What's happening today


benji_stein said:
Are you talking about my massive, deep pondering ramblings (like in the instant Pandora thread)? Or the one where I question the incredibly vague and imprecise statements made by Craig, and ask for some clarification, like earlier in this thread?


Mostly just wondering which people are finding more offensive. No promises to stop. :p
I wasn't going +1 these guys, but seeing as you asked. By asking countless very specific questions it seems you are trying to catch OPT contradicting themselves. The fact that you hold up things said previously as part of your question kind of confirms it. Sorry, but unless you are a lawyer in a court room, that kind of behavior is known as "douchebaggery".
 
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I wasn't going +1 these guys, but seeing as you asked. By asking countless very specific questions it seems you are trying to catch OPT contradicting themselves. The fact that you hold up things said previously as part of your question kind of confirms it. Sorry, but unless you are a lawyer in a court room, that kind of behavior is known as "douchebaggery".

OPT has been saying confusing things for a long time, not least of which are poor, best-case estimates that even in best-case are unreasonable.


However, Craig in particular makes very many misleading statements (I think intentionally) that are prone to being interpreted in a multitude of ways. Here in particular, I ask a number of very specific questions to get clarification, because the statements were ambiguous. I'm not trying to trip them up, just get a straight answer. I take B-ZaR's rules to hear - and never assume.


Consider Craig's "Tomorrow we start building another 500 units". That wasn't 500 boards in Pandoras, like a lot of people thought.


If quoting the question I'm talking about makes me a douche, then so be it. But you quoted my question, too.
 
benji_stein said:
But you quoted my question, too.
If you have another read, I believe you'll find I quoted your question in order to answer it. I did not direct any interrogative questions in your direction.


Can't you tell the difference? I mean look, craigx says "We probably won't allow more than 100 premium Pandora consoles to be sold" and you come out with "Will you, or will you not be limiting the 100 premium Pandoras to 100". Is that really necessary?


Or this, craigx says "now they know what they are doing (and voices from higher up seem to have done wonders) they can speed up if we can pay them to." to which you reply "Shouldn't you know already whether they *can* do this? Do you have proof, other than their say-so? Have they demonstrated it? Do you have a contract in writing of minimum numbers shipped? Why did it take so long to get the voices from higher up?"


He's covered your question. You are basically asking Craig to prove he is not a lair. This is Bad Form.
 
Mr benji_stein,


How do you know I actually exist? I could just be several people posting on here under the name Craigix.


We have not seen Craig in a video in over a year.


I've also heard rumours that in some of the later photos of the Pandora the camera data listed the owner as 'Byron Wildgoose'.


Who is Byron? Where did his incredible surname come from?


I think you should investigate.
 
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Mr benji_stein,


How do you know I actually exist? I could just be several people posting on here under the name Craigix.


We have not seen Craig in a video in over a year.


I've also heard rumours that in some of the later photos of the Pandora the camera data listed the owner as 'Byron Wildgoose'.


Who is Byron? Where did his incredible surname come from?


I think you should investigate.
Hahah Craig! You might make him actually believe you. ;)
 
Yeah, I like how craig adds fun to the fourms and makes the waiting less painful.


Unprofessional = Win!
 
...Showing you eating cold beans out of a can...
Sorry, but I have to...


THE. NOODLE. INCIDENT.


Were noodles close enough?

https://www.youtube.com/embed/AMZsJIyv4ys?feature=oembed (near end of video)

(executes IRET and returns to reading rest of thread)


EDIT: Having now read the rest of the thread:


Craig: Are you SURE you aren't still using that throat medicine with the speed in it?


benji_stein: I'm on your side - screw those other guys (not 3jane - hey btw - IF you are a lawyer in a courtroom arguing about stupid stuff like most court cases - it's known as 'douchebaggery' ;) ) who told you to stop asking questions. There's nothing wrong with his questions. Seriously, you must be really new(again, not 3jane. hah), not just looking at your post count(you could have >loads< of posts on gp32x), but that you apparently have not seen worse questions - take a look at some of Blue Protoman's posts in the "Ask Craig Questions" thread (what a troll :p - but he's not um - all troll - he's a 'half-breed' :D ) - or go on youtube and look at the pandora videos, bad-question central there. Must be yahoo users (not using google). I don't care what your opinion of this post is. Just as much as the rest of you don't care for my opinion ;) .


fraseyboy, vadsamoht, frostedfires: +1337.
 
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IF you are a lawyer in a courtroom arguing about stupid stuff like most court cases - it's known as 'douchebaggery' ;)

Objection! *slams hands on stand*


. . .


(I'm incredibly offended-- but I should probably stick to the facts...)


It's known as cross-examination!!!!


EDIT: nerdy references aside, I have absolutely no problem with real-life cross-examination, and to me, it doesn't matter if you are in a courtroom or not, if someone is lying, and you can prove it, then it's the liar's fault, not yours for calling them out on it. Of course, I also recognise the difference between an outright "lie" and an "accidental contradiction."
 
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If you have another read, I believe you'll find I quoted your question in order to answer it. I did not direct any interrogative questions in your direction.

And I use his quotes because I'm referring to those, too.

Can't you tell the difference? I mean look, craigx says "We probably won't allow more than 100 premium Pandora consoles to be sold" and you come out with "Will you, or will you not be limiting the 100 premium Pandoras to 100". Is that really necessary?

You haven't been here long, have you. "Probably" is prone to much flexibility in Craig-speak. And there's no mention of timescale, either. (Never offer Premium Pandoras again? 100 a week?) There's a world of difference between "we won't" and "we might not". I just want to find out which planet we're on. For my sanity, and understanding of the setup with the Premium Pandoras, yes, I want to know that answer.

Or this, craigx says "now they know what they are doing (and voices from higher up seem to have done wonders) they can speed up if we can pay them to." to which you reply "Shouldn't you know already whether they *can* do this? Do you have proof, other than their say-so? Have they demonstrated it? Do you have a contract in writing of minimum numbers shipped? Why did it take so long to get the voices from higher up?"

Again, have you been paying attention to the happenings with the case company? They lied through the teeth about producing those 2500 boards, which hadn't been started. They originally claimed they could do 500 boards a week, and then could barely clear 200 (maybe 250). Sure, that was a long time ago, and maybe things have changed. But after all this time, why should we take them at their word? There have been so many setbacks in this project because of hopes about proposed production speeds that weren't attainable. So, I'm curious what extra knowledge (if any) he has to believe this is doable. Because CC keeps saying that they'll give us a revised schedule/contract, but OPT hasn't told us it's happened yet, and I'm inclined to believe that they'd sure tell us when they do, since it would be a Big Deal.


I want this project to succeed after the three years I've been watching it, I really do. And the last thing I want to see right now is for Craig to hire a bunch more assemblers, and then they just sit around twiddling their thumbs because CC *still* can't keep up with our needs.

He's covered your question. You are basically asking Craig to prove he is not a lair. This is Bad Form.

No, not trying to call him a liar. Read above. But I *still* think the statements were ambiguous, and he *still* hasn't re-clarified. He'll answer all sorts of random questions, but when it comes down to this one, notice how he avoids. Clearly reading the thread, though, to respond.


@Craigix - I think you exist because I've seen enough videos and photos to believe it. And because even if this were a ponzi scheme (note that I do not think this, purely a hypothetical), it would still need some real faces. :)


And since I've got you, it's unfortunate that CC only sent 300 last week? Did they give a reason? You'd said repeatedly that they were due for 500. What happened on their end?


@doublebeta - Thanks. :)


@AquaAnalogue - I agree completely. Contradictions are fine.
 
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Oopps. Wasn't all the talk at about building 500 units a week?


Now I read this Twitter:


300 new boards on their way from CC, we're building another 200 this week. Oh, and MAJOR iCP news later this week (finally).


It can be understood in a way that it says: We are building 200 units this week. Which would be way below 500.


OTOH it could say: 300+200 (=500). I am confused.


Benji_Stein, please investigate :)
 
Mr benji_stein,


How do you know I actually exist? I could just be several people posting on here under the name Craigix.


We have not seen Craig in a video in over a year.


I've also heard rumours that in some of the later photos of the Pandora the camera data listed the owner as 'Byron Wildgoose'.


Who is Byron? Where did his incredible surname come from?


I think you should investigate.

Confirmed. The Pandora Exists, Craig does not. If you don't believe me it's because I am a liar. The cake is a lie. The Craig is a lie. I know this for a fact, for I have gotten the truth of the lie directly from Byron Wildgoose, who is undoubtedly the most honest liar one could ever know. Long live the Pandora. Long live the liars. Let the streets flow with the blood of the non-believers. HAHAHAHA (Evil laugh) :p :lol:
 
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Benji,


Are you Bill O'Reilley from the Fox? Is this investigative journalism at its finest?


"Tide comes in tide goes out. Sun goes up Sun goes down. Never a miscommunication."


Well Mr O Reilley, there are things known as earthquakes that cause tsunamis. There are also hurricanes. Tide charts do not account for either act of god.
 
I just love how almost EVERY sentence from whoever from the OpenPandora team gets completely ripped apart, analyzed, debunked, restructured, quoted a bazillion times, and whatnot. One sentence from Craig or EvilDragon is transfered into a whole book with a thick layer of "Professor Nonsense" talk. And nowadays even the mainstream Internet media is going completely berserk in the very same manner.


Ugh!
 
Oopps. Wasn't all the talk at about building 500 units a week?


Now I read this Twitter:


300 new boards on their way from CC, we're building another 200 this week. Oh, and MAJOR iCP news later this week (finally).


It can be understood in a way that it says: We are building 200 units this week. Which would be way below 500.


OTOH it could say: 300+200 (=500). I am confused.


Benji_Stein, please investigate :)

Well... it could also be understood to mean "300 more boards are coming in so we will be able to build an extra 200 units this week."


See, if one assumes the 500 to already have been built that would bring the total to 700.


That's the trouble with taking statements made in different contexts and trying to put them together. in order to build a common context one has to make an assumption, which means any conclusions reached by this method are suspect at best.


Edit: grammar check
 
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