Mame Gp2x 1.0 Ho Ho Ho !!!


pongplaya

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ralp99 posted on Dec 25 2005 at 10:08 PM said:
man don't let that guy get to you franx -- as you know the entire gp32/x community is and has been supportive of you and your work. and likewise i am certain that 99.9 percent of the mame dev community (which is aware of your ports) could say the same. getting mame up and running to the degree it has, on these two platforms = quite a feat and no matter what some bloated egotistical nerd (talented coder though he may be) has to say about it, obviously everyone repsects you and your team's work. which you have given to the community for FREE, might i add. no one can take that away from you.

as far as RB is concerned, i'd say mostly it's a case of his being overeager to early-adopt the new handheld (the emu community has eagerly been anticipating such a device for.. hmm, a long damn time now) and he's just whining because it's not all perfect and bug-free right out of the gate.

hmm, can't the same be said of ANY new hardware that's come out in recent memory?
ill sent rb my old gp32 nlu with a autoboot smc mame...... maybe that changes his mind :)
 
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craigix

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bzfrank posted on Dec 26 2005 at 01:04 PM said:
I see no reason to antagonize someone with (currently)ligitemate concerns discussing a possibly(probably) unsuitable program on the GP2X becuase if people are expecting *good* arcade emulation on the GP2X its not going to happen with MAME, and its going to MAME or the GP2X fault, the reality is its MAME's.
It looks pretty good to me...
 
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Cyclops

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craigix posted on Dec 26 2005 at 04:33 PM said:
It looks pretty good to me...
LOL it is pretty good. I'm refering to the DaveC syndrome(Although after this it needs renaming). Expectations of MAME are 5800+ games playable. Reality is lots won't run on a computer using only one core effectivly, 64Mb of memory, often leaving the games emulated the earlier games, not the latest and greatest that most use MAME for. For someone like me 1985 is my sweet spot of when I went to arcades, and I suspect I will be more than happy with where this project is heading, and *MY* games will run sweet. The reality is for MAME to look good your talking a serious machine in the range of several Ghz.

From someone who has enjoyed arcade emulation for a long time MAME is the least fun, and faster more playable emulation have all but vanished. It doesn't matter as much because frontends and horsepower of the machine have improved considerably, but on a handheld these things become important again.
 
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rkenshin

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So.. Did the GP32 MAME had to go through these loops too?

Still find it strange that you need to get approval for porting open sourced stuff..
 

Cyclops

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LOL the source wasn't released on the GP32 version, so no freinds were made there. Although to be fair it was a tricky situation it should be still be in there.
 

DaveC

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Cyclops posted on Dec 26 2005 at 04:03 PM said:
craigix posted on Dec 26 2005 at 04:33 PM said:
It looks pretty good to me...
LOL it is pretty good. I'm refering to the DaveC syndrome(Although after this it needs renaming). Expectations of MAME are 5800+ games playable. Reality is lots won't run on a computer using only one core effectivly, 64Mb of memory, often leaving the games emulated the earlier games, not the latest and greatest that most use MAME for. For someone like me 1985 is my sweet spot of when I went to arcades, and I suspect I will be more than happy with where this project is heading, and *MY* games will run sweet. The reality is for MAME to look good your talking a serious machine in the range of several Ghz.

From someone who has enjoyed arcade emulation for a long time MAME is the least fun, and faster more playable emulation have all but vanished. It doesn't matter as much because frontends and horsepower of the machine have improved considerably, but on a handheld these things become important again.

I never said it should run 5800 games. I am happy that it can run the classics. I don't expect it to run Tekken.

If you have a weak computer it won't run everything either. This guy is changing the rules as he goes. Why ? because he can. That is what bothers me. There is nothing in the MAME rules that says that you can't have MAME if every game doesn't run perfect. There is nothing that says that if the system it runs on has bugs in the firmware that MAME is illegal either. The truth is the guy is just being a tosser.
 
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Willei

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DaveC posted on Dec 26 2005 at 07:52 PM said:
If you have a weak computer it won't run everything either. This guy is changing the rules as he goes. Why ? because he can. That is what bothers me. There is nothing in the MAME rules that says that you can't have MAME if every game doesn't run perfect. There is nothing that says that if the system it runs on has bugs in the firmware that MAME is illegal either. The truth is the guy is just being a tosser.
If that's your opinion, then you're really welcome not to use MAME in any of it's forms. What you're not welcome to do it just come out here and call the guy names because you disgree with him. Not only does it give you call the panache of a swearing schoolchild, it's completely uncalled for. I'd be truly embarassed to be a member of this forum if any of the MAME team did end up reading this thread.

What you forget is that MAME is about preserving these arcade games for historical puroposes, so that they won't be completely wiped out when the original pieces of hardware eventually die. It's not intended as a way for you to get free arcade games. Personally I find it a little hard to see where GP2X MAME fits in with that vision, so you can understand why they're a little techy about it.


On an unrelated note, what a are the comments on the MAME World forum about porting M1? That'd be pretty damn cool!
 
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Cyclops

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Willei posted on Dec 26 2005 at 08:31 PM said:
What you forget is that MAME is about preserving these arcade games for historical puroposes, so that they won't be completely wiped out when the original pieces of hardware eventually die.
No-one really thinks that.
 
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Willei

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Regardless, it's the official MAME stance, and is this only one relevant to this particular line of conversation. Do the devs really care if anyone thinks their work is purely a plaything? No. Can you expect them to yield to that line of thought when their work is ported to another platform? No.

Also keep in mind that this chap has only made his opinions known on the matter, I doubt he's suddenly going to do everything in his power to bring down the project. Personally, I don't think that makes him a fair target for insults.
 

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Willei posted on Dec 26 2005 at 10:23 PM said:
Regardless, it's the official MAME stance, and is this only one relevant to this particular line of conversation. Do the devs really care if anyone thinks their work is purely a plaything? No. Can you expect them to yield to that line of thought when their work is ported to another platform? No.

Also keep in mind that this chap has only made his opinions known on the matter, I doubt he's suddenly going to do everything in his power to bring down the project. Personally, I don't think that makes him a fair target for insults.
Eh?

Find where I have insulted anyone here. Don't try and make a point off me, or tar me with the same brush as people who do. I keep my insults personal and to that person.

Everybody and his dog understands what presevation means in mame don't be a retard. Everyone here understands what his *real* objections are and its nothing to do with the MAME trademark
 
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Willei

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Where did I say you'd insulted anybody? Well, up until you called me a retard up there anyway. The comment about insults what aimed at people who've actually insulted him, you could have given me the benefit of any doubt there.

I'm not interested in petty point scoring, I just feel like R. Belmont has been unfairly criticised in this thread. Vague comments about *real* objections and presevation [sic] aren't going to change that.
 

Cyclops

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Willei posted on Dec 26 2005 at 10:57 PM said:
Where did I say you'd insulted anybody? Well, up until you called me a retard up there anyway. The comment about insults what aimed at people who've actually insulted him, you could have given me the benefit of any doubt there.

I'm not interested in petty point scoring, I just feel like R. Belmont has been unfairly criticised in this thread. Vague comments about *real* objections and presevation [sic] aren't going to change that.
Then don't quote me and talk about insults. The problem is R. Belmont has been fairly criticised, and comes across very badly. The reality is though anything he has said has been vastly outwayed by what has happened in this forum. Which is a awful.

I'm not vague. *Everybody* wants mame to play games.
 
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Willei

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It looks like we agree more or less then. Mr Belmont's comments were a little ill-considered, but not nearly to the same extent as some people's on here.

And the truth is, everybody does want MAME to play games, although for slightly different reasons. At this point, it's just getting into a battle of semantics and isn't relevant to GP2X MAME at any rate, so I'm happy to leave it there.


:)
 

rkenshin

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Willei posted on Dec 26 2005 at 11:31 AM said:
DaveC posted on Dec 26 2005 at 07:52 PM said:
If you have a weak computer it won't run everything either. This guy is changing the rules as he goes. Why ? because he can. That is what bothers me. There is nothing in the MAME rules that says that you can't have MAME if every game doesn't run perfect. There is nothing that says that if the system it runs on has bugs in the firmware that MAME is illegal either. The truth is the guy is just being a tosser.
If that's your opinion, then you're really welcome not to use MAME in any of it's forms. What you're not welcome to do it just come out here and call the guy names because you disgree with him. Not only does it give you call the panache of a swearing schoolchild, it's completely uncalled for. I'd be truly embarassed to be a member of this forum if any of the MAME team did end up reading this thread.

What you forget is that MAME is about preserving these arcade games for historical puroposes, so that they won't be completely wiped out when the original pieces of hardware eventually die. It's not intended as a way for you to get free arcade games. Personally I find it a little hard to see where GP2X MAME fits in with that vision, so you can understand why they're a little techy about it.


On an unrelated note, what a are the comments on the MAME World forum about porting M1? That'd be pretty damn cool!
Well besides computers (being the actual upgradable piece of hardware), no console or handheld can even fit that vision and there's ports for MAME all over the place..

But I'm starting to wonder if any of those ports even got the MAME devs approval in the first place?
 
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bzfrank

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craigix posted on Dec 26 2005 at 05:33 PM said:
bzfrank posted on Dec 26 2005 at 01:04 PM said:
Please don't quote me out of context - I never did say that. Cyclops was... ;)
 
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bzfrank

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Cyclops posted on Dec 26 2005 at 05:12 PM said:
He describes 3 problems(remember he is using *nix *BSD)
1) Can't upgrade firmware(and has a sandisk card)
Been there, done that - firmware is now 1.10 (from 1.0 and 1.01) and I have a Sandisk 1GB card (beside several other which work also ok)

Cyclops posted on Dec 26 2005 at 05:12 PM said:
2) Crashing emulators with no recovery
That I cannot verify - my unit works ok. At least all crashes are reproduceable and software related. ;) Maybe he should ask his vendor for a replacement...

Cyclops posted on Dec 26 2005 at 05:12 PM said:
3) USB problems
Possible - I do not use USB, just the SD card. Still I think 1.10 does a better job now than 1.01 from what I heard.
 
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bzfrank

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Willei posted on Dec 26 2005 at 09:31 PM said:
If that's your opinion, then you're really welcome not to use MAME in any of it's forms.
And who decides that? Mame is released under its (BSD alike + mandatory source release for changes as it seems) license, see

http://mamedev.com/license.html

There is nothing to be found about any quality condition a derived port must match (Beside - I think Franxis GP2X and GP32 ports are of quite good quality!), nor can the license be revoked or altered on a case by case base but because some guy is on a personal vendetta against a certain platform. The only issue that can be debated is the MAME trademark - but in any case Franxis can just name it MEAN2x (or anything not covered by the trademark) and be be done with it.

My personal opinion is that this Belmont person is on a kind of personal power trip - maybe he has a faulty unit or bad luck with his environment, maybe he cannot get things to work - but THIS DOES NOT ALLOW HIM to demand the general stop of Franxis development efforts.
 
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Willei

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bzfrank posted on Dec 27 2005 at 12:32 AM said:
Willei posted on Dec 26 2005 at 09:31 PM said:
If that's your opinion, then you're really welcome not to use MAME in any of it's forms.
And who decides that? Mame is released under its (BSD alike as it seems) license, see

http://mamedev.com/license.html

There is nothing to be found about any quality condition a derived port must match (Beside - I think Franxis GP2X and GP32 ports are of quite good quality!), nor can the license be revoked or altered on a case by case base but because some guy is on a personal vendetta against a certain platform. The only issue that can be debated is the MAME trademark - but in any case Franxis can just name it MEAN2x (or anything not covered by the trademark) and be be done with it.

My personal opinion is that this Belmont person is on a kind of personal power trip - maybe he has a faulty unit or bad luck with his environment, maybe he cannot get things to work - but THIS DOES NOT ALLOW HIM to demand the general stop of Franxis development efforts.
Obviously there's no clause in the licence that states that you're free not to use it if you think that the MAMEDevs are [plural expletive of your choice]. There's nothing about the quality of hardware in there, there's not even quality of the port in there. The only significant thing is:

If you've read and understood all of R. Belmont's posts on the matter on MAME World, you'll notice that the only issues he has raised are:

a. He thinks the GP2X is a piece of shit.
b. He thinks that permission should be sought for the use of the trademarked name "MAME" since it's now a new product on new hardware.

No suggestion that Franxis should stop development, let alone a demand. No power trip. Just the man's opinion. The amount of criticism that he's received on here for it is frankly shocking really.


Edit: Damn typos!
 
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