Karel Jansens said:
I'm sorry, I cannot vote, because the option "I'll cancel my order if I can't get the layout that satisfies me" is not an option for me.
I will however cancel my order if the developers choose to ignore the community's decision on the keyboard layout. That decision is not the layout I prefer, but it is nevertheless the layout that should be used.
See the difference?
Karel,
Thats going overboard big time.
cosurgi:
1: That the layout decision was final by a poll was never agreed upon by the developers. They where going to take things in consideration as the followed the discussion. But i never one's saw any of them write: "Sure, whoever wins, we will use, no mather what"...
2: This is one that really pisses me off: "your will see that only 240 from among 4000 people". This is claiming that the poll in question regarding International characters, is opposed by 3760 people. No, this is whats called PR spin-doctoring off the first class. Only 240 people voted on the options, and thats it. Most off those 4000 people are not even present on this forum, or are lurking ( meaning no vote, as you need a account to vote ).
This amount off spin-doctoring makes a already bias push to get your layout approved look even worse ( even more so, when you start mailing the developers ). I have never put my disappointment under the chair about the PR / Communication off the developers in the past ( thank god *figure of speech* for the community blog ), but imho trying to push your agenda by mail, is a no go in my eyes. You may disagree ...
2b: Compose and AltGr is really valuable on a limited keyboard. Its freaking even used less then CTRL-ALT. And those are just less then Point-Comma. O see, i win, lets all do what i say not? O wait?
The best people to know what layout will be the best from
experience, is those that actually use the product ( or samples )! And the people who actually have samples are the developers.
3: There have been a few things that have bothered me about that poll from the start.
3a) One, your layout was primary. Then you have another 3 layout alternatives ( taking about 70% off the post restate ).
Only then you see Kagato layout. To be honest, i wonder if i need to hold a poll, to see how many people noticed Kagato's layout?
Hell, i typed in the wrong name in one off the reply's to it, talking about Kagato's layout but using Cosurgi's name wrongly.
Then there is the 4th layout, your alternative one ( "in case Kagato's design" ), with the . and , as special function ( green ). This by itself has troubled the water ( as you can tell in some off the reply's ).In my honest opinion, its breaking the rules already by using the "mouse toggle" as a way to draw in some off the . , voters.
This gives people who might vote for Kagato's design, the illusion, that your 4th layout, is your primary. That almost screams "If you pick Kagato's, please, still pick mine".
Also, the discussion was for a large part ALT, CTRL vs Point, Comma on the primary keys.
This poll options does not reflect that.
Cosurgi -
Alt, Ctrl on the keyboard [ 189 ] ** [54.15%]
Kagato -
Alt, Ctrl on shoulders [ 160 ] ** [45.85%]
Anybody notice the problem? A large part off the discussion have been going on about the CTRL-ALT vs Point-Comma. Very neutral poll indeed...
For a poll, you need to have 1 layout each, and not multi layouts. And you need a set standard.
Remember, with statistics you can prove anything, as long as the questions are made to favor the answer you want.
My opinion:
Keys that are standard ( white ), need to be one's that you use on a regular base. CTRL & ALT do not fit that bill. I said it then, and i will gladly say it again. How many times do you use CTRL & ALT on your daily work? How many times do you use Point & Comma. A keyboard layout is to generate the maximum off comfort, and usability.
The only reason why i see that you need CTRL for any large amount, is using emacs. If that is the case, then we can all start voting of putting " : " as default, well, i use VI. So, lets make that a default key! O wait.
Sorry if this comes over hardly, but something like those poll's need to be done by a neutral party. I did not see the president debates going ... Hey, Obama, you make the questions, and let somebody form your team lecturer them. No. Both party's view the rules, look over the question, and decide by coin toss or approval who goes first. Because we all know, that a lot off things can swing the vote off people.
And to be honest, i looked at the Pandora rendering, and you did not see me go "Yes, we won, wieeee, point comma won!". No, my reason was: "Looks good", lets get to production. The font looked good, and the layout did not bother me. Thats how it needs to be.
