Craigs Preorder List Update

[MrConfusion]

There are 500 people who paid for a Pandora and have lost that money.. but the original preoders were $330ish (247euro)... and that money is GONE. *POOF*

(euro-dollar rate was different, I at least paid almost 290...)

But one last post before I go back to steady lurking again (holiday ends tomorrow , because this line really bugged me:

Can't we avoid statements like "the money is GONE *POOF*"... Why?-)

Because it makes me feel like I was a total jerk for giving that 290 (I might feel just a jerk instead)...

I'd like to try and make myself believe that money lives a bit inside every Pandora's R&D and has made someone happy if nothing else :-(.

Comments like that just bring me down...

 

[Nagelfar]

To imply someone does that intentionally is... well... not nice.

Perhaps not intentionally but its a deeper hole than would have been necessary. Also there are no ladders to get back up anymore although there used to be scaffolding. Last but not least it has started raining cats and dogs and the water is rising, almost reaching his non existing stiff upper lip. I'll stop now.

Communication would have helped A LOT as ED based his business plan on the wrong and scare info he got from Craig. Now we see that instead of 150 preorders left there are around 500 left. Why? Why wasn't this communicated earlier? And so on and so on...

Craig might not be THE BAD GUY but he certainly turned around and left when shit started hitting the fan. Worse, he knew shit was hitting the fan and still took money from people (1Ghz units...).

Also, the recession has basically nothing to do with it.

 

[rohezal]

I'd like to try and make myself believe that money lives a bit inside every Pandora's R&D and has made someone happy if nothing else :-(.

You preorder money  created a great device a lot of people enjoy. I realy hope ED can sell enough Pandoras to give it to predorders. Maybe the 200€ way would be best.

 

[kasp]

Sad fact is Craig dug this massive hole for himself,.

Be careful.

I know people who, when young (early 90's depression) swore they'd never make the same mistake their parents did: pay debt with debt.

Yet in this depression many of those 35-40 year old dads and moms have had to say "whoops".

To imply someone does that intentionally is... well... not nice.

Also, about Craig's lack of communication etc. I though many of the people here knew him for years. And now he's suddenly the BoogieMan.

Somehow that also reminds me of being a young adult in the early 90's: Some of my friends fathers were turned from the "cool dads" to "tomato eyed, snapping zombies" in just a few months. And it's happening again.

Communication could not bring money and didn't it work until things started going wrong? Instead of lack of communication, how about blaming the timing. It would be really interesting to peek into some alternate reality where the Pandora had started a year earlier, thus dodging the worst recession.

The thing is what he has done and how he has done it is exactly what someone who is embezzling does. They make it so confusing to unravel people aren't sure of any numbers.  Think about it, ED was shocked at how many pre orders were left considering he knew roughly how many were sold initially out and the numbers there should have been left. It even exceeded his worse case scenario.   

The only thing that makes sense is that Craig has been skimming off the top and abusing ED's good nature.  Why else hasn't Craigs preorder queue gone down, especially given all the upgrades and refunds he has supposedly done?  It has mysterious stayed at around the same number no matter how many years have passed or Pandora's sent out. 

 

[Nagelfar]

Why else hasn't Craigs preorder queue gone down, especially given all the upgrades and refunds he has supposedly done?

This1million times. How many refunds did he pay? How many upgrades has he had? How many preorders did he initially have? At some point in the last couple of years he was giving wrong numbers. If intentionally or not I leave for others to decide.

 

[Thorgan]

If the ICP2 is successful, and delivered. We could expect some of its money to help the situation here.

Also, I don't know if CircuitCo was sued or anything but if by chance they were willing to pay something...  It would also help.

I wonder how many Pandoras are sold on a year basis. 600+ seems a huge goal in a realistic timeframe. Donators and upgraders (also donators IMHO) are the last resort.

Once the ICP2 is delivered, I hope things will move faster. Craig will deliver, don't lose faith .

 

[ZXDunny]

Customers who are fine with CC units: 48 (Craig should have enough of those with the PCBs I sent back to him)

OMG you did WHAT now?

You sent PCBs to Craig? He's not going to give those to pre-orderers. He's going to sell them on GBAX. You KNOW he's going to do that. You should have gotten their addresses and sent them their Pandoras, not given anything to Craig. The guy isn't an honest man.

D.

 

[EvilDragon]

Customers who are fine with CC units: 48 (Craig should have enough of those with the PCBs I sent back to him)

OMG you did WHAT now?


You sent PCBs to Craig? He's not going to give those to pre-orderers. He's going to sell them on GBAX. You KNOW he's going to do that. You should have gotten their addresses and sent them their Pandoras, not given anything to Craig. The guy isn't an honest man.


D.

There's not much I can do legally. He sends me PCBs he owns, so I can't simply keep them.


The only ones who CAN do something legally in case that happens are his customers.

 

[Hồng Thất Công]

Customers who are fine with CC units: 48 (Craig should have enough of those with the PCBs I sent back to him)

OMG you did WHAT now?


You sent PCBs to Craig? He's not going to give those to pre-orderers. He's going to sell them on GBAX. You KNOW he's going to do that. You should have gotten their addresses and sent them their Pandoras, not given anything to Craig. The guy isn't an honest man.


D.

There's not much I can do legally. He sends me PCBs he owns, so I can't simply keep them.


The only ones who CAN do something legally in case that happens are his customers.

Just cut the cord with him.  Dragonbox needs to cut the tie with this guy and moves on.  You can't just keep on helping him whereas he doesn't care about you.  Come one Ed!  Enough is enough.

 

[hipnotoad]

Maybe we should do a community vote just to see how the majority feels about the situation? Even if it doesn't mean anything and if only to have an open discussion to keep ideas flowing.

 

[Nagelfar]

if CircuitCo was sued

No, they were never sued nor are they going to be sued.

if by chance they were willing to pay something

Yeah, right, why would they?

 

[Thorgan]

@nagelfar:

You seem to be well informed on this CircuitCo matter. If there are not sued or anything, what is the current situation with them (last time I searched about it I found nothing)?

Edit:

I mean, they caused a big loss. That is enough to try and get things settled with fresh cash.

 

[akarolick]

Customers who are fine with CC units: 48 (Craig should have enough of those with the PCBs I sent back to him)

HOLY SHIT!  I am one of those! Am I going to get a unit?!?!?!?!   =O

I......I....... I have no words!

 

[dmarschal]

It started...

go to gbax.com

Currently four 'broken' units are available. Who knows maybe CC units will follow... about 50...

 

[EvilDragon]

It started...

go to gbax.com

Currently four 'broken' units are available. Who knows maybe CC units will follow... about 50...

No, he still has about 100 broken PCBs. The one he sent me where I replaced the nubs should work 100%.

 

[ShleeDragon]

Sad fact is Craig dug this massive hole for himself,.

Be careful.

I know people who, when young (early 90's depression) swore they'd never make the same mistake their parents did: pay debt with debt.

Yet in this depression many of those 35-40 year old dads and moms have had to say "whoops".

To imply someone does that intentionally is... well... not nice.

Also, about Craig's lack of communication etc. I though many of the people here knew him for years. And now he's suddenly the BoogieMan.

Somehow that also reminds me of being a young adult in the early 90's: Some of my friends fathers were turned from the "cool dads" to "tomato eyed, snapping zombies" in just a few months. And it's happening again.

Communication could not bring money and didn't it work until things started going wrong? Instead of lack of communication, how about blaming the timing. It would be really interesting to peek into some alternate reality where the Pandora had started a year earlier, thus dodging the worst recession.

This is actually insightful enough.. Nobody thinks Craig is the boogieman.. he just never spends any time on the forum, or irc.. or returns emails.. or updates the kickstarter.

He's likely got a huge debt of hundreds of thousands he didn't have before this adventure. He was the master of this domain at the beginning and he got screwed.

but his public facing image has taken a beating and the information we hear about his work behind closed doors doesn't help that.

I've never doubted the emotional/psychological pressure he's been under for years. 

 

[Nagelfar]

CC ... what is the current situation with them

They caused a loss and are not going to pay for it. Things would have to be settled in court. Not going to happen if there is no one to sue them. Only person who could sue them would be Craig. Craig is not interested and doesn't have the money for it.

 

[moxie]

He's likely got a huge debt of hundreds of thousands he didn't have before this adventure. He was the master of this domain at the beginning and he got screwed.

I've never doubted the emotional/psychological pressure he's been under for years. 

This. I have my theories about what has happened and how, which I won't go into, but I have no doubts that Craig has been working with good intentions the whole time. And I'd be very surprised if any of these "oohh, he's been skimming off the monies off the top"-fantasies turn out to have any base in reality. 

It's all quite sad, really.

 

[Gring]

Couldn't we find a lawyer that would accept a "We don't pay you, but you'll get a huge part of what you manage to get from them".

If I remember well, I sould be quite an easy case ?

 

[Nagelfar]

Couldn't we find a lawyer that would accept a "We don't pay you, but you'll get a huge part of what you manage to get from them".

If you can do that AND get the necessary information (documents etc.) from Craig, by all means, go for it.