Q: Warranty At 800Mhz?

[aliking]

@Vimacs - I'm sure you won't mind some unsolicited personal advice (everyone loves unsolicited advice, right?): reconsider.

In x months time all that will remain is this: If you cancel your order, you won't have a Pandora. If you don't, you will have a Pandora.

I suggest sleep on it, facepalm, talk to ED about reinstating your order. Make ED promise to buy himself something special with your $330 so that you know it's not going to Craig.

a

 

[conso]

Actually, I don't really think this overclocking debate makes any sense at all. If/when the pandora will be released, people will start overclocking it. There's no dispute about that, some will have the guts. Those people will report how long/high they overclocked it and we can then see what's technically possible.
As said before, there's probably no way for ED and Craig to see if a pandora was overclocked, so they should indeed hope that such threads come to be and users will make an educated decision. Keeping warranty alive will even help to gather honest reports.
I for one would rather not brick my expensive device, even if I don't fear about my money. Guess most people in this community are the same.

 

[renegadechic]

RenegadeChic, I respect you, because you are a reasonable person most of the time. What you say is right,
_but_

Saying "overlocking causing harm is new to me" is easier to write than several lines of insults.
Human interaction can be _so_ simple by following certain rules.
If someone continuously breaks those rules, I tend to say it's deliberate and all further consequences are justified.

have you ever had a fist fight with your best friend? i have with several of them. sometimes there is stuff going on if your life or someone hits the wrong nerve and ive thumped them. i've never been under anything close to this amount of stress, but i imagine the situation is the same. ive never felt like craig didnt love the project or on any serious level the community but sometimes you take a swipe. its a shame that the internet and written takes makes something history to be held against you beyond any normal human level of forgiveness, and i even got the impression from you that you took it well on the chin, which i was very glad of.

i dunno... its an ambitious project being run by very very human individuals and theres a fair amount at stake with it. its better for being more human but its also more volatile. if i had to guess i would say that not getting these cases done before chinese new year was a bit of a limit break for craig.

we've got the answers we are gonna get from this thread, whether its what people want to hear or originally were made to believe it would be is moot. overclocking to the point of breaking your pandora voids the warranty. TI advertises the chip as being 600Mhz or maybe even 500 and that if you choose to push it beyond that it is not guaranteed to work or last for as long. chances are a bit of overclock wont hurt but its down to you to do it. the project is DIY friendly for sure and plenty of information available to allow possible future modifications but it is absolutely at the consumers risk. if there is anything else to add to that then so be it, otherwise lock this down, there is no more debate to be had, only further character assassination

 

[mali]

Actually, I don't really think this overclocking debate makes any sense at all. If/when the pandora will be released, people will start overclocking it. There's no dispute about that, some will have the guts. Those people will report how long/high they overclocked it and we can then see what's technically possible.
As said before, there's probably no way for ED and Craig to see if a pandora was overclocked, so they should indeed hope that such threads come to be and users will make an educated decision. I for one would rather not brick my expensive device, even if I don't fear about my money. Guess most people in this community are the same.

+1

@renegadechic
I stopped punishing people already when still in elementary school
I was mean to people when in a bad mood, but I managed to say I'm sorry afterwards.
I solve problems myself, but when something is too big to handle on my own, I ask for help.

Other than that, yeah we should forget it for now and get back to this next time it happens, I hope it won't.

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

Frankly this is all bullshit.Mali,it was unwise to say what you did when you knew craig could see your post.
I get where hes coming from.Theres alot of work in this project.Vimacs please seriously reconsider.Have a beer.
Craig threatening cancelling your order was wrong.Though you threatening to licence the software and it not being free was wrong.The pandora is craigs baby and hopefully ours too.The pnd format looked cool.Please seriously reconsider.Ill take a flaming for this post but frankly everyone majorly overreacted here.Nuff said.

 

[renegadechic]

can we start a get devs drunk fund where we buy them beers til they decide to come back? :lol:

edit - typo

 

[Kyo]

can we start a get devs drunk fund where we buy them beers til they decide to come back? :lol:

edit - typo

We still have the dev fund, right?

 

[renegadechic]

can we start a get devs drunk fund where we buy them beers til they decide to come back? :lol:

edit - typo

We still have the dev fund, right?

i meant separate to that, no encouragement to actually produce or provide anything

 

[Kyo]

can we start a get devs drunk fund where we buy them beers til they decide to come back? :lol:

edit - typo

We still have the dev fund, right?

i meant separate to that, no encouragement to actually produce or provide anything

No, I mean to fund the beer

 

[MDave]

I think it ends up as this:
If you damage the processor by overclocking/overvolting then thats your fault, and you'll need to buy another PCB.
If you overclock and something else happens, like the USB host socket falls off, then that will be covered by warranty, as it's obviously not related to the overclocking.

We need to remember that warranty is for manufacturing defects - the processor dieing by trying to run it at 900Mhz isn't a defect, as the speed is meant to be 600Mhz max (by default the system runs it at 500Mhz).

Secondly, on the dev boards, 900Mhz was only attainable by using OPP3 value, and thus drastically reducing the life of the OMAP. Therefore, you should stay under 700Mhz.

The OS allows you to both adjust the speed of the processor, and adjust the voltage of the processor.

Just to be clear, current kernel doesn't allow to change OPP (or voltage) by hand, so at least the default OS won't allow you to overvoltage.

Oh, and I dug this out of my YouTube inbox from a while ago, hope MW doesn't mind me using it.

Right now I overclock without changing the core voltage so no damage will be done. If the bits get garbled due to too much speed, then the kernel either locks up or 'seg faults' the application. Higher overclocks could be done by the user later if they dare increase the voltage (done in software).

MWeston2 03 Nov 2009

He seems to think it wouldn't be much of a problem if you don't increase the voltage.

Just posting the good info that was posted in this thread for those just joining us.

Bottom line: It is safe to overclock without increasing the OPP (or voltage) by hand.

 

[renegadechic]

can we start a get devs drunk fund where we buy them beers til they decide to come back? :lol:

edit - typo

We still have the dev fund, right?

i meant separate to that, no encouragement to actually produce or provide anything

No, I mean to fund the beer

lol i know what you meant, but im not sure everyone who already donated to the dev fund wants their donation to go towards beer. something new and optional and light hearted. theres a good few people id like to buy beers already, though i expect if everyone bought some people beers, they would drink themselves to an early death by the time they got through it! actually, when the 4000 are delivered we should arrange meetups/pissups for the users in our own countries (its hard to expect everyone to cross borders)

 

[Kyo]

At least it would go somewhere

 

[BackAssward]

Interesting Notaz, thanks.

As for everything else going on in this thread, can it just be water under the bridge now? It's a real shame to see mali being attacked from all sides over one post. He's one of the most friendly and helpful community members we have in this subforum.

I'd say "was".

I made many posts why what he said was inappropriate. To admit dishonesty, a willingness to screw OP over if he chose to break his Pandora, and to tell others they could do the same (and having done such a thing in the past, with an air of pride).


I still don't know why some blindly ignore these facts.

 

[renegadechic]

At least it would go somewhere

*adds a few drops to your half empty glass*

 

[EvilDragon]

Holy moley, what's happening here?

I followed all these posts to find out there are several things I really need to point out...

First off, it is NOT easily possible to OVERVOLT the unit!
This has been removed from the kernel. You can only OVERCLOCK, which shouldn't do any harm (except for freezing the unit).
So I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Second, some comments to what started everything here:

@mali:
Yes, you could overvolt without telling anyone. However, please keep in mind that this is no big company here.
If a lot of people did this and we get back hundreds of Pandoras which died from overvolting and everyone said "Hey, I didn't do anything, it's covered within the warranty!", it could destroy the whole project.
As said, I'm talking about overVOLTING, not overCLOCKING, as that will definately hurt the Pandora (overclocking most probably won't).

This lead to a currently fully stressed craig to overreact. Yes, he shouldn't post when in that mood, but it CAN happen. I tend to NOT post when I'm in that state (and believe me, a project as this really really stress you A LOT).

@craigix:
Try to NOT overreact like this. You can TELL guys the reason why this isn't nice, but please don't insult them.
If you are very stressed, it's better to not post anything (or tell me I should handle this, as insulting will lead to threads like this one).

Now, the thread continued... vimacs (probably also having a bad day) was pissed off by this and threatened craig that he will put his scripts under a more restrictive license, therefore PNDs won't work.
Of course, this lead craigix to think about dropping PND support, as this could've lead to serious problems delivering the Pandoras out.

Craig AND vimacs seemed to have calmed down a bit later on, as vimacs didn't close his scripts but gave the rights to skeezix and craig told us it wasn't his intention to insult vimacs in any way.

Well, congratulations, you just saw what stress can do to people working together on one major project.

My advise is for all to calm down.
This project can REALLY be stressful, you can believe me (I experienced the same). Having to deal with chinese business partners while having 4000 guys sitting behind your backs asking impatiently what's the current status now (every five minutes ) can really stress you. Of course, a lot of money is involved, too.

Therefore, things can happen that shouldn't. I hope craig does learn from this and will try to calm down before posting, as it will hurt the project instead of helping it.

vimacs, please don't leave us. You've really been a great help so far and I personally wouldn't want to miss you.
We all had our bad days, but in the end, all we want is this little thing going out there and bringing joy to everyone!

Yes, working on the OS or other stuff while not having much time can really be annoying and stressful... but that's just the last steps we have here.
Once it's out, there are tons of devs who will help us tweaking it for sure.

Shipping will bring a lot of relief. Then things will become a LOT smoother.


Okay, now finally, my thoughts about overclocking / overvolting:

I don't think overclocking should void your warranty, as I don't think it will kill any CPU.
When it comes to OVERVOLTING, things are different. It can SURELY kill your CPU and it will be disabled in the kernel we provide.
It's basically like trying to use 12V instead of 5V in AC in. It will fry things and therefore, this should void warranty.

We need to investigate more about it, but that's my opinion.

Now, everyone, thanks for reading.
Let's all grab some nice warm cup of coffee, calm down a bit, and continue to work TOGETHER on our small little handheld instead of throwing insults around us, okay?

Thanks.

 

[Nova]

Very well said ED.

 

[Bosbeetle]

Eventhough you're called evildragon you seem the least evil of them all maybe calmness is the true evil. That aside greatly spoken.

 

[Poem58]

The voice of reason speaks, and all is right in the world. (I hope)

 

[(naw)mcx]

Thank you, ED

 

[calc84maniac]

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+9001