Release PND management suite

[mcobit]

Some suggestions from IRC:


<mcobit> B-ZaR: There semms to be a problem with newlines in descriptions. See Monsterz pnd for example.


<mcobit> Or Mission faileD


<Cloudef> yeah those should be stripped by client


<Cloudef> this is a problem with crappy descriptions on pnd's though


<mcobit> multiple lines are allowed in descriptions aren't they?


<Cloudef> yeah, would be better if not


<B-ZaR> mcobit: gather your suggestions in a forum post, so I can check it when I start working on it


<mcobit> Can't they be detected and properly set to the new line instead of a define space?


<B-ZaR> now back to cooking


<Cloudef> mcobit: yes, milkyhelper for example just strips everything though


<Cloudef> and limits the description


<mcobit> B-ZaR. Then there are some encoding issues in e.g. Mr. Sitwell in Turbo WC Magical Adventure


Edit: Also if the title is too wide for the screen, it will be displayed centered and on the left and right, the text is lost. Maybe make the title start at the left and write ... at the end, if it is too long?


An example for that is Mr. Sitwell in Turbo WC Magical Adventure

 

[bzar]

Through the repo's newsfeed I was just notified that b-Zar released PNDManager. Wow!


My question to B-Zar:


Is this the result of our forum discussion and the analysis in the wiki?


I'd be delighted if I my initiative encouraged this.


Will have a look at it somewhen later, and give my feedback.

I would be lying if I said they didn't affect some of my decisions. I've been brewing this in my head for some time and conversations/brainstorms/structuring like that have a big effect on especially problem framing and partitioning. My main inspirations UI style wise were Android and Meego stores, but the conceptual focus areas were more like a union of ideas from the forum (cropped to fit the compo deadline, even if barely ). So in a word: yes, they were a contibuting factor and I think it shows in some parts of the UI.

 

[Tempel]

<mcobit> multiple lines are allowed in descriptions aren't they?


<Cloudef> yeah, would be better if not

Huh, why not? PNDs should have some way to give a proper description, not just a one-line summary. If you need a one-line summary, you could do what Debian does and treat the first line of the description as the short summary. Even if it's not a standard, it seems like a reasonable heuristic.


Yes, this seems like the perfect place to debate PXML standards .

 

[Cloudef]

<mcobit> multiple lines are allowed in descriptions aren't they?


<Cloudef> yeah, would be better if not

Huh, why not? PNDs should have some way to give a proper description, not just a one-line summary. If you need a one-line summary, you could do what Debian does and treat the first line of the description as the short summary. Even if it's not a standard, it seems like a reasonable heuristic.


Yes, this seems like the perfect place to debate PXML standards .

It's exactly like you said. Short description would be the preferred one so users can glance at it even on package list view and know what the program is about. But as you see many descriptions on repo try to tell you the whole life story by starting the description such way that no-one knows what's the program about.


So having nice short description and optional long description would be a-ok, however the long description part can be stuffed to documentation or info section at repo already IMO.


But as many know already, I don't really like PND system much or the specs around, but I'll do tools to make life bit easier though.

 

[Michoko]

This is VERY nice work! I'm impressed!


The only suggestion I'd have is to be able to sort either by date OR by name in the categories listing (for example to see only the most recent games). Anyway it made me feel like exploring the repo again!


Keep up the great work!

 

[bzar]

^ I actually thought about doing that (since it's how MilkyTest and Consolidation worked), but couldn't quite figure how the ordering would fit to the control scheme. For touch screen I could think of all kinds of drawers and stuff, but for game controls it became a bit more difficult. I thought about making a "context menu" to stuff this kind of things into, but it would kinda break the simple UI scheme I have. Thus I just made a list of previously updated packages to the home view.

 

[Michoko]

Hmm, if I'm not mistaken, the "Start" key is already used for syncing, but the "Select" key is available? The "Select" key could then be used to switch between several sorting modes (basically toggling alpha or date sorting?). In the top right corner of the screen, a small text could tell what kind of sorting is currently active, keeping everything simple.

 

[gruso]

This is f**king great.


More later.

 

[bzar]

I'll probably do a most wanted small additions update after the compo when I can release more features


So gather ideas and requests here and I'll see what I can do after the voting . For now I'm trying to relax a bit after the intense period of trying to get this to a ready state for the deadline. Critical bugs I will fix as they are found.

 

[Cloudef]

Da|Mummy reported bug where last updated doesn't show the correct ones that are on repository's web page. I don't think this is issue in PNDManager, but in libpndman.


I'll take a look what it could be.

 

[bzar]

Some suggestions from IRC:


<mcobit> B-ZaR: There semms to be a problem with newlines in descriptions. See Monsterz pnd for example.


<mcobit> Or Mission faileD


<Cloudef> yeah those should be stripped by client


<Cloudef> this is a problem with crappy descriptions on pnd's though


<mcobit> multiple lines are allowed in descriptions aren't they?


<Cloudef> yeah, would be better if not


<B-ZaR> mcobit: gather your suggestions in a forum post, so I can check it when I start working on it


<mcobit> Can't they be detected and properly set to the new line instead of a define space?


<B-ZaR> now back to cooking


<Cloudef> mcobit: yes, milkyhelper for example just strips everything though


<Cloudef> and limits the description


<mcobit> B-ZaR. Then there are some encoding issues in e.g. Mr. Sitwell in Turbo WC Magical Adventure


Edit: Also if the title is too wide for the screen, it will be displayed centered and on the left and right, the text is lost. Maybe make the title start at the left and write ... at the end, if it is too long?


An example for that is Mr. Sitwell in Turbo WC Magical Adventure

All solved. Also added the additional info text below the description. I wonder what counts as a bug fix and what as a feature regarding the compo. Not releasing this until I get OK from some authority or after the compo

 

[bzar]

Hmm, if I'm not mistaken, the "Start" key is already used for syncing, but the "Select" key is available? The "Select" key could then be used to switch between several sorting modes (basically toggling alpha or date sorting?). In the top right corner of the screen, a small text could tell what kind of sorting is currently active, keeping everything simple.

Implemented in category view. I decided to make a header button for this, that's actually part of the scrollable area, so it shows when you're at the top, but doesn't take any actual screen estate from the main attraction. Will be in the next release.

 

[Eight Bit]

This app is made of win!


And It would be über-win if I could launch installed pnd's from within it.


Verstuurd van mijn HTC Desire met Tapatalk

 

[bzar]

I could make it launch PNDs, but there would be some memory overhead. Concievably I could shut it down for the time the app is running, but that would be a bit more work to get functioning properly.


I'd like to, but we'll see. For now I'm concentrating fully on the package management aspect.

 

[Eight Bit]

I figured memory would be an issue. Maybe some small footprint launcher in between pnd manager and the to-be-launched app would work. To be honest... I would trade in mini-menu for pnd manager if it could launch apps (and switch on wifi) ;-)


Keep up the awesome work though, I love it!


8


Verstuurd van mijn HTC Desire met Tapatalk

 

[porg]

Comparison of Panorama in UI mode MilkyTest ("M") and PNDManager ("P")


SUMMARY: PNDManager is clearly superior with multi tasking and downloading, general stability, and a consistency in the drill-down/up navigation metaphor.


But besides this, Panorama Milky has a far higher usability, is far more sophisticated and original!


I'd personally prefer you'd fix Panorama's stability and add the multitasking & parallel download feature + the launch-app feature, then it's perfect!


Feature by feature comparison:


OVERVIEW:


M: Icon + Title + Start of description text. Grouped by days.


P: Icon + Title + Date. No description! Very worthy for quick orientation. A lot of unused screen space. Date for each item is redundant if multiple entries share the same, M's grouping feature avoids that redundancy!


M has a FAR superior overview, as all its sorting, filtering and grouping methods are both available to local (=installed) and remote (=repository) PNDs, allowing super awareness about the package conditions on one's Pandora.


To prove M's superiority, just try to solve these user-centric questions/tasks in the different programs M and P, and you'll realize it:

• What are the newest PNDs in the repo?
  
• What are my newest installed PNDs?
  
• What are the newest PNDs in cat X?
  
• I want to install a PND which starts with "Super", but I don't remember the rest of the name...
  

SORTING:


M: By date, type, name in both local and remote PNDs.


P: User has no influence on sorting.


FILTERING VIA TEXT:


M: Start typing, reduces to items whose title matches the string.


P: No string filtering.


FILTERING VIA CATEGORY:


M: Both for local and remote PNDs.


P: Only for remote PNDs.


MULTI TASKING & DOWNLOADS:


M: Download blocks total UI until finished.


P: User can continue browsing + even trigger parallel downloads.


NAVIGATION:


Navigating in/out of depth (B/X) is a bit more consistent in P throughout all areas of the program (i.e.: "drill down": list > app summary > app screenshots), but M's has a very quick navigation scheme.

 

[Christoph.Krn]

For touch screen I could think of all kinds of drawers and stuff, but for game controls it became a bit more difficult. I thought about making a "context menu" to stuff this kind of things into, but it would kinda break the simple UI scheme I have. Thus I just made a list of previously updated packages to the home view.

This kind of simplicity is what makes the PND manager easy to use, and yet simplicity is not the answer to complexity, at least not the way it is understood by most people.


Did you know that Windows 7's taskbar "Jump Lists" initially used arrows to indicate their existence? in order to /increase/ usability, Microsoft eventually decided to dismiss the Jump List arrows and instead trusted that advanced users would find the feature themselves (what now opens up "Jump Lists" on taskbar entries is right-clicking, which is quite well-known actually, even by not-too-advanced-yet users). Similarly, you could put a "Filter" screen behind a physical key (combination), such as F2 or Ctrl-F, but not indicate this from the main interface, and instead put the information into the documentation (or, at most, put something like a single guihint with a gear next to it into an appropriate place in the main interface).


Maybe you remember the "filter buttons"[1] I once wrote about (buttons that represent a regular expression, each of which can be altered and enabled/disabled from within the user interface). If you allow the user to create such buttons from within the F2-filter-screen, you can then display activated filter buttons on top of the category list in the main UI (or wherever else the filter is currently active), allowing the user to both see at a glance that a filter(s) is active and quickly disable it. For keyboard use, give each filter button a dedicated keyboard button combination (such as "Right shoulder" + "R" for the "Recent" filter button), so as to not interfere with the "instant search" function (this also allows powerusers to quickly toggle filters). Also, you can give each filter button an option to "display filter button in category list even if it's inactive".


Now, the interesting part is that the same mechanic can be used to add various other "buttons" which alter the display of the PND list in some way or another, without compromising the simplicity of the first level user interface.


------------------------------------------------------------------------


[1]: See Spoiler and text above it in http://boards.openpandora.org/index.php?/topic/4272-design-a-panorama-ui/page__st__20#entry76062

 

[fusion_power]

It really works good, I've installed and tested the PND Manager and so far there is not much to complain. It is ways better than PNDstore and the usability is very nice. It even has kinetic scrolling touchscreen controlls, not very accurate when it comes to scroll/click separation but I don't use touchscreen actualy, D-Pad and button usage is perfect. ^^


Very nice to see that it keeps it's app selection when you toggle through the other menu options. Updating also works nice, progress bar is pretty useful. I only miss some selection of individual apps for updating, you can update all or each at once at the moment it seems. Would be nice to mark the apps you want to update, so you can update only some of them (for example if some are just to big for updating directly on the Pandora or so)


Scrolling in the preview pic section is slow on my Pandora but it is still usable and especialy great to see the pics. I just wish all the apps would have some more detailled infos displayed but that is not the problem of the PND Manager.

 

[Cloudef]

It really works good, I've installed and tested the PND Manager and so far there is not much to complain. It is ways better than PNDstore and the usability is very nice. It even has kinetic scrolling touchscreen controlls, not very accurate when it comes to scroll/click separation but I don't use touchscreen actualy, D-Pad and button usage is perfect. ^^


Very nice to see that it keeps it's app selection when you toggle through the other menu options. Updating also works nice, progress bar is pretty useful. I only miss some selection of individual apps for updating, you can update all or each at once at the moment it seems. Would be nice to mark the apps you want to update, so you can update only some of them (for example if some are just to big for updating directly on the Pandora or so)


Scrolling in the preview pic section is slow on my Pandora but it is still usable and especialy great to see the pics. I just wish all the apps would have some more detailled infos displayed but that is not the problem of the PND Manager.

We've discussed with B-ZaR, and I think he is going to include version locking and partial upgrading, and other ideas gathered from this thread and past. The info element from repository is planned to be added into the package view as well. As for libpndman, I'm planning to do the backup option on the library level that some people requested, so you can try new versions and fall back if it's not good.

 

[mcobit]

I thought a bit about it and came to the conclusion, that an indicator for wifi would be nice to have, as it is fullscreen and you don't always see, if you are connected or not.