Why the Android hate?

[EssoAir]

Hi everyone! I have a question for those on the forum that may not see eye to eye with me on certain topics (well anyone, really). I, as many of you know, a great supporter of android. I absolutely love it (its my favorite operating system). But many people here very much dislike it. Im not trying to enter in an argument or even a debate. I just want to pick the brains of people that differ in opinion. So, to anyone that would be so kind as to take the time, please explain why you like or dislike Android.

 

[ekianjo]

Because its a crappy operating system designed for touch screen crap?

 

[EssoAir]

Because its a crappy operating system designed for touch screen crap?

I was hoping for more "well formed" arguments. I really want to know why people dont like it. I really dont want childish "because it is" responses.

 

[TrashyMG]

It's a pain to develop software for.. it adds another layer of complexity to just being able to just compile and run.. I know it may not stop many here, but I really don't have any time to read up on how to do it..

Sure some one could argue that making PNDs is another layer of complexity too, but editing an XML file, changing a few script files and running a pnd making tool is a tad more easier than spending time reading up on how to interface Android properly..

plus almost all the games and such are optimized for multi-touch screens and accelerometers vs physical controls.. Apps don't know how to handle the Pandora's analog controls.. etc..

 

[WizardStan]

Other than ekianjo, who has said they hated Android?

Generally there isn't any hate, it's just an understanding of what it is suited for and what it isn't, and a full scale desktop experience is what it is not suited for.

 

[EssoAir]

Other than ekianjo, who has said they hated Android?Generally there isn't any hate, it's just an understanding of what it is suited for and what it isn't, and a full scale desktop experience is what it is not suited for.

If there were a true X Window System added to it in the open source version giving all devices the ability to run say XFCE or the like, would that improve your perception of the OS?

It's a pain to develop software for.. it adds another layer of complexity to just being able to just compile and run.. I know it may not stop many here, but I really don't have any time to read up on how to do it..


Sure some one could argue that making PNDs is another layer of complexity too, but editing an XML file, changing a few script files and running a pnd making tool is a tad more easier than spending time reading up on how to interface Android properly..


plus almost all the games and such are optimized for multi-touch screens and accelerometers vs physical controls.. Apps don't know how to handle the Pandora's analog controls.. etc..

While I agree with what you said, its kinda straying from the question. Im not asking about how it relates directly to the Pandora, but as an OS in general. And what do you mean by more difficult to develop for? My understanding was you could build and run at any time.

 

[TrashyMG]

While I agree with what you said, its kinda straying from the question. Im not asking about how it relates directly to the Pandora, but as an OS in general. And what do you mean by more difficult to develop for? My understanding was you could build and run at any time.

This is the Pandora forums so how I see it it does apply to this topic.. You can't just take any open source project and compile and run it like you would on any PC.. you need to use an SDK, re-write the user interface to use the Android API... etc.. It takes a huge amount of work.


I don't necessarily hate Android, sure I use it for Netflix and Kindle on the Pandora .. I just wouldn't buy a device like the Pandora if Android was my only option.

 

[mindlord]

I think the Android "distain" comes from the fact that the Angstrom Linux gooey center of the Pandora is on of the key things that makes it stand apart from the seemingly endless sea of Android "gaming" devices that are currently flooding the market. 

TBH, I really haven't found any game that Android has had to offer to my liking. I don't "hate" Android by any means. I do think that the Pandora and her community is best served by focusing on her unique qualities first and foremost, and approach Android as a "something a little extra."

This is of course only my opinion, and you are more than welcome to disagree. My feelings won't be hurt.

 

[EssoAir]

[quote name="TrashyMG" post="256302" timestamp="1372430936"


This is the Pandora forums so how I see it it does apply to this topic.. You can't just take any open source project and compile and run it like you would on any PC.. you need to use an SDK, re-write the user interface to use the Android API... etc.. It takes a huge amount of work.

 

[TrashyMG]

^ I think you mus-understand what is involved and what an (Software Development Kit) is.. It's not just logging into something or user permissions..

If I took code that was written for a PC which a good amount of what software the Pandora uses, I would have to spend a considerable amount of time coding it to work on Android. Were as I could take that same code and compile it for Windows or Linux or Mac very easily.. Compiling for ARM(Pandora or other similar devices) adds a little bit more complexity to things, but very little compared to the amount of coding involved with getting it to work in Android.

 

[ekianjo]

Huh, better not to go into technical details if you have no idea how android works.

 

[Exophase]

Yeah I don't think most people here hate Android, I think you're misinterpreting the desire that a majority have for Pandora and successor devices to not run Android primarily.

 

[F_Slim]

I only really tried it on the Pandora so far. First thing that put me off was the need to register with Google. Then I was unable to find anything, because nothing was where I expected to find it. Also navigation was somehow not quite as I expected. So after I spend a short time trying to find some settings I decided to just EXIT the darn thing, which took me 30 minutes to figure out how to do.

Granted: the last one is more a Pandora-related problem, since I expect any hardware running Android as main OS will probably be switched off with a button.

But to me it was entirely unintuitive to use from the beginning. And since it does not give me impression I can really DO anything with it, I don't feel any motivation to try and learn how to use it. I felt strangely constrained by it even.

I guess it's all practical reasons, I use Linux at work and have it on my laptop and my desktop PC at home. I can easily switch from one to the other, exchange files, SSH to any of them ... I just can do a lot of stuff, and it works the same on any of my devices. Maybe this is somehow possible with Android (don't tell me I have to buy an app for that though, that would be laughable), but why make things harder if the solution is already there?

I don't hate Android, I just couldn't find anything I like about it.

(And what Exophase said is also true)

 

[EssoAir]

I only really tried it on the Pandora so far. First thing that put me off was the need to register with Google. Then I was unable to find anything, because nothing was where I expected to find it. Also navigation was somehow not quite as I expected. So after I spend a short time trying to find some settings I decided to just EXIT the darn thing, which took me 30 minutes to figure out how to do.


Granted: the last one is more a Pandora-related problem, since I expect any hardware running Android as main OS will probably be switched off with a button.


But to me it was entirely unintuitive to use from the beginning. And since it does not give me impression I can really DO anything with it, I don't feel any motivation to try and learn how to use it. I felt strangely constrained by it even.


I guess it's all practical reasons, I use Linux at work and have it on my laptop and my desktop PC at home. I can easily switch from one to the other, exchange files, SSH to any of them ... I just can do a lot of stuff, and it works the same on any of my devices. Maybe this is somehow possible with Android (don't tell me I have to buy an app for that though, that would be laughable), but why make things harder if the solution is already there?


I don't hate Android, I just couldn't find anything I like about it.


(And what Exophase said is also true)

I suggest you use Android on a device it was intended for before passing full judgment. but I totally get whay you mean by "if it aint broke dont fix it" Also, the Android version on the Pandora is a very old. Ice Cream Sandwhich and Jelly Bean are far better. Also, you dont have to reguster with google, but its assumed you want to as it keeps all of your contacts, accounts, etc synced across devices. And for things like SSH and moving files around, etc, there are plenty of FOSS solutions on Android.

 

[Asiyura]

I have 3 devices that run on android I don't - hate - it.

It's just clunky and tend to slow down devices that would have been nice and reactive with an OS "tailored" to use the full power of the hardware. (android adds too much "padding" between software and hardware, it's a major loss of performances)

And I would have hated a pandora with android on it. The reason is simple : almost no software would have been as fast as they are with linux.

EDIT :

Now it's MY turn to ask something : Why some people want to put android on everything?

It's a phone/tablet OS, nothing more!

 

[WizardStan]

If there were a true X Window System added to it in the open source version giving all devices the ability to run say XFCE or the like, would that improve your perception of the OS?

It would need a proper windowing/multi-tasking system and the ability to run C/C++ compiled code for a start. Whether the compiler takes the source and compiles it to native or to their Dalvik byte code is irrelevant, so long as the differences are transparent.

 

[_wb_]

Android is nice, but it feels kind of limiting to me. It's fine for something like a phone or casual touch-based gaming device, but not something I would use for "real stuff".

Here's an analogy:

Android is like LEGO blocks, a full GNU/Linux system (like the Pandora OS) is like real bricks and mortar and all of that. Both have their uses. LEGO is nice to play with, and you cannot really do anything wrong with it. But it is a bit limiting, and I wouldn't try to build my actual house out of it. Real bricks are a bit harder to deal with, it's not really a kid's toy and there are plenty of ways to mess things up badly. But they are also a lot stronger and totally suitable to build real houses.

 

[notaz]

There are technical problems too like it starting to bloat quite a bit (I heard you can't even run 4.2 any more without 1GB or RAM, if you want apps you need even more, and I consider 1GB quite a lot for OS to take). Forcing Java on everyone is also not nice, RetroArch people say that Java's garbage collector constantly interrupting the process and causing hiccups make their release inferior to iOS.

 

[EssoAir]

EDIT :
Now it's MY turn to ask something : Why some people want to put android on everything?
It's a phone/tablet OS, nothing more!

What makes you say its a Phone/Tablet OS only? I have a Google TV and it works great! Also the Nexus Q is pretty cool (but over priced). There are lots of consoles comming out with it and they have shown off lots of cool games. I use Android on my desktop on top of Windows 8 simply because not all software available of Android is available on Windows or Mac OS or Debian-based Distros. I think the reason peoplewant to put Android on everything is because its the first open source OS that was a hit with consumers. The more pwople using an OS the more attractive it is to for-profit developers. The more software created for an OS, the more likely it is to be used because it has the software a consumer wants and needs. Its the combination of open sourcity and large software library that make Android so freaking cool. You can stick it on any ARM or x86 device and BAM all that software that was created for it comes right along. This means, if Android ran on every form factor, a developer could create a piece of software for one OS and it works on every device a consumer could ever want.

 

[EssoAir]

Android is nice, but it feels kind of limiting to me. It's fine for something like a phone or casual touch-based gaming device, but not something I would use for "real stuff".


Here's an analogy:


Android is like LEGO blocks, a full GNU/Linux system (like the Pandora OS) is like real bricks and mortar and all of that. Both have their uses. LEGO is nice to play with, and you cannot really do anything wrong with it. But it is a bit limiting, and I wouldn't try to build my actual house out of it. Real bricks are a bit harder to deal with, it's not really a kid's toy and there are plenty of ways to mess things up badly. But they are also a lot stronger and totally suitable to build real houses.

brilliant analogy! I might use that in the future. And honestly you've helped me arrive at the point of this thread. I thought I'd have to segway this myself, but you did it for me. Thanks!


So, what if Android and GNU/Linux (preferably Debian or Mint) ran simultaniously off the same Kernal. You could have the software library of Android and the power and versatility of GNU/Linux. All the apps could run side by side in Windows giving barely any differentiation between things built for Android and things built for GNU/Linux. The only difference would be a small "back" button on the Bar on top of the window for Android apps, as not all have that built in.