Update regarding the cases (and some other things)


@EvilDragon @Askarus

I wish to volunteer my help to help resolve the matter with the cases.
As a bi-lingual speaker of both English and Greek, is there anything I can do to help with FormAction, such as helping to translate any emails etc ? I live in the UK, but I am on holidays in Berlin for the next 2 days, if that helps.
 
My two cents as a Pyra pre-orderer, silent forum lurker and former small community moderator.
I find it frustrating that people and especially ED have to spend time dealing with the toxic behavior of @m@t. This person consumes the precious time and motivation of Team Pyra in ways that contribute next to nothing to the project and the threads he participates in, and even trigger toxic behavior from other members that would otherwise behave peacefully. Although simply ignoring him may be an option, I think it’s really not feasible if ED himself repeatedly spends time making long thorough answers to him. I understand that it is a response to abusive people to try to show them and everyone else that their arguments are invalid, but as @m@t showed us several times already, it is simply pointless as the same questions and accusations will always come back eventually.

I understand that the Pyra is a “hobby” project that consumes a (relative) lot of money and that every pre-order is important. But is it so important that the forum has to tolerate people whose behavior threaten the promised awesomeness of the community? I think mods should deal with toxic behavior before it spreads and makes the community an unpleasant place that would repel old and new members, and incidentally new sales. I agree that it would make it seem that the moderation team tries to silence dissenting voices as some failing KickStarter projects do. But in this particular case, I think @m@t has talked enough to prove that he’s not making a constructive nor enjoyable contribution, and ED talks enough to prove that he’s open and honest in general as well as when he’s faced with valid criticism.

PS: If it means anything to anyone, I did pre-order the Pyra and even added a voucher and a donation. And I don’t care when the Pyra lands into my hands. I care about how awesome and special it is when it does, and the fact that I funded a project consistent with my values. I guess I’m an idealist. Also, I’m sorry I rarely comment and it ends up being about this kind of subjects, I’ll try to refrain now that I’ve stated my opinion.
 
@EvilDragon @Askarus

I wish to volunteer my help to help resolve the matter with the cases.
As a bi-lingual speaker of both English and Greek, is there anything I can do to help with FormAction, such as helping to translate any emails etc ? I live in the UK, but I am on holidays in Berlin for the next 2 days, if that helps.

Thanks a lot, but as mentioned, I already have a contact directly sitting in Thessaloniki.
He is from Germany (the son of one of the co-workers of my wife) and he is doing all the discussing and translating :)
 
So it sounds like the case company is the last big hurdle to the initial production run. Hopefully that will not be as much of a headache as is being anticipated.

If one wants to speak towards the integrity of EvilDragon, let's frame things properly in terms of what amount to his competitors.

GCW of the GCW Zero fame four years later has people who haven't collected hardware associated with their Kickstarter, and as far as I can tell from the outside appear to have basically shutdown operations as their resellers have been out of stock for a rather long time.

GPD is shipping the GPD Win and will soon be shipping the GPD Pocket. While in principle their hardware is not bad, people have had significant issues with lemons.

ImasD is having their own teething issues and grumbling with what will hopefully be a successful project from a yet untested company with the Smach Z.

EvilDragon has a good track record to not leave backers hanging as much as he's able, and the delays on the Pyra have largely been associated with Engineering work intended to make the best product possible. Fixing stuff before production properly starts is how such issues should be handled.
 
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And I know this is quite a long wait - and honestly: If you ever consider starting such a project... don't. It's really really stressful.
Well, there are certain (chinese) companies that could do such an task within a year, I'm sure. ;) Of course you must be chinese for that so the gouvernment does support you with anything you need, bad for western companies I guess. When I see what chinese products can be those days and in what quantity they push out the craziest stuff in compard short time, I wonder when they finaly take over world domination...can't be take long... ^^""
I recently recieved my little FiiO E10 USB DAC for my PC, great little thingy, FiiO is a pure chinese (audio) Company, I never thought to buy an pure chinese electronics product...

For example, the cases. You hired a company which is working on the cases and they have issues and delays.
You don't have the funds to hire a differrent nor to hire a person who is constantly in Greece to check with then regularly.
How would you handle that?
I'm really interested to see your solution.
You mentioned that the Case is really complex. Well, besides that I agree and besides I find it really ugly too, just out of curiosity, ask some western or german molding companies if they could even do such an complex case within time. They want more money for sure but it's not even sure if they would have been any better or faster than the cheaper greek company. Maybe LEGO could do that, they can do anything actualy... :D
 
Well, there are certain (chinese) companies that could do such an task within a year, I'm sure. ;)

Well, I haven't seen one.
Most companies either use pre-existing hardware and put a case around them (most tablets, smartphones, etc.)

If you open those, you often find the same PCBs as in other chinese tablets.

Or they're using a reference design and just rebuild it the size they need and slap their own case around it (i.e. GPD, JXD, etc.).

I've never really seen a complex device designed from scratch that came from China.
 
True. Well, no clue if you would have been able to built an good Pyra with mostly using various existing reference designs. I guess it was not possible back then or even is possible today. Don't know what GPD did, I guess they also had some good bunch of custom designs, inside their WIN at least?
I know that reference designs can also make stuff complicated, the story with the rotator chip comes in mind. You did nothing wrong there and keept the suggestions from the companies who did this chip AFAIK. But it still did not work or ever will work. I blame them.
 
True. Well, no clue if you would have been able to built an good Pyra with mostly using various existing reference designs. I guess it was not possible back then or even is possible today. Don't know what GPD did, I guess they also had some good bunch of custom designs, inside their WIN at least?

Not that many, actually. It's mostly a standard reference design for the chip. The DPad / etc. switch is something unique... but there's not really anything else that's non-standard.
And they made the PCB big enough to keep the amount of work as simple as possible.

Well, we also followed a reference design partly: That of the uEVM (which has some bugs in there as well, as we found out).
But we cramped everything onto very tiny space - that was what really took that long.

I know that reference designs can also make stuff complicated, the story with the rotator chip comes in mind. You did nothing wrong there and keept the suggestions from the companies who did this chip AFAIK. But it still did not work or ever will work. I blame them.

The chip was and is working, the hardware is fine.
But the chip expects a command stream instead of a video stream, and Linux doesn't really support that.

So the only issue we had was missing VSync, but not because of the hardware but the software (well, and because of a stupid design the rotator chip had... it could've easily be created to simply use the VSync from the video stream, but they messed that up).
 
to say them to speed up their work, phone the team leader rather than visit them. You will save time and money.
 
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Wasn't the 4GB RAM only available like since 2 Months™ ago?


Allowing people to discusses makes the board great. You can surely disagree with other views but we shouldn't sends critical people away. Maybe someones has a good suggestion or more people wonder and nows it gets an answer. (surely complaining for sake of complaining doesn't always help though :) )
I preordered October/September sometime last year and that had the option for 4GB (although, I'm not sure when it was first tested)
 
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I am actually very concerned when people like m@t continues to pressure for "production runs".

This is clearly a very complex device both in terms of hardware and software and everything is certainly not 100% sorted.

The goal should not be to "get everything ordered" (prematurely).
The goal should be to get the prototype in the hands of the people that know what they are doing.
Imagine the level of whining of people like m@t if they would be handed a Pyra in its current state.

ED, I beg you don't give in to their pressure. Make it as awesome as you dreamed...
 
I am actually very concerned when people like m@t continues to pressure for "production runs".

This is clearly a very complex device both in terms of hardware and software and everything is certainly not 100% sorted.

The goal should not be to "get everything ordered" (prematurely).
The goal should be to get the prototype in the hands of the people that know what they are doing.
Imagine the level of whining of people like m@t if they would be handed a Pyra in its current state.

ED, I beg you don't give in to their pressure. Make it as awesome as you dreamed...
Well so far everytime I've seen a complaint, it's been by m@t everytime so I just started ignoring.
 
Some People did not understand the Project and Delay Times.
I was one of the Preorders of the OpenPandora and Upgraded to "PremiumPreorder" for Helping the entire Pandora Project in that Time.
And everytime the Pandora was delayed again (2MonthTM) i still waited and understand the Problems because EvilDragons friendly and factical News.
He is the Man behind nearly all and have so much work to bring the Pyra alive for us.

The last Pyra release Date i know was April and i hoped realy i can hold my Pyra on my Birthday in my Hands...
..
..but every Delay is for Tweaking/FixingErrors good.

When the Pyra comes too fast then we maybe have Memory or Heating Problems or other angry Things.

For me its no Problem to wait and get a fully working Device who fullfill all my Whishes.

The tweaking with the Dpad or Buttons on the Keyboard was very Important too and i am glad that EvilDragon did this.

I waited Years for my Pandora and i have no Problems to wait for the Pyra too.

Shurly..i whish i had the Pyra on my Aprils Birthday but what when all go too much hurry and you have maybe a half working/80% working unfinished Device?

You read not much from me in the Newsposts because i still waiting for the Pyra and read the News with Patience and understand when Problems delay finishing the Device.

@EvilDragon
You do a wonderfull Job and have good Helpers like Askarus.
I think i can say for many of us here:
Thank you for realizing a Device like the Pyra for us :D
 
Because some people here bullied out every critical voice!
Yes there seems to be some harsh backlash from what you are saying, some are pretty toxic in my opinion. But you need to understand your views of how the project is and should be are WAY out of touch with the majority of the Community.
 
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