatemails", but he is the one that starts that villainy.
Unfortunately, ED is included in this patethic "ignore" game: he is polite and nice, but you'll be on some kind of "ignore black list" immediately, same as me and dozens of others... just if you're not acting as spineless sheep -> you're not "constructive".

ED is good at doing best possible in closing list of preorders; unfortunately, he is doing same to the threads that are not "on the line".

@ED: fix Craig's behaviour, not your loyal audience.

I don't know where people get the idea that refusing to keep quite gets people upset. I can only assume that I'm misreading you due to the broken quotes yesterday.

What will piss off a lot of people when folks keep spreading lies without any supporting evidence. I haven't seen anybody with a legitimate complaint being silenced here. I have however seen people spreading previously debunked misinformation and encouraging rifts in the community over alleged misconduct by Craig.

Craig has some issues, but most of the complaints about him are either out right lies or ones based upon not providing information that he may well not be able to provide.

Legitimate criticism handed out in a reasonable way isn't something I have seen people jump on.

 

[hedwards]

In school I have been told, that these contractions are illegitimate in written text, if it is not a quote of spoken dialogue, like in a screenplay.

That's just formal written English, and possibly other languages. Strictly speaking your supposed to write out the entire word. However, you'll see that broken all the time in other types of writing because it's sterile and takes up space. You rarely see that in news or magazine articles as they have more concern with space than formality.

As a general rule, grammar rules aren't worth enforcing unless you're being paid to edit the work or it's causing misunderstandings. And definitely make sure you don't ever make mistakes if you do it as a hobby. I haven't been paying close enough attention, but most of the time when I do, I find the person doing the correcting is making as many mistakes as the person they're correcting.

 

[THB]

So much pedantry, people getting "pissed off" about uncapitalised words or incorrect punctuation obviously have some kind of mental disorder.

 

[_wb_]

So much pedantry, people getting "pissed off" about uncapitalised words or incorrect punctuation obviously have some kind of mental disorder.

if you dont care bout it why r u using capitols and quotation marks and punctuation and all that urself then if you dont see why ppl might be annnoid by pour righting stylez than meybe ur the 1 with the mentol disorder dude coz 2 me its quiet clear Y ppl get pissd of by that it just makes it harder 2 reed much harder 2 read so cmon Y U no understand??!!!11?1eleven

Seriously though, I never said I get pissed off by a little accidentally missing punctuation or a typo or something. I said: "I do get pissed off by people who don't use capitals or punctuation and who deliberately misspell words because they think it looks "cool"."

 

[klapse]

Strictly speaking your supposed to write out the entire word. However, you'll see that broken all the time in other types of writing because it's sterile and takes up space. You rarely see that in news or magazine articles as they
have more concern with space than formality.

Argh. Incorrect: "your supposed to"

As a general rule, grammar rules aren't worth enforcing unless you're being paid to edit the work or it's causing misunderstandings.

Correct: "you're being paid"

You teach English? I hope you don't feel unjustly hurt or suffer severely damaged self-esteem by my pointing out the error. You Americans and your precious emotions...


I sometimes take the time to point-out these particularly annoying errors and hopefully help the poster. Embarassment in front of one's peers is an effective pedagogical tool. I don't "enforce" anything.


EDIT: Happy holidays and merry Christmas to all!

 

[Klumpen]

We all try our best to write correctly

That would be great....

 

[Zelest]

Reading the comments and grammar wars going on here, I can't help but to wonder which part of the internet I just walked into. I thought this was a forum about general talk for the Pandora? This sounds more off topic than anything =P

 

[fusion_power]

I'm german and already happy when people here do understand halfway what I actualy want to say...  :lol:    

However, I just pretend that my english was getting better when I started to read and write in english Internet forums. Compared with the stuff I've learned in school ages back then, this really is an big improvement. So the GP2X and Pandora Forums maybe teached me more useful english than the entire english lessons in school. ^^

Understanding is good, writing is "usable"" I think, still have trouble with all the english time-forms and writing nouns with lower case first letters, but I guess that's nothing comparted to the trouble, english speaking people have with our german "der"/"die"/"das" where in english there only is a "the". 

 

[Link]

I'm german and already happy when people here do understand halfway what I actualy want to say...  :lol:    
However, I just pretend that my english was getting better when I started to read and write in english Internet forums. Compared with the stuff I've learned in school ages back then, this really is an big improvement. So the GP2X and Pandora Forums maybe teached me more useful english than the entire english lessons in school. ^^

Understanding is good, writing is "usable"" I think, still have trouble with all the english time-forms and writing nouns with lower case first letters, but I guess that's nothing comparted to the trouble, english speaking people have with our german "der"/"die"/"das" where in english there only is a "the". 

German was easy when it was just "der"/"die"/"das"

This not so much:

Nom

der

die

das

die

Akk

den

die

das

die

Dat

dem

der

dem

den

Gen

des

der

des

der

 

[Klumpen]

I'm german and already happy when people here do understand halfway what I actualy want to say...  :lol:    
However, I just pretend that my english was getting better when I started to read and write in english Internet forums. Compared with the stuff I've learned in school ages back then, this really is an big improvement. So the GP2X and Pandora Forums maybe teached me more useful english than the entire english lessons in school. ^^

Understanding is good, writing is "usable"" I think, still have trouble with all the english time-forms and writing nouns with lower case first letters, but I guess that's nothing comparted to the trouble, english speaking people have with our german "der"/"die"/"das" where in english there only is a "the". 

German was easy when it was just "der"/"die"/"das"

This not so much:

Nom der die das die Akk den die das die Dat dem der dem den Gen des der des der

Actually, the german genitive case nearly is not used anymore at all, because even for most of the people here it is too much .

I wish, i could speak latin.

 

[Marycontrary]

The biggest shame in closing the other thread is I STILL DON'T HAVE A CLUE where I stand in the queue, when or if I will EVER get this dang thing. Since Craig doesn't answer emails I have no choice but to address my questions here. If I make assumptions about Craig and this situation, it is because the information given makes little sense. I think making the forum the place to go to for all answers is a mistake and an insult to those of us waiting years. How do you think it feels to have to sift through threads of people actually using and learning their Pandora? Or to read threads about how people got theirs in no time at all, or how happy they are with their Pandora? I read about the problems in production, then read that problems are being resolved, then read how production isn't what was being reported and that CC might get sued. Then the next thing I know, CC is history and they aren't being called on the carpet for their mistakes. Fast forward to now and Craigs shop isn't even listed on the home page. Add to that I also read how Craig now owes ED a bunch of money and I never found out if the tax refund came about. So, if I make assumptions about Craig's integrety it's because what I have read leads me to certain conclusions. I have some assumptions that I have not verbalized and aren't very nice. I also fear I may have been pushed to the end of the queue by King Craig who evidently answers to NO ONE including Ed. Did the person who asked that the thread be closed because it was 40some ages long get his Pandora? If so, why is he even interested, or better yet, concerned about the update and excuse me if it was tedious for you to read through. Here's a suggestion, have a real update with real numbers and real expectations of production and sales. I did see his fancy printer he bought...I wonder where the money came for that! I thought about the upgrade, but I am only a sucker once. I will soon become frustrated enough and for the sake of my own mental health will push this issue to the recesses of my mind until it's been 4 years waiting. Will I need to search the forums to find out if Craig's co went belly up and I won't be getting my Pandora or will I get an email saying thanks for your start up money but, grab the lube, you're getting screwed?

 

[Link]

Speaking of grammar.  I skip blocks of text like that.