No time for a break after GamesCom


Illuminerdi

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But NO, God no burn it with fire DO NOT wrap the trigger around the lower/back edge of the case and the exposed corner again!

That is the biggest issue I've had with either one of my Pandoras is that corner getting bumped and jamming and in one case breaking the shoulder button.

DO NOT PUT BUTTONS ON THE EXPOSED CORNERS OF THE DEVICE.

Yes, I'm yelling because I see a train wreck in progress - and everyone appears to be climbing on board and forgetting the last go 'round with the exact same issue.
If done right I don't think this will be a problem.  The DS Lite and 3DS XL both use this style of shoulder buttons and I really prefer the feel of these.  Yes they can lead to fragility if done improperly, but with a strong enough post and thick enough collar around the post I see no reason this could not survive a reasonable amount of shock/damage.  If the button jams it shouldn't be due to the shape of the shoulder button.  My DS shoulder buttons never once jammed, even after MANY years of *heavy* use - so it is more than possible to make a shoulder button that wraps around the bottom without jamming.

Personally, I much prefer the bottom-wrap style, as I tend to rest my index fingers on the bottom corners of a handheld to provide a small bit of extra lift and stability - this frees up the rest of my grip for a slightly lighter touch, making it more nimble and able to shift around quicker.  Plus it makes one handed operation (with the stylus in the other hand) easier, since you your non-stylus hand can work the shoulder button and provide lift simultaneously, rather than having to choose between the two. So for me, a shoulder button that wraps the bottom is strongly preferred.  I'm not saying you don't have a right to your preference, but if your fears are rooted in wear-and-tear and not physical comfort, I think those are solvable problems.

Despite it's loooooong development time the Pandora didn't get nearly as much testing/QA time during the prototype phase that it needed.  ED has a good head on his shoulders and I have confidence that he will VERY thoroughly test every single aspect of the Pyra before he sends it off for production, and he also provides excellent after-sales support, so we can count on him to own and assist with any issues that do crop up long-term, within reason.
Wrap the side OR wrap the bottom - that is fine.  Get the button OFF of the corner though.
I don't understand - how could you wrap the bottom and not wrap the corner?  I really don't understand what your issue is with the corner wrapping.  And while you might not like the DS, it was a very popular system, so there are a lot of people who clearly did like it - given that Nintendo has persisted in using this style of button it's pretty clear that their research has shown that their customers all like that style of button as well.  If it was so hopelessly flawed why would they keep using it 10 years later?

Plus, frankly, Nintendo has some of the best controller designs in the business.  Outside of the Gamecube their actualy controller layouts and buttons have always been the highest quality of any system, so if you're going to steal, steal from the BEST.
 

Silent-Hunter

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Hand cramps, the D pad and thumbstick can't both be used in the same game. I had lots of problems with it, most people I know hated it.
 

TrashyMG

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Hand cramps, the D pad and thumbstick can't both be used in the same game. I had lots of problems with it, most people I know hated it.
The design was intended to be ergonomic I found it comfortable. I Don't recall any N64 game that required both the D-pad and analog at once.. usually the d-pad was for utility buttons if the analog was used heavily or they both did movement giving you both options...

Also the Gamecube controller was pretty awesome for the time..
 
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iprice

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Hand cramps, the D pad and thumbstick can't both be used in the same game. I had lots of problems with it, most people I know hated it.
The design was intended to be ergonomic I found it comfortable. I Don't recall any N64 game that required both the D-pad and analog at once.. usually the d-pad was for utility buttons if the analog was used heavily or they both did movement giving you both option...


Also the Gamecube controller was pretty awesome for the time..
All of this. :)

The N64 controller was IMHO the best controller at the time, and only bettered by the GameCube's until the arrival of the XBox 360.
 

Illuminerdi

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The N64 controller was horrible too.
I partially agree - I think it was horrible in execution, but the idea and theory were sound.  One thing a lot of people don't realize is that the N64 controller was meant to be held by any combination of 2 of the 3 total "prongs" while still giving the player a minimum of 2 additional buttons to press. So in theory you could have played Doom or Goldeneye with the analog for look and the dpad for movement (I can't remember how many games if any actually supported the Dpad Left/Analog Right combination).

The trouble was nobody actually used this, either due to lack of support in games, or lack of messaging, plus the inability for players to use more than 2 buttons, which meant that most "dual directional" games such as FPSes or games that use the camera for the right stick just weren't feasible.

Think about it for a moment though, and it at least makes sense why they did it that way.  That's why the C buttons are directional as well.  The idea was that their primary use would be for directional things like camera movement, but they were made buttons because a second stick over there would have confused people who were already practically baffled by even ONE analog.

So really I have to give them credit for the idea - it was an attempt to make the leap from SNES/Genesis style controllers into the 3d/analog world, but in trying to be the best of both worlds it ultimately fell short of its intended goals.
 

_wb_

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The 5.3" Samsung AMS529HA01 is 800x1280, but thats pentile matrix oled.
What's wrong with pentile matrix OLED?
This is what Pentile looks like:

Nexus_one_screen_microscope.jpg


Normally, one pixel consists of three subpixels for red, green and blue. With Pentile, every "pixel" consists of two subpixels: one green, and one that is alternatingly red or blue. The reasoning is that human eyes are more sensitive to green than to the two other colors. As a very crude first approximation, most of the luma (brightness) signal comes from the green subpixels (a typical formula to compute the greyscale image from RGB computes the brightness as 30% of Red, 59% of Green, and 11% of Blue), and perceptually, the resolution is most important for the luma signal (as far as chrominance is concerned, you can get away with less accuracy).

Anyway, a 1280x800 Pentile display has 2048000 subpixels, while a 1280x800 RGB display has 3072000 subpixels.

A 1280x720 real RGB display has 2764800 subpixels, which is still a lot more than a 1280x720 Pentile display even though it is a "lower" resolution.

If the aim is just displaying 1024x768 material as accurately as possible, you're better off with a 1280x720 RGB display than with a 1280x800 Pentile display -- in both cases, some kind of scaling/interpolation has to be done, but there's just more subpixels to work with in the RGB case.
 

Silent-Hunter

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The pentile one makes sense though, with the different sizes of subpixels to make the colours more balanced.
 

TeDaDeS

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ED has said in the original post that the CPU board being swappable is likely to enable CPU upgrades, so it seems very likely that we'll see new CPU board(s) for the Pyra within a year or two of its release.

Again though, I highly, highly doubt we'll ever see an x86 CPU board.  ED probably won't ever release an x86 board for the Pyra - doing so would mean splitting the entire user base between ARM-based and x86-based OSes/apps.  He'd have to find people to make the x86 versions of Linux (and support them), and people to make and support x86 app depots. Plus, devs (most of whom do this for free, mind you) would have to port their apps to x86 and maintain 2 different, simultaneous versions of their apps.  Or ED could make an x86 board and either nobody or everybody bought it, and whichever architecture "lost" would stop seeing development/active support.

I actually think you'll have more issues with different ARM chips than the x86 boards.

The x86 will require development to get drivers running, but I wouldn't put in the effort to port all the software. Linux/Windows already have a lot of interesting applications and games, if you want the Pandora experience you should stick with the omap5 chip.

With an ARM upgrade you might have tiny differences between CPU's that could break the software optimizations, this might be more frustrating for users than already accepting they will not have the Pyra-retro experience with the x86 upgrade board.

Also the x86 users will have the omap5 board already, so they can actually switch.

But it will not be likely the x86 board will be made, as it's just cheaper and easier to develop an ARM board.

In case other ARM upgrade boards are made available I would suggest to make the omap5 board the main platform, so you can have the full Pyra experience out-of-the-box.
 

_wb_

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The pentile one makes sense though, with the different sizes of subpixels to make the colours more balanced.
Yes it makes sense, but you just have to understand what the resolution means. 1280x800 Pentile is not a bad resolution, but don't expect you can display a pixel-perfect 1024x768 on it (not even if you don't do any scaling and just have black borders on all sides). 1280x720 RGB is higher resolution than 1280x800 Pentile.

Ideally I would want to have the screen of the BlackBerry Z30: a 5", 1280x720, AMOLED RGB screen. I've never seen it, but theoretically that should be a very good screen in terms of power consumption, ghosting, etc.

But if you're not a huge company like Samsung, BlackBerry or Motorola, there is no way you can get an AMOLED screen.
 

Grench

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The 1280x720 screen in the Galaxy Note II is rather impressive as well. Super AMOLED S Stripe.

220px-Samsung_Galaxy_Note_2_subpixels.jpg
 

Majin Wamu

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Gamescom looked like so much fun. I am happy it attracted so many interested people. This is great news for when the Pyra is ready for mass production.
 

slimeycat

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If this ability to change the CPU board is a real feature then perhaps consider allowing it to be changed more easily e.g. via a PCMCIA type of card setup and leave a slot in the case?

Realise the deluge of problems this could cause in implementation and use etc.

The reality of the matter will likely be for the vast majority of Pyra users is that the CPU board that comes with the machine will remain until the user stops using the Pyra or it dies and goes into the cupboard.

In a way providing alternative CPU types will simply fracture a potentially small user base and likely put a higher barrier to entry for a bigger user base.

Also the main board will likely be obselete as new connectors, interfaces and demands for new radios drive people to seek upgrades to that.

Having said that I do like the ability to swap out the CPU for a faster one, but running the exact same software platform.
 
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TrashyMG

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If this ability to change the CPU board is a real feature then perhaps consider allowing it to be changed more easily e.g. via a PCMCIA type of card setup and leave a slot in the case?
No room, PCMCIA type cards even the smaller ones are way too big, don't provide enough I/O channels and more importantly the Pyra is way too far into development for a radical redesign. 
 
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comradekingu

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Hand cramps, the D pad and thumbstick can't both be used in the same game. I had lots of problems with it, most people I know hated it.
I would suggest eating more magnesium/not drinking as much fluid, could be the issue you are having. Objectivly the PS1 controller is the worst, since reportedly it caused the most hand-cramps. These are hand-issues reported to medical personnel, so imagine quite severe.

Goldeneye supported movement with yellowbuttons and free-look with joystick. You can actually run faster this way if you strafe slightly to the side by holding 2 directions on the yellowbuttons.

I like the dreamcast controller a lot too, great for people with big hands. Got a hori mini n64 controller on the way in the mail :)
 
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Illuminerdi

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Hand cramps, the D pad and thumbstick can't both be used in the same game. I had lots of problems with it, most people I know hated it.
I would suggest eating more magnesium/not drinking as much fluid, could be the issue you are having. Objectivly the PS1 controller is the worst, since reportedly it caused the most hand-cramps. These are hand-issues reported to medical personnel, so imagine quite severe.

Goldeneye supported movement with yellowbuttons and free-look with joystick. You can actually run faster this way if you strafe slightly to the side by holding 2 directions on the yellowbuttons.

I like the dreamcast controller a lot too, great for people with big hands. Got a hori mini n64 controller on the way in the mail :)
I think it's hilarious how much hate the PS controller line gets, including the PS1 controller.  I've never had a problem with the entire PS line.  Yes i have experienced discomfort with them at times, but at the same levels as discomfort I've experienced with other console controllers of the same era.  I think the worst discomfort I ever got was when playing Armored Core, and that was mostly due to extended sessions of play, because I couldn't put that game down at the time...
 
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