Remember The Gizmondo?

[Epicenter]

Those are called demonstrations and proof of concept with existing software. It's not like that's all the machine can run. I am unimpressed by how Quake 3 runs, yes, but I don't really care, as that level of performance on 3 assures I and II will run superbly, and the 2D acceleration capabilities I desire so strongly are already there if it can push that many polygons successfully.

GP has stated via e-mail the machine will be open to development and an SDK will be made. What more do you really need to hear, there? Why do you think they care so much what people on GP32X think?

Release date this, release date that. They are DESIGNING the machines. You don't make a release date when you are in that stage, or it's purely artificial.

GP does not still seem to be interested in going toe-to-toe with Nintendo or Sony, they've made that clear by way of their statements. Another reason they concern themselves with the issues brought up by GP32X posters, they know their community is smaller than that. As for commercial games, who cares if GP officially sponsors them or develops them? I care about getting a good development platform that just might run some excellent emulators and play music/videos as well .. which the machines will facilitate.

Again with the analog stick .. did you read my posts at all? GP is leaning towards installing a D-Pad instead of an analog stick due to the much higher outpouring of support for one, as well as the significantly lower cost.

I agree they should not release 3 systems, I suggested one very well designed, lower-cost handheld. Hopefully they decide to do this. I am not holding my breath given how much press they've made about XGP/XGP Mini and XGP Kids so far. But we'll see.

 

[BobBorakovitz]

we'll see, I guess... I just don't understand the hardon everyone's getting over this system that's nothing more than talk and a prototype or 3.

Yes, they SHOULD have a release date ready...or at least a date they're aiming for. You guys could be waiting 5 years for this thing.

They SHOULD listen to the community, since that's going to be their main source of income. That's who is going to support their users (not like they're gonna do it) It's like shooting yourself in the foot, not listening to customers or potential customers.

They SHOULD have a website somewhere. What it can/can't do. Price, hardware, software, info about the SDK so potential devs don't HAVE to email them, etc.

That's all I'm going to say about this system. This is already WAY more time than I want to spend in the XGP Subforum. Later! (or not.)

 

[Epicenter]

GPH didn't provide anywhere near that level of info before release, and they provide almost no information now. Your aguments make absolutely no sense. Building a machine around an SoC isn't hard-- it's not very easy to screw up. GPH apparently just made all these mistakes on the GP2X either because they're a new company, or because they have no idea what they're doing. Or both. It's not like the XGP is some terrifyingly experimental concept-- it's just another machine like the GP2X with some more careful thought behind the design .. that's why it is taking so long. If the XGP series will be like the GP2X's launch, I don't want to see it. That was a complete fiasco and we both know it.

Also, the most pressing question is why should GP be posting XGP specs and SDK details when they HAVEN'T DECIDED ON THE MACHINES' CONFIGURATIONS YET?! Even so they DID post preliminary specs if you were paying any attention at all. http://www.gamepark.com Are you blind? Which part isn't clear to you?

 

[awakenjsy]

we'll see, I guess... I just don't understand the hardon everyone's getting over this system that's nothing more than talk and a prototype or 3.

Yes, they SHOULD have a release date ready...or at least a date they're aiming for. You guys could be waiting 5 years for this thing.

If you don’t understand why people are talking about “vaporware”, you shouldn’t be here reading what people have said about XGP. No one is putting a gun against you. Also, about a year ago, did you know the exact launch date of Nintendo and Sony’s next generation console? No. You would probably had no idea when those new console will be released because Nintendo and Sony didn’t announce the official release of Wii and PS3. GP just told the people that they will be developing 3 different systems but they didn’t mention the official release date of their systems. So it is quite natural for you or actually all of us to wonder about the exact launch date of their devices. But don’t assume that their products are vaporware just because they have not said anything about the official release date.

Furthermore, you have mentioned commercial games on your previous post. Yes, I agree with you that with no good commercial games, they have no chance of surviving in the games market. This is why they are working with some game developers to create or license the games for their systems. Even if there are no commercial games for their system, their products are open source which means that it also can be used as emulator device just like gp32 and gp2x

 

[BobBorakovitz]

Damnit, I'm roped in again by an XGP fanboy

GPH didn't provide anywhere near that level of info before release, and they provide almost no information now. Your aguments make absolutely no sense. Building a machine around an SoC isn't hard-- it's not very easy to screw up. GPH apparently just made all these mistakes on the GP2X either because they're a new company, or because they have no idea what they're doing. Or both. It's not like the XGP is some terrifyingly experimental concept-- it's just another machine like the GP2X with some more careful thought behind the design .. that's why it is taking so long. If the XGP series will be like the GP2X's launch, I don't want to see it. That was a complete fiasco and we both know it.

I disagree 100% with that last statement. The GP2x's launch was NOT a fiasco, if it was, everyone with a 1st edition GP2x would have returned it. My unit is 100% functional, the firmware updates are fine, I have no problem with it AT ALL! I've owned it since the 2nd week it was out. You talk like you enjoy your GP2x, but you sit there and trash it. Just sell the damn thing then and sit in the XGP forum forever waiting for your beloved POS 3d system. Enjoy. Plus, my arguments are fine, you need to take the blinders off and give them back to your horse. DON'T assume you know everything, because you certainly don't know anywhere near that much. You say careful thought, I say lazy bastards taking forever to do everything in the book wrong anyway.

Also at the most pressing question is why should GP be posting XGP specs and SDK details when they HAVEN'T DECIDED ON THE MACHINES' CONFIGURATIONS YET?! Even so they DID post preliminary specs if you were paying any attention at all. http://www.gamepark.com Are you blind? Which part isn't clear to you?

maybe that's the friggin problem that I've been arguing. They need to get their asses on the ball and do something. They do nothing but talk, and you guys support them like they're gods or something. Enjoy what you have, IF something else comes along better, then look into it. But you guys are acting on blind faith alone. I think that is pretty retarded.

About that website, boy, it'd be nice for something to be in english, is that too much to ask for? Why would someone on these boards actually write an email to someone who doesn't even speak english on their own website? I wouldn't even consider it. I don't need some engrish reply back that I have to decipher with a ring from a box of froot loops.

 

[awakenjsy]

About that website, boy, it'd be nice for something to be in english, is that too much to ask for? Why would someone on these boards actually write an email to someone who doesn't even speak english on their own website? I wouldn't even consider it. I don't need some engrish reply back that I have to decipher with a ring from a box of froot loops.

GP web in Eng

 

[BobBorakovitz]

Even if there are no commercial games for their system, their products are open source which means that it also can be used as emulator device just like gp32 and gp2x

sounds like I pissed off another fanboy :rolleyes:

maybe it'll be open source, maybe not. I've yet to see that on their website (not that I speak Korean) Didn't Gamepark split because some people wanted to make an open source system but the others didn't? The people that did want the open source went and started GPH. That sounds really familiar, but I'd have to research that some more...

and what does the GP2x not do that the XGP will do better? not a whole lot.

the XGP has been talked about for about a year. If they STILL haven't decided on the finishing specs, then you have a REALLY LONG time to wait. ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY'RE DEVELOPING 3 SYSTEMS! That's 2 too many.

Plus, if they don't want to listen to the community, then I deffinately don't want anything to do with it. That is one of the things I liked about the GP2x when it was being developed. They actually listened to the community and added some things that we wanted. It sounds to me like all the smart people left Gamepark and created GPH.

The ONLY thing that would keep me buying one at this point would be if there was backwards compatibility with the GP32. Other than that, I'm fine with all my other handhelds.

About that website, boy, it'd be nice for something to be in english, is that too much to ask for? Why would someone on these boards actually write an email to someone who doesn't even speak english on their own website? I wouldn't even consider it. I don't need some engrish reply back that I have to decipher with a ring from a box of froot loops.

GP web in Eng

I'll give you that one. I missed the horribly placed link :rolleyes:

 

[Epicenter]

Wow, you have no idea what you're talking about. You can't be a fanboy of a nonexistant system. I know the hardware in the machine quite well, and it's quality stuff. I know the hardware I suggested, the S3C2460, very well and it's even better. I'm trying to get them to make the machines the best they can be so I have the ideal development platform, but until things are finalized, nothing really 'exists' yet and I can't exactly be a fanboy .. but a well-wisher for the concept of the XGP.

You talk like you enjoy your GP2x, but you sit there and trash it. Just sell the damn thing then and sit in the XGP forum forever waiting for your beloved POS 3d system.

I do enjoy the machine, I am developing a commercial game for it, for god's sake. But the stick drives me nuts and I've had the machine in pieces for a week trying to get a decent d-pad into it, and I'd like customers of my game to not have to go nuts with their controls and think my software is a piece of shit for it. Which is why I am excited about the XGP as a development platform.

I disagree 100% with that last statement. The GP2x's launch was NOT a fiasco, if it was, everyone with a 1st edition GP2x would have returned it. My unit is 100% functional, the firmware updates are fine, I have no problem with it AT ALL! I've owned it since the 2nd week it was out.

Well, I have a non-1st edition MK1, the D-Pad is still as terrible a piece of shit as ever, the headphone jack physically fell off, as did 2 capacitors. The graphic artist on our team is complaining all the time of his screen flicking in a disgusting fashion and exhibiting awful flashing scanline issues worse than my unit. The assistant programmer has the same problem. That's ridiculous. I've been approached by Craig, GPH's 'ambassador', about developing games commercially for GPH then later had my face spat in and was told off in an exceedingly rude fashion later. That doesn't make you think the company's looking out for your best interests, does it? So, I'm not going to expect them to produce a superior product, the one that rushed theirs to market and created a lovely pile of miniature disasters in the process. I'm going to expect a company that's taking their time to do things right. If you want the XGP rushed, fine, you can enjoy your machine that's duct-taped together with wires hanging out from 'last minute corrections'.

A site in English too much to ask for? Maybe, the COMPANY IS IN SOUTH KOREA, YOU IDIOT. Engrish? I got replies that were in fantastic English. Their PR guy, Nathan, speaks better English than half the native English-speakers I meet on the internet.

Enjoy what you have, IF something else comes along better, then look into it. But you guys are acting on blind faith alone. I think that is pretty retarded.

Who's acted on anything? We've e-mailed the company about how best to design their machines so in the future we can buy them and be as satisfied with them as possible. You suggest we see what GP makes with no input of ours, and then later down the line when the XGP series comes out, we should buy it exactly as-is and any problems we have with it, we should just be content with? No thanks, I've been there before. Anyone remember that little machine from Gamepark Holdings? I'm sure someone here does who doesn't look back on the launch of the machine with lovely rose-colored glasses like yours.

Perhaps you view e-mailing a company about a product that isn't out yet as a crime, I don't. If you want to keep up that lovely attitude of yours, why don't you just keep it out of the forum of the nonexistant machine that offends you so much ...

 

[BobBorakovitz]

actually, i'm getting a kick out of pissing you off at this point.
You call me an idiot? you act like an insulting 13 year old kid. Now I realize why you want a 3d system. You probably have no respect for the classics. I don't even know if I believe you when you say you're creating a commercial game.

I'm sorry for your hassles with the GP2x, but I'll be glad when you leave it. Most people haven't the troubles with their hardware as you and your supposed graphics artist. I had a minor problem with one trace of my headphone jack needing to be resoldered and that was it. I still use the original joystick cap, my joystick works fine, although I would've liked a dpad I can deal with the stick, it's not that bad. My screen has no lines, it looks beautiful.

WTF did you do to your unit? Drop it off the roof? Also, don't blame GP2x because you can't put in a dpad. That's your fault. My unit has no duct tape, but your crappy mod probably is done with duct tape and wires hanging out. Mine looks perfectly original

If you guys quit replying to my post, I'll go away. As long as you keep replying, I'll be here to retort. Have a nice day. (or not.)

 

[Epicenter]

Plus, if they don't want to listen to the community, then I deffinately don't want anything to do with it. That is one of the things I liked about the GP2x when it was being developed. They actually listened to the community and added some things that we wanted. It sounds to me like all the smart people left Gamepark and created GPH.

In case you have just been reading every other line of my replies or something, their openness about the design process, the fact that they are open to suggestions and stated what GP32X posters think means a lot to them, and that their PR department speaks excellent English are huge reasons why I am excited about the whole project. They also think like me; they were already considering the SoC I suggested to them!

and what does the GP2x not do that the XGP will do better? not a whole lot.

the XGP has been talked about for about a year. If they STILL haven't decided on the finishing specs, then you have a REALLY LONG time to wait. ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY'RE DEVELOPING 3 SYSTEMS! That's 2 too many.

I admit 3 machines is too much, and I told them that. Hopefully they will change their minds about that.

At any rate, you clearly never developed a thing for the GP2X. You can do a lot with the GP2X's hardware, but its 2D blitter is anemic to say the least. It's just a minor helper, really- and for my purposes, it's pretty much useless in accelerating anything. A true GPU like that present in either SoC that would be used in the XGP would allow the drawing of THOUSANDS of sprites into a scene at a time, not hundreds, or tens, at very high framerate. That's a gigantic advantage-- and it has nothing to do with 3D. Did you hear that? See the pretty boldface font? Are you reading this line or did you skip it? Nothing to do with 3D. Then there's the speed benefits to SNES and GBA emulation. And, some people do want 3D. That's why one of the big advantages it has is that PS1 emulation at full speed is feasible. So is Sega Saturn emulation. And 32X emulation. And Sega CD. And 3DO. And Jaguar..... and for the couple of 3D apps I'd like to run, Quake I/II, those will run massively better on a machine with even a very weak GPU. The one in these 2 SoCs is very powerful, one of the best you can get on an ARM handheld right now.

Plus, if they don't want to listen to the community, then I deffinately don't want anything to do with it. That is one of the things I liked about the GP2x when it was being developed. They actually listened to the community and added some things that we wanted. It sounds to me like all the smart people left Gamepark and created GPH.

Maybe they listened to a few people at the onset, but they sure as hell don't listen now. Craig has stated to me multiple times they will never add a D-Pad because he can play one obscure MegaDrive game effectively with the stick, ignoring the fact that the first page of the forums is always congested with over-10-page threads about D-Pads. Even if they were receptive to their buyers' ideas, they had very little understanding of how their own hardware even worked-- no concept of how the 2D blitter operated, no concept of how to work with the 940T, none of this was ever made clear because GPH clearly had no concept of how the hardware even worked internally. GP's exhibited the opposite thus far.

 

[BobBorakovitz]

now I know your stupid, not even a 2ghz PC can emulate the Saturn smoothly. You think a 500mhz processor will? lol You deffinately don't know what you're talking about

yes, i skip certain parts of your posts just to piss you off, i see it's working wonderfully.

 

[Epicenter]

actually, i'm getting a kick out of pissing you off at this point.
You call me an idiot? you act like an insulting 13 year old kid. Now I realize why you want a 3d system. You probably have no respect for the classics. I don't even know if I believe you when you say you're creating a commercial game.

Holy shit. You really can't read anything but every other line. I haven't bought a modern console besides a GBA/DS since the Dreamcast because I'm disgusted with the entire industry, 80% of my DC games are 2D shooters. All I'll buy for the GBA/DS are also 2D titles. I have a large collection of MD/NES games sitting right here in the room with me, and my HDD has gigs of 16-bit, 8-bit and classic arcade system ROMs. Your crystal ball needs cleaning...

If you want to doubt my work and the rest of your teams, fine, be ignorant. We don't like to spew screenshots of unfinished works like the 3D industry you visibly hate so much does.

I'm sorry for your hassles with the GP2x, but I'll be glad when you leave it. Most people haven't the troubles with their hardware as you and your supposed graphics artist. I had a minor problem with one trace of my headphone jack needing to be resoldered and that was it. I still use the original joystick cap, my joystick works fine, although I would've liked a dpad I can deal with the stick, it's not that bad. My screen has no lines, it looks beautiful.

WTF did you do to your unit? Drop it off the roof? Also, don't blame GP2x because you can't put in a dpad. That's your fault. My unit has no duct tape, but your crappy mod probably is done with duct tape and wires hanging out. Mine looks perfectly original

Again, a failure to read. I said the bit about duct tape and wires about a hypothetical rushed XGP unit. Nothing to do with a mod ... mine, from the factory, has the described faults with the headphone jack and caps. Even after resoldering the jack (as you said you did), guess what? The Right sound channel doesn't work because the jack itself is faulty, not just its soldering. Surprise, surprise...

Actually, if you've been around half as long as you've said, you should've seen lots of threads about the stick being horrible, C106 caps falling off the board, headphone jacks falling off into the unit, scanline issues with the LCD, sticks hitting the left side of the unit and not working correctly in the LEFT direction for that reason-- because the PCB was mounted MISALIGNED.. the fact that the stick is off-center in all units, was oriented the WRONG WAY (the whole reason it had to be rotated for the MK2) .. speakers failing to turn off when the headphones are plugged in, L/R channels going silent due to the jack being a faulty design ... FW 2.0.0 fixed most SOFTWARE issues but if you recall, there was the lovely autobricking saga, massive firmware flashing difficulties, USB connectivity was almost entirely broken for about 9 months.. I could go on for quite a long time like this.

now I know your stupid, not even a 2ghz PC can emulate the Saturn smoothly. You think a 500mhz processor will? lol You deffinately don't know what you're talking about

A 2 GHz PC can't emulate the Saturn smoothly because the only emulator is horrible and inefficient. Ever use the Nebula Model 2 emulator? A year ago, it ran at 10 FPS in Gunblade NY. Now, it runs at 60 FPS on the same hardware. Look at that, it wasn't the hardware's fault, it was just an inefficient program. Why do you think there are NES emulators for the GP2X that run at 60 FPS, and those that struggle to get 30?

And what's this about a 500 Mhz processor? The only SoC I ever recommended GPH was a Samsung S3C2460 with a 266 Mhz ARM9 core and a 3D accelerator that WOULD assist emulation of a machine with advanced 2D or 3D capabilities. Perhaps you are thinking of someone else.

yes, i skip certain parts of your posts just to piss you off, i see it's working wonderfully.

And you call me a whiny 13-year old kid ... I think I'm not the one whose maturity should be called into question.

 

[BobBorakovitz]

I have a game coming out, too...no, wait...i have 10 games coming out...all for a system I hate. But wait, that's not all...I'm not going to release any screenshots of it....just a banner at the bottom of every post I make that doesn't go anywhere



someone move this to the lol files, i'm having a blast

 

[Epicenter]

Some of us don't like to spit out screenshots left and right and would rather make a good impression later down the road, than take the GPH approach and release a broken demo of a game that won't be out on time (I'm looking at you, Odonata.) If you can't respect that, have fun.

If you think I hate the GP2X, you have all the reading comprehension skills of a handful of gravel. I'm done arguing with you; you clearly haven't an ounce of sense in that thick skull of yours. Kindly fuck off.

 

[BobBorakovitz]

just because I don't respond to every last line of your incredibly long-winded posts, doesn't mean I don't comprehend it. You say you don't hate the GP2x, but you certainly trash the hell out of it. I've not seen any points you made that are any good about it. That is called logical deduction. And you're just a complainer, I see that now that you've put your target on another product (odonatta). Not that I'd play odonatta, because it's just another shooter. Very rarely are 2d shooters any fun. If you play one, you've played them all.

thanks for wishing me fun though, I certainly will have lots of it with my 2x

if that is your last response, then this is mine. But, if you want to continue further, I'll be more than happy to oblige.

ps - thanks for putting kindly before fuck off...that was REALLY nice of you!!! WOW!!!

 

[Epicenter]

I dropped this discussion because I want to spare this forum another flamewar. If you mean what you said, please do the same, don't keep editing new insults into your reply.

 

[Iorgy77]

On a lighter note my Gizmondo arived today. Seems a nice little system so far with some polished original games. Checking out the homebrew, emulators and WinCE hacks at the moment. Having fun getting to know this new gadget.

@DaveC: for some reason the emulators look great on the little screen, I can't explain it but they don't look squashed or distorted like the do on the GBA/NDS.

 

[Alex.]

Bob, your arguments against Epicenter are hate-driven and ilogical. In the process you managed to render yourself a narrow-minded fanboy with his head stuck in a GP2X's backside, as well as trashing any software that doesn't meet your tastes, such as 3D games and 2D shooters. You seem to take any complaint directed at the GP2X as a personal offense, which results in degrading posts and not much else.

I actually gain more and more respect for Epicenter every time someone attempts to trash him, because every time that happens he manages to keep his posts intelligent, entertaining, and to the point.

Now know your role...

- Alex

 

[iignotus]

HAY GUYS WHAT'S GOING ON IN THIS THREAD IS IT JUST ME OR IS IT KINDA HOT IN HERE :rolleyes:

 

[JaqMs]

I remember when I was the ONLY XGP fan and everyone hated me :lol:

Anyway bob, even I could have argued with you and win horribly (unlike with iignotus). First of all, you based your "facts" on nothing without doing research first. Then you called Epicenter a 13-year-old newbie when you haven't developed a single thing in your life.

Some people don't want to be too scared to buy a GP2X. Some don't want to make threads with 10-15 questions in it. Some want to look to the future instead of replaying the past. And most importantly, SOME PEOPLE DON'T WANT THE HEADPHONE JACK TO BE ON THE TOP OF THE UNIT!!!

I witnessed the GP2X's release, too, and I also agree that the release was way too rushed. You wouldn't believe how hyped I was about it, until I heard the flood of problems.

I told you guys..old-school emulator nuts...