1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. Dismiss Notice

Money makes the world go round.

Discussion in 'Pyra News' started by EvilDragon, Apr 15, 2017.

  1. SneHebNor

    SneHebNor Still Fresh

    Joined:
    May 15, 2016
    Messages:
    56
    I agree completely. There is a market (not a huge one, but a not-so-small niche) for small computers you can carry in your bag - and you can trust. So no mobile phone, less so with any mainstream OS and proprietary drivers.

    As soon as I get my Pyra, I'll show it all my friends. They will turn green with envy, but eventually they will buy a Pyra, too.

    It would be nice to have - at some later point in time - a variant of the Pyra, that were not optimised for gaming, but for communication instead. I.e. which had a front camera for video chats (XMPP, SIP, ...) and maybe less gaming knobs...
     
  2. canseco

    canseco Very Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2004
    Messages:
    803
    Location:
    Spain
    Dpad as cursor keys, the buttons as Home/End/PageUp/PageDown, and shoulder buttons as Shift/Control are great on OpenPandora for non gaming tasks.

    Pyra having more buttons that act like keyboard keys, would be great for shorcuts and the like.

    Last time i did check Debian on OpenPandora, it worked fine. Same with Slackware.
     
    ClockworkCoder likes this.
  3. Grench

    Grench Forum Addict!

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2008
    Messages:
    5,163
    What do you have in mind?

    The Pyra has both left and right versions of 5 modifier keys = 10 modifier keys that can be applied to nearly every 'normal' key. You could program in, quite literally, thousands of shortcuts with the existing keys. What would the 'more buttons' do?
     
    ClockworkCoder likes this.
  4. canseco

    canseco Very Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2004
    Messages:
    803
    Location:
    Spain
    I just wanted to say that the gaming controls, can be used as keyboard keys too.

    On the Pyra side i was talking about, Insert/Supr face buttons, and the extra two shoulder buttons being more accesible for my use case, maybe others too.

    Having more modifier keys on Pyra is great too, as i use them often.
     
  5. Swordfish II

    Swordfish II Very Active Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2015
    Messages:
    573
    That makes web browsing awesome being able to scroll with the dpad
     
  6. rygD

    rygD Nihilistic Mystic

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2014
    Messages:
    6,383
    Location:
    Everywhere
    I don't want to get political, so I will just say it rhymes with Rump.
    I think they should have killed it. Maybe I will feel better in 4 to 8 years. Maybe.

    That is kinda on topic, based on the title, but to be even more on the current topic:

    I think the dpad works, and has been present on many primarily communication devices. I like to believe this is because it helps with editing text or navigation menus. It could just be that people wanted to play games easier. I am not sure how well other buttons that are not gaming buttons would work out unless they were shortcuts for browsers and email and such. For me a usable keyboard is of great importance ESPECIALLY on a communication device. Maybe a more communication oriented Pyra would have a keyboard that better supports a wider range of regional keyboard default layouts and their related languages.

    Welcome back to the keyboard thread! ;)
     
    FBnil likes this.
  7. Grench

    Grench Forum Addict!

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2008
    Messages:
    5,163
    Options that would have allowed for very broad multiple language use caused fear and panic in a segment of the English speaking crowd. Even the mere presence of German characters on the Fn layer as we have now was met with mild protest. If the Pyra takes off and becomes a resounding success to where an alternate keyboard layout becomes possible, there are several examples of what this could look like.

    However, since the keymat itself is simply a very complex sheet of rubber, there would be no way to 'autodetect' which layout is installed. If a 2nd international or regional layouts become a thing, there would need to be a selector process in the 'first boot' scripts to ask which layout you are using.
     
  8. levi

    levi Still fresh, damnit!

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2008
    Messages:
    7,903
    Location:
    Somewhere off the coast of the EU
    The keymat could easily have up to 8 spots defined on it that could be printed with carbon pads when they keys are printed on the underside. These could be detected by the mainboard and used by the OS to load different keymaps. I'm thinking of either two in each corner, or four on each corner and four on each edge midpoint - although I think there's some electronics top mid center, so that might limit us to a 7-bit code. 128 permutations ought to be more than enough for the lifetime of the Pyra I'd have thought.

    You'd need a new mainboard with the detector pads on them, along with a new keymat if you wanted to mod your pandora with a different keymat, so maybe ED could just produce different mainboard that are configured to match different keymats, and avoid this detector pad stuff. But it might be simpler to just produce one mainboard with the detectors on, and sell it with different keymats.
     
  9. Grench

    Grench Forum Addict!

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2008
    Messages:
    5,163
    Or just a step in the first boot script, "Please locate and press the X button." (Replace X with a key present in the top layer of both versions but at different locations.) It could be followed by a screen with an image of the selected keymat asking for the user to verify.

    Both ideas, though, have as a pre-requisite that the Pyra with it's current keymat sells in large numbers.
     
  10. Neelix

    Neelix Insecticidal Maniac

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,181
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    To extend that you could have them type a short sequence, e.g. QAZ which would allow for identification of QWERTY, AZERTY or QWERTZ layouts.

    -Neelix
     
  11. Grench

    Grench Forum Addict!

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2008
    Messages:
    5,163
    Some day, if the Pyra sells 10,000 units and still going strong, I could see ED considering a 2nd printed layout. I doubt that would extend to more than that though. So, it might need to be a true 'multinational' support layout. I.e. beyond AZERTY or QWERTZ.

    When it comes to language support and gaming capabilities, I'm still fond of the #6 option from the 'final poll'. Direct support for nearly any Latin based alphabet without any real compromises to English support and the ability to lock the numeric and function key layers to the 'top' at the same time would have been great for gaming. Perceived compromises is where it falls down though - convincing people that it is OK to have symbols present that they won't use - and that they can still use that key for other things - is difficult.
    https://pyra-handheld.com/boards/threads/keymat-layout-the-final-poll.76143/#post-1347936

    What we have now is very good - so long as you speak English - and pretty good - so long as you speak German or French - and should be livable - if you speak another Latin character based language and navigate compose and remap a few Fn layer keys to your own language. But - if there is only going to be one additional (someday, maybe) 'multinational' layout, i think that it would need to be pretty flexible in it's capabilities.
     
    FBnil likes this.
  12. Neelix

    Neelix Insecticidal Maniac

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Messages:
    3,181
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    That would depend who organises it and who's funding it. Theoretically there's no reason a third party couldn't crowdfund the creation of a keymat with their preferred layout and pay ED to have it made.

    -Neelix
     
  13. Grench

    Grench Forum Addict!

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2008
    Messages:
    5,163
    Very true. And since the molds wouldn't change, that side of the dev costs wouldn't be as high. However, just printing the characters onto the keymat isn't the end of that story. That 3rd party would also have to build out a definition file for it - which is not an insurmountable obstacle - just one that shouldn't be ignored. Then you're getting into the 'hackerspace' though and that grants a lot more flexibility than a project has with the included during shipping version.
     
  14. raelik

    raelik Still Fresh

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2017
    Messages:
    4
    Aaaaaand this is a keyboard thread now. WHAT DID YOU DO!??
     
    FBnil, Caine and elwing like this.
  15. Razy

    Razy Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2016
    Messages:
    50
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    Hi there Raelik, welcome to the (key)boards!
     
    comradekingu and error like this.
  16. raelik

    raelik Still Fresh

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2017
    Messages:
    4
    Thanks, I've been lurking for years really, but I'm in a position to be able to pre-order a Pyra soon, so I figured I'd get on the boat :D
     
    ClockworkCoder and ible like this.
  17. Razy

    Razy Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2016
    Messages:
    50
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    Same with me then. I joined exactly a year ago, but I had been following the progress of the Pandora since 2008.
     
    ClockworkCoder likes this.
  18. error

    error Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2012
    Messages:
    58
    Location:
    Dallas, TX, USA

    First corollary of Godwin's Law: As a Pyra thread grows longer, the probability of it devolving into a keyboard discussion approaches 1.
     
    kabaiakh, FBnil, ible and 2 others like this.
  19. Caine

    Caine Advanced Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    3,547
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Welcome to the boards raelik. Great first post.

    Glad to see another lurker becoming active :)
     
  20. Willhelm

    Willhelm Very Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2014
    Messages:
    170
    Location:
    Munich
    [​IMG]
     
    FBnil likes this.

Share This Page

Loading...