Is Gp2x.co.uk A Dodgey Online Store?

[moxie]

How many times do I have to say this to penetrate your thick skull? There is barely any documentation surrounding the machine or its constituent SoC, especially the '2D Acceleration' (blitter) and MPEG-4 decoding hardware (as MagicEyes would like to keep this a secret and charge money to develop software that uses it). Pretty much the only way to learn what the GP2X can and cannot do for specific tasks is to get one.

Which, as you yourself said, would be what the serious designer would do, before committing to any design. Did you? That it is difficult to research doesn't move the responsibiliy somewhere else, y'know, it only takes a little more dedication to good principles.

Apart from that, well...Foaming-at-the-mouth ranting and accusing, invisible friends, corporate conspiracies amongst people who speak funny languages, and everything is someone elses fault. Just add an unkempt beard, and you'd fit straight in amongst the nice people outside the railway station

 

[Exophase]

Someone rationally asked me a question and I took the time to answer it-- if you choose to fault me for that, well, that's your choice.

No, you still haven't answered the interesting question - How can it be anybody but the designers/developers responsibility to research the hardware s/hes developing for?

How many times do I have to say this to penetrate your thick skull? There is barely any documentation surrounding the machine or its constituent SoC, especially the '2D Acceleration' (blitter) and MPEG-4 decoding hardware (as MagicEyes would like to keep this a secret and charge money to develop software that uses it). Pretty much the only way to learn what the GP2X can and cannot do for specific tasks is to get one. However the pretense on which I was convinced to buy one was mostly lies.

Epicenter, why do you keep saying there's very little documentation?

http://mudiweb.com/gp2x/MP2520F_Manual_Eng_V1.0.pdf

EVERYTHING about Magic Eye's chipset is very rigorously documented, in fact I'd say that the documentation is much better than any official documentation I've ever seen for any game platform by Nintendo or Sony. You should have read this document beforehand and failure to do so is entirely your fault. It's not a giant brochure, it is very thorough and legible, did you even really try to read it?

Anyway, about the 2D acceleration. If you would read this documentation you would clearly see that it can do transparent and masked blits throughout VRAM (not just the frame buffer, obviously if it has 8MB of VRAM it can do more than just let you blit to the framebuffer quickly), patterned fills, solid color fills (which you also claimed it couldn't do..)..

It doesn't have scaling/rotation or alpha blending, so it is definitely not very robust, but it's not as bad as you make it sound. It's good for accelerating GUIs, which is what the documentation would lead you to believe it was designed for.. it should also be able to accelerate 2D games that don't require a ton of special effects. And I wouldn't blame the platform is SDL doesn't happen to support all of the functionality of the chipset in hardware.

I'd say the manual is especially good given this was done by a Korean company and yet it is entirely in English that is IMO pretty legible.

 

[TelcoLou]

Epicenter, why do you keep saying there's very little documentation?

http://mudiweb.com/gp2x/MP2520F_Manual_Eng_V1.0.pdf

EVERYTHING about Magic Eye's chipset is very rigorously documented, in fact I'd say that the documentation is much better than any official documentation I've ever seen for any game platform by Nintendo or Sony. You should have read this document beforehand and failure to do so is entirely your fault. It's not a giant brochure, it is very thorough and legible, did you even really try to read it?

pwnt?

 

[Epicenter]

Yes, I have that document and I've been through it. It's not terribly useful. Yes, it does give you some information, but an enormous amount of it is inexplicably (or .. expectedly..) left out. As I said, it prefers long feature lists to real thorough explanation. While it is better than documentation provided to the public from Nintendo or Sony (they'd rather save such info for licensed developers, of course), it pales in comparison to documentation of SoCs by companies such as Samsung or Texas Instruments. But suffice to say, I've delved enough into the machine, and what documentation does exist, and determined the functionality I require isn't there.

But no, apparently that's not good enough for you, and you need to pelt me with a deluge of words until I agree with your inane statements of mindless fanboyism and devout worship of the holy GP2X name. As long as it involves GPH/GP2X, you'll view the situation always through rose-colored glasses. I used to give them a lot of credit too, you can see it in my post history. But eventually reality set in. Maybe someday that happens for you too. Maybe not. I suspect it will, once a half-decent system similar to the GP2X comes along to topple this miserable heap of poorly-designed plastic and silicon from its ill-deserved throne. I personally don't need such an event to transpire to possess such perspective, it's a pity that you do.

 

[gaterooze]

The amount of pure wrong that comes out of this asshole (I've resisted picking apart his bullshit in another thread today) is staggering.

JaqMs finally stopped trolling (mostly), so I guess someone had to fill the void. *sigh*

This is such a nice community normally, but every time this troll posts... Seriously, Epicenter, is your life so empty you need to hang around a board dedicated to something you hate? Is the chip on your shoulder that big?

 

[krosfyah]

*wonders where all the mods have gone*

Is it time yet?

 

[moxie]

But no, apparently that's not good enough for you, and you need to pelt me with a deluge of words until I agree with your inane statements of mindless fanboyism and devout worship of the holy GP2X name. As long as it involves GPH/GP2X, you'll view the situation always through rose-colored glasses.

No, Epi, it has nothing to do with "Mindless fanboyism". I am fully aware of the Geeps little failings. I do not find them so terrible. Apparently you do. Apparently you had a lot higher expectations than I did. But that is beside the point. The point is that it is bloody irritating to see you jump in and point fingers at Craig at every opportunity, claiming he "tricked you" into developing something based on "false claims about the hardware" and therefore he is evil and a liar and yadda yadda. And the point is not that it is Craig, anymore than it would be where it anybody else. The point is:

It is your own bl**dy responsibility! Accept it, rise to it and stop the bl**dy whining! Grow up, already!

I'll try to shut up now.

 

[Exophase]

Yes, I have that document and I've been through it. It's not terribly useful. Yes, it does give you some information, but an enormous amount of it is inexplicably (or .. expectedly..) left out.

I haven't found a single thing left out that's pertinent to actual development of the machine.

As I said at it prefers long feature lists to real thorough explanation.

I doubt you really read through it indepth.

While it is better than documentation provided to the public from Nintendo or Sony (they'd rather save such info for licensed developers, of course)

I was in fact referring to the documentation they give developers, which is often incomplete/inaccurate and with much worse English.

, it pales in comparison to documentation of SoCs by companies such as Samsung or Texas Instruments.

The documentation is meant for programmers, not engineers, and it contains everything necessary to program the machines. There's no point giving electrical or implementation information that is not needed to actually use it.

But suffice to say, I've delved enough into the machine, and what documentation does exist, and determined the functionality I require isn't there.

Yes, and this should have been plainly visible to you as soon as you first considered the platform, since the documentation was all there (and even if it were nothing but "feature lists" it doesn't claim to have any features that it lacks). Of course, you've claimed it lacks features that it actually has, like intra-surface blits (don't blame the machine if SDL doesn't support it) and solid color fills. But even if it lacks what you want, which I'm sure it does, it's not fair to fault it for that. It'd be just as fair to fault it for not having 3D acceleration. It's your problem that it doesn't have the features you want for developing your game, that doesn't mean they did anything wrong when developing it.

But no, apparently that's not good enough for you, and you need to pelt me with a deluge of words until I agree with your inane statements of mindless fanboyism and devout worship of the holy GP2X name. As long as it involves GPH/GP2X, you'll view the situation always through rose-colored glasses.

Say what? You're not talking to ME, are you? If so, have you completely lost your mind? I'm not even a GP2X developer, I don't even have a GP2X yet. I'm a PSP developer, let me spell that out for you a little clearer because it seems you might have missed this fact. In no way do I think a platform like GP2X is without glaring flaws, it has its pros and cons though, and the fact that it lacks some of the things you want doesn't make it useless. What is a shame that people don't seem to be using the features it has that are actually heavily documented.

Besides that, who are you to talk about drowning people in words

I used to give them a lot of credit too, you can see it in my post history. But eventually reality set in. Maybe someday that happens for you too. Maybe not. I suspect it will, once a half-decent system similar to the GP2X comes along to topple this miserable heap of poorly-designed plastic and silicon from its ill-deserved throne. I personally don't need such an event to transpire to possess such perspective, it's a pity that you do.

Okay, you are way too critical and obsessed with this. By this thread it's obvious to me (and hopefully everyone else) that you have a vendetta against this platform because of the bad experiences you've had with certain people. Why don't you stop for a minute and ponder what's wrong with that. The way you carry on here I'd swear you thought every last person using GP2X is under a spell that you need to break them out of. The platform doesn't have the features you want and didn't meet your expectations. Fine. Obviously the same thing doesn't hold for everyone else, and you may not have realized this, but fancy 2D/3D acceleration and floating point performance aren't the key to success for absolutely every project, many games included. The 2D acceleration that the GP2X DOES give is 100% sufficient for developing simple games that don't rely on rotation/scaling and blending, which many actually don't. Besides that, GP2X mostly caters to emulators, and it looks like it does a pretty decent job with all of that. You don't like the fact that it has 2 CPUs, fine; obviously neither do a lot of people, but with some work they can be put to good effect.

What I really don't get is how you can be so hard on GP2X when you seem to be a GP32 fan. GP2X might not be perfect but it definitely improves upon GP32, which had almost no video hardware at all. The video acceleration hardware for GP2X is obviously useful when using the platform as a media player (which I'm sure many people do), and the 2D acceleration and dual CPUs would be useful if more people actually bothered to use them. Other than that, GP2X improves upon GP32 vastly by adding much more memory and utilizing a much cheaper/extensive memcard format. I could swear that you're just heavily biased against GPH, and biased towards GP. This is further evidenced by your statements that GP2X can never do PS1 at decent speed, while XGP Kids can probably do GBA fullspeed without problem..

Bottom line: you have personal issues here ;P

 

[ruckage]

Well said Exophase.

 

[krosfyah]

pwnt?

If he wasn't before, he certainly is now.

Nice one, Exophase.

EDIT: BTW prepare yourself for a lengthy reply. Of course there won't be any meaningful content but he's good at writing a lot without actually saying anything useful. You know up until now I thought he was just a whiny git but after reading Exophase's responses to him I've realised he's actually an incompetent whiny git.

 

[Epicenter]

EDIT: BTW prepare yourself for a lengthy reply. Of course there won't be any meaningful content but he's good at writing a lot without actually saying anything useful.

Actually, no, I'm not going to give you the satisfaction. I will remind you not to confuse a "useless" post for a post you don't understand or agree with.

I honestly don't know why I bother; there's not a single person listening. This community is honestly the most closed-minded and fanboy-ridden I've ever come across. The screams of "Nintendo fanboy!! PSP fanboy!!" are so hypocritical, it's absurd. Everyone is a religious zealot to the GP2X and the miserably poor borderline-scam artist company that produced it, and the full-blown scam artist who promotes/sells it. This discussion isn't getting us anywhere since obviously I've already said all I need to on the issue, but no one really cares to listen. I would be more accepting of others' opinions here perhaps if they were actual criticisms and not personal attacks.

Exophase, you've made some good points and you're probably the only person still speaking with a reasonably level head. But like our PS3 discussion, it is important to note not every developer wishes to drive themselves crazy to get the machine to accomplish even the simplest tasks, and have to question if it's even possible for half of them because of shoddy docs and support. Hell, when using many of the MMSP2's blitter's features I noted they often behaved SLOWER than doing it in software. But either way, what it really boils down to is that the machine is just too faulty for me to use as a development platform in numerous ways. Even if the internal hardware was stellar, the stick ruins everything. No one would want to play the Wii if you had to control it with a can of beans.

Anyhoo. You guys have fun. I'll be somewhere else until there is something worthwhile to discuss. (This will probably be a very long time knowing this forum. ) Adios.

 

[Shikaku]

By the way the world ends tomorrow, so it doesn't matter.

 

[raiydeck]

Exophase very well said !!!!

Epicenter yes we know the faults but don't want to hear them every 5 mins.

Cheers

 

[Mudi]

Epicenter, I haven't seen anyone screaming "Nintendo fanboy" or "PSP fanboy" here at all really. People seem to be fairly supportive of people who use and/or develop for other platforms. Whatever faults the GP2X community has, this isn't one of them.

There are several other problems with your post, but I'll just pass it off as hyperbole and move on

 

[krosfyah]

I wonder if he has nightmares about GPH/GP2x and wakes up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat muttering these same inane ramblings.

I'd be happy to donate some spare pennies towards the therapy he so obviously needs.

 

[Muncher666]

Just felt I'd pop in my 2 cents. Epicenter, we honestly don't give a shit about your negativity, it's just really annoying with you popping in every two minutes telling us that something is near impossible with the 2x and how shit it is..

Allan.

 

[solitude]

What is it with this Epicenter guy? I'm new here and have noticed that so many threads degrade into a rant by Epicenter off topic about the same old things, over and over and over again.

I'm rather bored by it all and have stopped reading what he has to say and skip forward to topical entries. I can tell some of you people enjoy baiting the chap and the subsquent banter but it ends up very negative and doesn't leave a good feeling.

Anyway my goldfish are shoaling at my side of the tank and need feeding. I find them relaxing and threaputic - epicenter you should get some and when the opportunity comes to bash things on this forum go watch them for 5 minutes first.

 

[solitude]

..... back on topic.

I recently cancelled my order with gp2x.co.uk.

I had ordered a 270mhz unit expecting 24 hours delivery as quoted. My credit card was billed straight away.
After three days I emailed a query, I got no response. A week after my order was placed I called up and was told that an email was just about to go out to me explaining that they had run out of 270mhz units, would I like a 266mhz and a £5 refund? I cancelled and was assured my money would be refunded straight away.

A day later I got an email offering the 266mhz unit for a £5 refund! I responded confirming my order as cancelled. I got a reply saying: "Sorry I had missed the note xxxx gave to me regarding your order and
confirm it has been refunded". I was later refunded.

On the positive side they were very friendly, but overall I was rather underwhelmed.

 

[nowaycomputer]

..... back on topic.

I recently cancelled my order with gp2x.co.uk.

I had ordered a 270mhz unit expecting 24 hours delivery as quoted. My credit card was billed straight away.
After three days I emailed a query, I got no response. A week after my order was placed I called up and was told that an email was just about to go out to me explaining that they had run out of 270mhz units, would I like a 266mhz and a £5 refund? I cancelled and was assured my money would be refunded straight away.

A day later I got an email offering the 266mhz unit for a £5 refund! I responded confirming my order as cancelled. I got a reply saying: "Sorry I had missed the note xxxx gave to me regarding your order and
confirm it has been refunded". I was later refunded.

On the positive side they were very friendly, but overall I was rather underwhelmed.

If you're in the UK, it might be worth watching this thread: http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?showt...5188&st=730

There's a few people there who have ordered from Play-Asia. If they don't get stung for import tax / VAT, its a bargain (<£90) although its not guaranteed to overclock to 266 or 270. Even if they do get stung for tax, it still comes to a little over £100 (assuming 17.5% VAT). Delivery starts from about £10 iirc. A bargain compared to gp2x.co.uk.

 

[kfc v lot]

..... back on topic.

I recently cancelled my order with gp2x.co.uk.

I had ordered a 270mhz unit expecting 24 hours delivery as quoted. My credit card was billed straight away.
After three days I emailed a query, I got no response. A week after my order was placed I called up and was told that an email was just about to go out to me explaining that they had run out of 270mhz units, would I like a 266mhz and a £5 refund? I cancelled and was assured my money would be refunded straight away.

A day later I got an email offering the 266mhz unit for a £5 refund! I responded confirming my order as cancelled. I got a reply saying: "Sorry I had missed the note xxxx gave to me regarding your order and
confirm it has been refunded". I was later refunded.

On the positive side they were very friendly, but overall I was rather underwhelmed.

If you're in the UK, it might be worth watching this thread: http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?showt...5188&st=730

There's a few people there who have ordered from Play-Asia. If they don't get stung for import tax / VAT, its a bargain (<£90) although its not guaranteed to overclock to 266 or 270. Even if they do get stung for tax, it still comes to a little over £100 (assuming 17.5% VAT). Delivery starts from about £10 iirc. A bargain compared to gp2x.co.uk.

Thanks for this its just what i was wanting, how much would it be + import duty???
i would try and work it out but ma brains kinda messed up this mornin (NEVER again will i drink 2Ls of cheap ass vodka or any vodka on that note...)