Pandora Should Move To Android

[bradleyb01]

Purely from a user point of view, I have a Droid and I like it fine, it behaves like a phone/text/email/gps device. It runs the phone competently, sends me my corporate email, the interface is very customizable and has a great gps. Most games for it suck, though. If it didn't break the company policy that I wrote, I would root it and see what the possibilities are then, but that would be hypocritical. So it remains a vanilla android device.

I also have a Pandora which I like better because of Angstrom Linux, behaving like, well, Linux. If anything, I would like to see Debian ARM or Ubuntu ARM as official or semi official OS's for the Pandora rather than Android, but I would be happy with the repository that is being worked on for Angstrom as a compliment to .pnd files. I guess that I consider the Pandora a mini Linux box, not a phone or tablet device, so I would probably not want Android on it.

/end ramble-mode.

 

[Despellanion]

No thanks.

 

[DynaMight]

Yes to dual boot with full hardware support. No to a complete takeover.

Android will get the Pandora in the news and generate more sales, it will be the first Android system with full controls. Android is not just a mobile phone OS imo, Rockplayer plays AVI/MKV files upto 720p extremely well, Webbroswer is very fast, Google Maps is great even without GPS

 

[VRAndy]

Yes to dual boot with full hardware support. No to a complete takeover.

Remember that someone has to actualy make android work on PAndora, write drivers for all its hardware, create some software that uses nubs, etc. A large portion of that effort might have otherwise have gone to making the existing setup better.

Android will get the Pandora in the news and generate more sales,

Right now Craig is already selling more than he's making! Sales can't get better than that.

it will be the first Android system with full controls.

Or, to look at it from another point of view : There is no android software that uses full controls and the vast majority of android developers are more interested in tilt sensors than nubs.

 

[mali]

If it comes to this I'll get a tablet instead.
Good idea to ruin an awesome pocket computer.

If you switch to Android you have to deliver a flawless and bugless experience. Have you got the resources to upgrade every few months. Have you got a staff of developers to maintain the OS? Archos is larger than OP limited, but they still don't manage to iron out bugs fast enough. Selling an overpriced Archos 5 with gaming controls crashing all over the place? Android is mass market. You should tell the paint job factory to use glossy paint <_<

Did you ask notaz, DJWillis and skeezix what they think about it first before asking on the boards? So they like the idea and will develop Android now?

First thing I would do before switching to Android is searching for a better PSU. That would be a pretty good idea. I've heard Android users don't like to be zapped. Before this post becomes a totally awesome sarcasm compilation I better do some work.

 

[DaveC]

Yes to dual boot with full hardware support. No to a complete takeover.

it will be the first Android system with full controls. Android is not just a mobile phone OS imo, Rockplayer plays AVI/MKV files upto 720p extremely well, Webbroswer is very fast, Google Maps is great even without GPS

Well the first with GOOD controls, odroid was the first..

That stuff you mention is what is on phones. How well will it run emulators? 10 less FPS in PSX, or N64, SNES and it is a dealbreaker. Actually any loss if frames is a dealbreaker as the android stuff doesn't interest me. I already have a phone.

 

[greendots]

Shouldn't it be possible to switch between Android and XFCE just like it is to switch between Minimenu and XFCE now? Android is certainly more to load but with a compatable kernel I dont see the issue.

Xfce and Minimenu are interfaces, rather than operating systems, though. I don't think it would be that simple, especially since Android's kernel is, as far as I gather, derived from Linux, rather than actually being a Linux kernel.

Android uses hacks on the linux kernel but I dont think those hacks would not allow it to run an xserver or the other things we want it to.

Edit: Android might emulate games better with its VM running on the frame buffer compared to a full xserver + XFCE

 

[Natasha]

Not sure why people think Android will make these issues go away. Just because Google does work on the main OS doesn't mean the grunts (us!) won't get stuck plugging all the holes for our platform. Hell, Android still doesn't run on my phone without serious issues, and it has a SuperMegaCorp backing it

What? doesn't android just magically load onto the Pandora right from the google website and automatically interface with all of the Pandora SD cards, sound, controls, ports, screen, battery and everything?

Google does provide the solution with all your Android and open-source software issue, in the form of a wonderful search engine

Seeing this thread I strongly doubt the community has a whole would follow our way. My guess is that it would end up with a split into pandroid and other(s?) communities, with the ratio depending on how well android performs. But unless a huge majority end up in the same community, the split would only weaken every side, which would be a lose for everybody.

I'd go as far as thinking such a split would be so detrimental it's a reason good enough to be extremely cautious in a potential Android attempt, no matter how technically superior (or equal) it might be.

I am no dev but I would think they would rather have the current linux environment with the desktop OS etc than some phone interface. How would some devs that like to actually edit code etc on the Pandora like doing that with a phone type interface with layers of java and crap cluttering things up?

Unless android turned out to be a great bug-free implementation I would guess that most devs would prefer the current setup (I am sure they will tell me if I am wrong) and android would end up getting the cold shoulder.

I have to admit I may have underestimated the dev' here. I've seen so many so-called dev' happily spitting java crap that I forgot there is a quality threshold to develop or port anything here. My bad. I sincerely (and genuinely sacrasmlessly) apologize to all the dev' here for having even thought you as part of these so-called dev'. (And it reminds me that even though I consider myself a dev', I'm still unsure I do have what it takes to perform anything useful here as a dev'.)

So I t think you're right, even though they are (I guess) a minority, dev' would have more weight in the hypothetical split than users.

 

[VRAndy]

Did you ask notaz, DJWillis and skeezix what they think about it first before asking on the boards? So they like the idea and will develop Android now?

Or perhaps they'd enjoy working on an operating system that will not be the officially recommended operating system for Pandora.

I'm sure that's just what they signed up for.


(Or maybe they don't care. I shouldn't put sarcastic words in their mouths.)

 

[tristan.clark]

I suppose that Craig is trying to consider how he can make the Pandora appeal to a larger market by offering a OS that has a know brand name. Such an OS may also be familiar to some, which may be a selling point.

The unbrickable, flexible design of the Pandora means that any OS can be stripped off the NAND and replaced anyway, so offering to pre-install the Pandora with the ARM based OS of your choice is not a problem. Your can always change, for free, it you out grow your choosen OS. Not forgetting you can boot off an SD card and try multiple favours of OS anyway.

But a feature comparison table IHMO would be required so that the end user to clear see what each of the OS can offer and what level of support there is for that OS overall. Without clear guidance, there will be unhappy flame infested threads as people assume that because the Pandora is running Android, for example, that the Pandora must be a phone with tilt features etc. Possibly this comparison table should be on the Pandora website right there when and where people order their Pandora, perhaps the wiki is not the first place that people turn to. [Like people setting up a electronic system of some sort THEN reading the manual.] This information tells them alot about what the Pandora can do and the result of their choice of OS.

 

[renegadechic]

i think it would be interesting as an option but definitely not a long term focus.

i kinda see it in the same way as windows on a netbook. sure, we can get android running on the pandora. it will give us only some options than linux does not, but more than likely at the expense of speed or something else. the netbook analogy comes in where microsoft ideally want people to run windows 7 on netbooks but XP runs much much better. for the pandora i think we would be held back on the earlier versions of android without being able to push forward with the more processor intensive versions. to plow the community focus into making the pandora an android device therefore would be condemning it to using an already outdated version of the software and somewhat limit the shelf life and potential of the product in a commercial sense. i guess i would look at it the same way as someone choosing between the google G1 or the nexus 1. people are going to go for the more capable device.

i think think it is a valid idea to provide the user with more options, and it might be exactly what some users want but its a terrible idea within a long-term roadmap. i guess it would end up working similarly to the way an iPod Touch works with the mac OS relative to the iPhone. access to music, video, games and apps over wifi but without the telephony. could be exactly what some people want.

EDIT - slight off topic: i dont think its particularly useful the way a couple of posters seem to try and drag any of the existing developers into their arguments. seems a bit unfair to throw their names about and increase the drama levels without any indication of what they feel. let them speak for themselves if they care to at all and stop trying to pull them in as if trying to prove whatever point you are trying to make.

 

[dgame]

I think all efforts should be made to make the current OS better.
It has a lot of potential and the desktop interface is a dream come true.
Great progress is being made with the PND apps.
An OS "Move" will likely kill the momentum and will probably turn a lot of people off.

No to dual-boot. No to Android. Yes to Open Pandora.

 

[vadsamoht]

No.

 

[Exophase]

Edit: Android might emulate games better with its VM running on the frame buffer compared to a full xserver + XFCE

We can use framebuffer OK here (on Pandora), some emulators are.. eventually probably more will be, especially if that's what SDL ends up supporting in fullscreen.

 

[Mutilator]

personally i would hate to see android on the pandora. I got it on my HTC and its a crap operating system at times. I know Angström isnt perfect but at least its getting fixed up and is pretty decent to use.

 

[tristan.clark]

There are a few OS available for the Pandora already, and the Pandora is touted as an open system. The option has been available from day one to change your OS IF you want to. Its there and already happening.

While Open Pandora Ltd themselves are too small to work on a range of OS at the same time and it would be unfair to demand that well known devs put their limited time to this or that OS. It might be possible for Open Pandora Ltd to advise someone porting or working on an OS on various issues that may have encounter while working on the Pandora OS. There would be some support and some feed back on the state of the OS.

At the moment some of these other OSes are being ported by people outside the core Dev team. So if an OS is ported by a trusted and capable third party whats the problem with offering OSs other than the OFFICIAL OS? How is that keeping the devs away from the OFFICIAL OS? Isn't this what is happening for all the Pandora software (whatever it is) at the moment, people with the skills and time are providing software and these people aren't all well known. Wasn't this the point of the system that people could do what they wanted with it and that being so doesn't it follow that there will always be some fragmentation of the community as people with certain interests or that run certain software or OSes coalesce. Its an open system if an option you don't want or feel at odds with comes along you just say 'not for me' and ignore it.

 

[jbrodack]

Can pandora be set up to multiboot easily?

 

[renegadechic]

also, just as an aside how is this as a though: why splitting the community (or what in my view i consider splitting the commercial and community side of the pandora) might be good. the pandora needs to be commercially successful to a degree to keep the project being viable for the hardware developers with money at risk in the product. we already know they have made a loss on batch 1 and that needs to stop. perhaps the aim for the pandora as a device would be to create a commercial device with commercial software but that at a kernel level will ALWAYS support the options of other systems. a commercial device with popular software that is entirely unlocked for outside development. i think this would facilitate new adopters so they were less nervous about the pandora being a niche and overly complicated linux product and it would also empower the development community to take that much more ownership of the pandora as a device they can make something out of. just because a PC runs windows it doesnt make linux developers hate the product!

i think in some ways with a dedicated team working on the OS right now, other devs are taking large steps back to allow them to do their work when in some ways they could or would press ahead with creating systems of their own. so i guess my question is, if the linux OS side of the pandora was entirely in the hands of the community, would it be more empowered to press forward with it or would it kill the progress dead?

 

[Zotty]

My god Craig, what have you been drinking this time?!

No Android for various reason. Java is a turnoff for me, enough to cancel. Would love to elaborate more, but I'm off to work now.

 

[sehs33]

1 - Can anyone list the value we will gain from Android?
2 - Is there anyway we can grant that all existing software will work with Android without re-porting them?

Am not aware how deeply Android is integrated with Java, but for me, Java sucks big time it will be a negativity to have an OS relying on it.

I wouldn't mind having Android as a secondary OS just to play with (in fact I look forward to someone succeeding in having a good Android image for my HTC Magician just to brag with it, yeah my unit is still working and upgraded to Win Mobile 6.5 ), but for sure a big no no for Android as the primary OS for my Pandora. Even as a secondary OS, if it was my decision, I wouldn't let anyone even think about it if it is going to affect Angstrom progress by 1%.