Wrist Strap, Case, Expansion?

[Grench]

Let's go nuts!

Link if that doesn't work.

Hmm... small PMP sounds like a decent idea, especially since it'd have its own power source. Would the Sansa line work with Linux out of the box? I don't recall iPods working as mass storage devices out of the box, but that's just word of mouth. I don't own an iPod.

iPods make GREAT mass storage devices under ubuntu Linux - and most likely other flavors as well. I have an 80GB iPod that I received as a gift. I'll never use iTunes, so it's a big big thumb drive to me. It works great! The color screen is a bit overkill just to tell me whether or not it is connected, disconnected or in the process of ejecting, but hey, it works.

 

[droneb]

All set the only thing missing is the cup holder and the epoxy undies

back to serious

why d you need that much ports?

7 is really an overkill, and the another thing is that i dont think the panda would be able to hold that much power drain

you just need at tops 4 (in common use)

2 for mouse and keyboard
1 for memory source (Mstick/pendrive/External HD)
and 1 for Misc use.

for the buttons i plan to strip em down from and old PS1 controler or a broken micromouse i have somewhere, just not something squareish like the panda actual shoulder buttons, but more round and facing inner to get the maximum ergonomics.
you really dont want stiff middle finger (you will get into trouble if you show that to someone)

on the end the panda will be still Mobility based so i wont go on such an overkill.

if i have to bag in a travel pack i would drop
- Panda (Doh! if you dont bag this first)
- Panda Addon (aprox the design i tried to state)
- Charger (OF COURSE!)
- Official A/V Cable
- Extra Batt or Emergency Charge likes.
- USB Optical Drive
- External HDD
- 1 Extra USB Addable (TVTuner/GPS/GSM Modem/etc)

 

[renegadechic]

i was talking to myself in chat and having a think and wondered how possible some of these would be

renegadechic: maybe some kind of camera units? maybe a multiple flash card reader on the edge with the SD card slots
renegadechic: an internal usb powered SSD drive?
renegadechic: possibly with extra battery
renegadechic: more speakers maybe..
renegadechic: people have mentioned chorded keyboards
renegadechic: i wonder if its beyond the realms of possibility to have a fairly low res fold out touchscreen that folds around and onto the keypad for playing (if its ever possible) DS games

nearly all those things could be done just with USB i reckon. it would be especially awesome if it was thick enough for an SSD and a spare battery alongside L2 and R2 and extra USB slots. maybe someone could manufacture empty battery extending boxes for people to do crazy mods. it wouldnt need to be complicated.

 

[droneb]

It seems good, but since there are not much Batt info online right now
ill be only making suppositions.

what would happen if i stack 2 batts in parallel?
(with or without the Sensor line conected 2 the second batt)
it it would work, then ill add one to my order.

if not, then how hackable is the batt so i open the package and stack the cells behind any circuit available.

if possible (no i wont do it i would wait until someone succesfuly do that)

Thanks for remembering me the Camera, OMG thats one thing i completely forgotten, ive seen some flexible cable minicams on .3 and 1.3 Mpx for usb fo videochat.

(hope one day a port of skype gets released).

and, why is everyone wanting more card readers, i thought "2 is more than enough " at the risk of sounding like BG.

 

[renegadechic]

as a bit of a hack you could cobble together some kind of greater hard disc with a torn apart usb hub and some old (or new) flash cards. fairly discrete stuff, though i am sure there must be better solutions.

oh and i suggested card readers for photographers on the move with all the different formats. its not all SD cameras available

 

[-Tj-]

i was talking to myself in chat and having a think and wondered how possible some of these would be

renegadechic: maybe some kind of camera units? maybe a multiple flash card reader on the edge with the SD card slots
renegadechic: an internal usb powered SSD drive?
renegadechic: possibly with extra battery
renegadechic: more speakers maybe..
renegadechic: people have mentioned chorded keyboards
renegadechic: i wonder if its beyond the realms of possibility to have a fairly low res fold out touchscreen that folds around and onto the keypad for playing (if its ever possible) DS games

nearly all those things could be done just with USB i reckon. it would be especially awesome if it was thick enough for an SSD and a spare battery alongside L2 and R2 and extra USB slots. maybe someone could manufacture empty battery extending boxes for people to do crazy mods. it wouldnt need to be complicated.

Speaking internally, I think all of what you asked could be possible, but you'd need a separate case if. "Empty battery extending boxes" are essentially what I was thinking from the start, something that just had a connection to the rear USB 2.0 port, support for adding up to 4 USB-based items to the box (not including L2/R2), and possibly battery relocation. I thought a cuttable grid inside the box would be great for modders, something they could cut to fit whatever they wanted to put in it (HDD, more boards, etc.). The fold out touchscreen might be a bit of work; everything I've found seems to involve a little bit of coding.

Thanks for remembering me the Camera, OMG thats one thing i completely forgotten, ive seen some flexible cable minicams on .3 and 1.3 Mpx for usb fo videochat.
...
and, why is everyone wanting more card readers, i thought "2 is more than enough " at the risk of sounding like BG.

Ya can't forget the camera! Extra card readers... I wouldn't mind something that could read MS Pro Duo cards so I could manage PSP files on the go.

 

[valhalla]

iPods make GREAT mass storage devices under ubuntu Linux - and most likely other flavors as well. I have an 80GB iPod that I received as a gift. I'll never use iTunes, so it's a big big thumb drive to me. It works great! The color screen is a bit overkill just to tell me whether or not it is connected, disconnected or in the process of ejecting, but hey, it works.

Do you know that there are a few iPod managers for linux, so that you don't need iTunes?

And there is also rockbox, which allows you to manage the music on your ipod (or other supported devices) via the mass storage interface, as well as play doom. It doesn't work on recent models yet, but AFAIK they are the ones that doesn't work as mass storage, so there are non-zero chances that you have an older working model.

 

[atomicthumbs]

 -snip-

 

[Vorporeal]

iPods make GREAT mass storage devices under ubuntu Linux - and most likely other flavors as well. I have an 80GB iPod that I received as a gift. I'll never use iTunes, so it's a big big thumb drive to me. It works great! The color screen is a bit overkill just to tell me whether or not it is connected, disconnected or in the process of ejecting, but hey, it works.

Do you know that there are a few iPod managers for linux, so that you don't need iTunes?

And there is also rockbox, which allows you to manage the music on your ipod (or other supported devices) via the mass storage interface, as well as play doom. It doesn't work on recent models yet, but AFAIK they are the ones that doesn't work as mass storage, so there are non-zero chances that you have an older working model.

Try yamipod, it's a good one.

 

[droneb]

the intention was not to manage music on an i-pod from the panda but to use it as a hard drive
like a pendrive thats it, it could be used broken and no display conected at all,even split, since it can work as a external hard drive its all good for me.

so no one knows what would happen if i stacked and connected in parallel 2 or more batts?

 

[renegadechic]

so no one knows what would happen if i stacked and connected in parallel 2 or more batts?

nope. i expect it might need a bit of software based programming to get it running how we would want it to run, but i am sure its doable and controlable.

 

[Grench]

the intention was not to manage music on an i-pod from the panda but to use it as a hard drive
like a pendrive thats it, it could be used broken and no display conected at all,even split, since it can work as a external hard drive its all good for me.

I have a better sounding more functional music player in my old Tapwave Zodiac. No kidding. You can check the specs on that one if you like. The 80GB iPod still makes a great thumb drive. I have toyed around with the idea of doing one of the micro-linux installs to it, but it's still a better thumb drive than anything else. I'll likely use it connected to my future Pandora at some point. I had no idea that newer ones did not work as mass storage devices - very sad.

so no one knows what would happen if i stacked and connected in parallel 2 or more batts?

I have a bit of knowledge here... My primary vehicle has two BIG batteries running in hard wired parallel. What you end up with, as far as things connected to it are concerned, is one double-capacity battery. Now for the caveats...

The batteries must both have the same (or close enough to be the same) discharge rate, top charge voltage and charge rate. Even within a single batch of batteries these are unlikely to be 'close enough'.

If the charge rate is different, one could still be calling for charge while the other is full - meaning that the charging system will be overcharging one battery while trying to top off the other.

If the discharge rate is different, then one battery will be discharging faster than the other and then trying to draw power back from the other.

If the top charge is different, the higher voltage battery (by any amount) will be trying to force-charge the already full one - causing it to fail prematurely.

If one battery fails, then the other will continue to try to charge it. This can cascade through a parallel system and kill all of the batteries in it as a good one fails through trying to charge a bad one.

In the automotive world here are 'battery minders' that only allow the charge or draw systems to push or pull from one battery at a time. I went with factory matched for parallel operation batteries in my application - see also expensive. Each battery gets mapped, then out of dozens, two get selected as being functional twins, then the rest go to stores to be put on shelves.

In the computer world, if I understand it right, the lithium-ion batteries have control hardware built into them to handle the parallel packs of cells in series. The control logic would also handle shutdown for wiring faults, prevent overcharging, prevent cross-charging, etc... Someone more familiar with the guts of the Pandora battery might be able to give us a rundown of the internal schematics of how it's on-battery-pack control logic works.

So, could you stack two battery packs on top of each other and wire them in parallel? Sure.. it would likely even work for a while. However, it would also likely destroy both battery packs over time as they will eat each other if they are not 100% identical in functional capacity and discharge patterns.

In My Humble Opinion Only - I'm not an electrician.

 

[-Tj-]

Regarding batteries, one thing you could think about doing is having one battery act as a backup charging pack. Wire it up so that it connects to Pandora's AC adapter port. Pandora should keep using that battery till it no longer gives a charge, then switch over to its own battery. You could charge them separately (manually), maybe include a manual shutoff switch in case you don't feel like using it.

I had a PSP external battery that worked this way. It didn't last long (poor quality), but that's essentially what it did.

 

[droneb]

Well, Ido know some bout batts and electronics, my first question was directed to those who have knowledge of the Batt circuit and the fuel gauge system.

if it requires some kind of signaling to start Discharging/charging, and the back charging detection etc.

usually on cellphone batts you can easily do a paraller pin connection and end up with nice stacked up Capacity.

but theres also that some will actually drain, but wont allow you to charge it (only will charge the master batt).

the joke here is that i tried to mod my ol laptop batt 4200mAh (similar to the panda much more times larger) but i ended up blowing the control circuit, since it didnt seem to have a OverDrain thresold and the accidental +- discharge puff. anyway that batt needed a cell change so no harm.

 

[WizardStan]

the intention was not to manage music on an i-pod from the panda but to use it as a hard drive
like a pendrive thats it, it could be used broken and no display conected at all,even split, since it can work as a external hard drive its all good for me.

That'd be like using the Pandora solely for checking your email: there are cheaper and better (for the purpose) devices out there that can do that, so why get a Pandora? It has gaming controls that you'd never use. ("You" in this case not being you, but being the fictional person that doesn't use it for the gaming controls at all)
You've got an ipod and are using it only for the hard drive? Why not take advantage of the mp3 capabilities as well?

 

[-Tj-]

Probably makes more sense if you consider this from his earlier post:

it seems that hacking an old used small Ipod or Ipodlike that has a Harddrive would make it as long as it would be usable by USB, plus it would surely have embedded Batt, maybe a broken display one could be cheap?, anyway it would have to be striped off its case.

Buy a used iPod off ebay or craigslist, one with a broken screen would be cheaper, strip off the case and buttons, use it for the hard drive. Wow... makes me think of humans as batteries in the Matrix.

However, to that end, I would imagine it'd just be better to go with the internal 1.8" HDD method instead. What might be interesting is if you could hack together both iPod and Pandora, have them share the internal memory, and maybe mount the screen and touch controls on the backside of the cover. Voila! iPandora.

... iPandora... (>_<)\

 

[droneb]

the intention was not to manage music on an i-pod from the panda but to use it as a hard drive
like a pendrive thats it, it could be used broken and no display conected at all,even split, since it can work as a external hard drive its all good for me.

That'd be like using the Pandora solely for checking your email: there are cheaper and better (for the purpose) devices out there that can do that, so why get a Pandora? It has gaming controls that you'd never use. ("You" in this case not being you, but being the fictional person that doesn't use it for the gaming controls at all)
You've got an ipod and are using it only for the hard drive? Why not take advantage of the mp3 capabilities as well?

why pp cant read all the context before badgering?

the idea was to get a economic 1.8 HDD with the USB controler Integrated. instead of buying brand new Box and tear it appart.,
an used Ipod does cost much less by that way than buying a used HD and a New HDD Box (then tear it appart, etc.).

the another advantage is to get the reduced circuit of the IPOD(Taking out all the not needed screen scroll and other Electronics. since the 1.8 HDD USB Box will be definetly larger.

 

[WizardStan]

why pp cant read all the context before badgering?

I did and I'm not badgering. Grench said he had a fully functional iPod, complete with colour screen, that is only being used as an external hard drive. A solution was presented that would allow him to continue using it exactly as he has been, and regain the MP3 features. You then summarily dismissed the solution as "that's not the point." Fine, if you get a broken hard-drive-only one, the MP3 playback is pretty useless, but Grench has one that supposedly works perfectly. By intentionally not taking advantage of the key feature of the device, it is a waste, not unlike (from my earlier analogy) using the Pandora only for checking email.

 

[Grench]

I did and I'm not badgering. Grench said he had a fully functional iPod, complete with colour screen, that is only being used as an external hard drive. A solution was presented that would allow him to continue using it exactly as he has been, and regain the MP3 features. You then summarily dismissed the solution as "that's not the point." Fine, if you get a broken hard-drive-only one, the MP3 playback is pretty useless, but Grench has one that supposedly works perfectly. By intentionally not taking advantage of the key feature of the device, it is a waste, not unlike (from my earlier analogy) using the Pandora only for checking email.

I already own and use a superior MP3 player (Tapwave Zodiac). The iPod's limited functionality does not come close to replacing it.

The 80GB iPod was free/gift. Yes it -can- be used for more, but it's greatest utility to me is as a USB powered 80GB thumb drive. My comment around it was more to do with the fact that it does indeed work with x86 and AMD64 Linux as a very good mass storage device. It may seem criminal to those of you who own, use and like your iPod - don't really care. It is doing the task that I have assigned it.

As for using a Pandora for email - I fully intend to use mine as a PDA, email, web surfing and MP3 machine. Yes, I realize it isn't it's 'proper use'. However, as I have found out with the Zodiac, game machines tend to have a -lot- better controls than non-game machines. I like having solid controls and broad functionality. Will I play games on it? Occasionally. Do I see games as it's #1 purpose for me? No.

The #1 expansion option I wish we could get for the Pandora? SDXC drivers. That would require OpenPandora to license the SDXC spec - which would be wise to do if the 2nd batch is looking large. They could then sell the software upgrade back to the rest of us as well as showing improved function for the 2nd batch without making hardware changes (just a thought guys).

Back to docking & expansion stations and the like...
We know that the Pandora expansion plug on the back has composite, svideo, audio in, audio out and UART access. What else is in there?

From what it looks like, whatever gets built (if anything) for a dock would have to plug into both the Pandora expansion plug and the USB-A connectors.

The USB-A is not going to give enough power to run the dock, so it would either need to be self-powered OR tap into the Pandora's main battery. Tapping into the main battery wouldn't be difficult, but we do not know if there is enough head room between the Pandora's max draw and it's 3.25A discharge cap (Per Mweston above). In fact, I don't think we would want the combined Pandora and expansion load to exceed 3.0A max.

Using a 2nd Pandora battery in the expansion - dedicated to the expansion would have some benefits. Common battery so that if you're using your Pandora but not the expansion, you could swap them out when your main runs down. The disadvantage is that it would dictate that the expansion be a brick.

The Pandora's capabilities are already pretty big. It is hard to justify a mobile expansion case without it including some pretty fancy stuff in it. Just a few extra USB ports isn't going to cut it. There are plenty of cheap USB hubs out there. If your intentions are to use it for a big mouse, big keyboard and other non-portable gear - you're probably going to be doing this at a desk with AC power anyway. I have a folding bluetooth keyboard and a credit-card sized bluetooth mouse - both battery operated. So... USB isnt' the only option in these.

So, how big is too big for an expansion if it's intended use is mobile? What could be crammed into this space to justify the development costs? What is the 'must have' feature? For mobile, my #1 would be more SDHC(SDXC?) storage slots - even if they're on a USB controller. #2 would be a 3" or so low-range woofer - can't really call a 3" speaker a sub even though HP and Lenovo do. I'm sure that the Pandora screen speakers are as nice as they get for the space they have, but a bigger cone for reinforcement would be kind of cool.

If it were envisioned as a non-portable docking station, what would need to be on it? In this case 3-7 USB ports, video out with a VGA translation or DVI or HDMI (yes, converted signal from the svideo), audio in/out, power connector, and everything else that the Pandora specific port has to offer. Would this include breaking the UART out into an RS-232? Is there anything else to be had through there? Maybe throw in another few SDHC card slots or a couple of 18in1 (or whatever) multi-card readers, an IRDA (for remotes), two 10/100/1000 hard wired ethernet ports (to use a Pandora as a router/firewall) just for good measure. All of the above would be -slow- since it would be limited to what can move in/out of the device through the available ports.

Fun stuff.

 

[droneb]

as for now, ive started with a mobile AddOn, mainly for Gaming purposes (LR2 Btns, rumble,and Ergonomics).

since its non official, i dont know how much it would cost to dev and other things, the thing is im going to make one fo myself right now and if pp find it usefull, then OP T could make and develop one more stable (and better looking) since im going to make mine with scraps and lots of Epoxy putty.

i really find amusing why pp needs so much USB ports, not like the panda could pump up current for that much things, or maybe capable of controlling all that much at once.

as for a Docking station, i would look further on the Video, since theres no sense into making a Signal to S vid then back to VGA sig.
as a docking station, there would be main peripherals for sure (keyb, mouse and VGA) but the ethernet option i wouldnt really know where to start.

i would also add charger, and audio (a xtra subwoofer would be enough).

but most of the stuff stated on a static docking station would be easily fullfiled by a AV Cable and a powered hub with everything already connected so panda connects and ready to go.

now that you spoke about the dvi, i would really like to know if the panda would be able to atach to a video signal like the beagle board seems to.


going back to the batt stuff, well doing math 4200 mAh split about 10 Hours then we get that panda consumes 420mA no way close to the 3.5 threshold but i still think that i wont tap the batt, but instead add a couple of standard AA battery.

i also dont expect to play not really much but when i play i want it to be as good as a commercial mobile console(or even more) so i would plug the add one if i expect to play games. besides, if the double(or triple) paralel batt idea works and is chargeable i would definitely make a mod on the add on to stack em up.

and finally Sry Wizard Stan, i though you directed your words at my points. but next time you should point @ if youre talking about something specific. its just that these days theres too much heat, so hounds and trolls seems to be really working this days.