News from the meeting at GC

[codifies]

oh look - random figures

 

[zmatt]

The first prototypes will be sent to zmatt for a bit of software debugging and some of the devs.

<zmatt> ok I typed \o/ in a forum post... what the HELL is that smiley it replaced it with
<JonnyH> Some kind of eldritch horror that's 90% mouth?​

Oh, oops. Wow those boards cost a lot more than anything I've ever had to deal with. I'm not used to PCBs costing more than a couple dollars.

I don't know what the stackup is for the pyra cpu board, but the suggested stackup given in the omap5 datasheet is 10 layers, with blind and buried microvia, and I think I've also seen via-in-pad being recommended...

Yeah these are not cheap PCBs, which is also one of the reasons for having a separate cpu board: you wouldn't want to whole mainboard to be forced to use such a stackup!

 

[codifies]

...

which is also one of the reasons for having a separate cpu board: you wouldn't want to whole mainboard to be forced to use such a stackup!

gosh yeah! aside from the upgrade advantage - that could make for one expensive main board just to have an array of key pads on one side!

 

[Grench]

How many layers did each of the three boards wind up being?

 

[Xcl4m4t10n]

So, why didn't you order it 2 weeks ago?

In fact @EvilDragon, Why the hell didn't you finished the Pyra 5 years ago? Damn you!

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

So bar a few details mass production is imminent. Hope it runs smoothly. If I can get my hands on a pyra by July or august ill be happy. But ill wait regardless.

 

[codifies]

How many layers did each of the three boards wind up being?

as far as boards are concerned, I like to use an ancient form of math, it works like this 1....2.....many..... ( many being too much for me and time to let others get involved )

 

[ThinkPad]

In fact @EvilDragon, Why the hell didn't you finished the Pyra 5 years ago? Damn you!

In fact, If the Pyra was released back in 2015 as scheduled, the sales figures at the moment should be around 7000-8000 sold units, with new CPU board and accessories already in development.

At this point It will be pretty difficult to sell a dual core A15 equipped device, in the middle of 2017.
(Personally I am fine with this SoC, but it will be the first thing pointed by any potential new customers)

It is good for the project to have some criticism and close to reality comments, in order the development to be speeded up.
Cheerful - hearts and roses comments like yours, are not helping at all.

 

[TrashyMG]

In fact, If the Pyra was released back in 2015 as scheduled

There never was a scheduled release date or even a tentative release date.

It is good for the project to have some criticism and close to reality comments, in order the development to be speeded up.
Cheerful - hearts and roses comments like yours, are not helping at all.

Criticism sure it's good, but relentlessly dumping on a project ran by essentially two people in their spare time isn't helping one bit either.

 

[ThinkPad]

Okay, lets say If it was scheduled for 2015... or Aimed for 2015 release...

Anyway,
We are all aware about the the manpower behind the Pyra since the beginning,
there is no need to remind this every single time

Cheers.

 

[ible]

i see, yes, the good-cop bad-cop routine.

 

[FBnil]

didn't you finished the Pyra 5 years ago?

Then why don't you finish the time machine to send them back to 2015?

Also: less swearing man... words can uplift but also break down.

 

[Black Sliver]

Oh, oops. Wow those boards cost a lot more than anything I've ever had to deal with. I'm not used to PCBs costing more than a couple dollars.

I don't get it either.

Afaik set-up is less than ~ USD 50 per layer in china, so 500 USD max. Plus ~ USD 100 for e-test adapter. And production is less than USD1 per layer for 1/2euro card (80x100), standard design rules, standard production time, if you fill the production panel. For other design rules (like uVias) the price ~doubles, so I'd say it should be no more than USD 10 per board, if production panel is filled and regular production time is OK.
(Note: This is extrapolated from my experience and may not be fully accurate since I never actually ordered TEN layers)

On the other hand, I would never suggest switching manufacturer between prototyping and first production run, if the price is okayish, because .

 

[slaeshjag]

Well, with laser-drilled microvias and via-in pad at those densities... It's a bit above the ordinary.

 

[Blue Shadow]

Plus it is actually 12 layers, not 10.

 

[WizardStan]

I thought it was only 8.

 

[bzar]

 

[Blue Shadow]

And for everyone who don't want to see any critical questions on an project with more than one year delay and just praise anything regardless what:

So far I did not see anyone that fit that description in this thread. I think it is mainly a matter of perspective. But exaggerating in any direction don't help.

 

[spud42]

m@t, it is impossible for anything to be "delayed" if it has never had a set release date. you keep harping on it being delayed. IT IS NOT. it will be ready when its ready and that is when ED is satisfied he has done the best he can with the resources he has available.

 

[sulu]

Why should anyone buy an already old device?

Because despite its age, it might still be the best solution available.
Every potential customer will have his individual set of criteria that has to be met more or less by any device he buys. The age of a device doesn't change these criteria.

What might change over time are:
1. Your criteria: With time you may have new wishes or others disappear. But that's hardly the device's fault.

2. The market: There may be a point where an alternative to the delayed device might appear on the market, that suits smaller or bigger parts of the potential customers better than the original device. (I think in case of the Pyra the GPD Win is such an example.) In that case there are two options:
a. If you belong to this part of the customers, then just get the other device instead of the original one. In that case the delay even works in your favour, because you won't pay for two devices and will still get the better one (according to your criteria).
b. If you don't belong to that part of customers whose criteria can easily be fulfilled by another device, then the delay might be frustrating, but it doesn't affect your choice on whether you'll buy the device or not, because without better alternatives even an old device that fits your criteria is still the best you can get.

I will have my pyra anyway, but i don't think i am the average consumer of such a device.

I still have to see a definition of "the average consumer of such a device" before I can make sense out of a sentence like that.
And even then I'm pretty sure that I'm not an "average consumer", because I don't care for the gaming aspect. Yet, I pre-ordered a Pyra. So my personal guess would be, that it doesn't really matter if you're an "average consumer of such a device".