The 1000-traces-puzzle

Discussion in 'Pyra News' started by EvilDragon, Jul 7, 2015.

  1. EvilDragon

    EvilDragon Administrator Staff Member

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    Some things in life are bad... they can really make you mad.
    Yep, we got those as well - but thankfully not that many and not that bad.

    Let's start with todays news post and find out how good and bad things are :)


    The CPU board

    As you probably know, basically the full hardware except for the CPU board is finished.
    If you followed us on Twitter, you already know the progress Nikolaus had.
    If not, here's a nice summary picture attached.

    differences.png


    Since June 18th, more than 400 traces haven been routed - and now we're down to about 50!
    Things are getting narrow, so we're switching from an 8-layer PCB to a 10-layer PCB.
    With that change, the CPU PCB should be finished and going into prototype production about end of this week!

    So, what's the bad news?
    Well, we won't have the CPU boards in time for the GamesCom.
    Producing an 8-layer PCB takes at least 4 weeks - and there's nothing to speed that up (it's the process that takes so long).
    A 10-layer PCB 5 weeks - and as GamesCom is 2 weeks earlier this year than it normally is, we won't get it in time.

    However, we still try to assemble a full unit as good as possible, so the display, the case, etc. should all be finished and working fine.
    But it will be externally connected to the devboard.

    BUT: Shortly after the GamesCom, we should have fully assembled, fully working prototypes available... then I'll finally be able to spam you all with videos.
    And preorders could start in September... yep, we're really getting close :)


    The keymat

    We had some last changes for the keymat as well.
    All keys (not only the action buttons) will now fully be of plastic, no more silicone surroundings anymore.
    This should further improve the keymat, which will be great!

    The bad news:
    That change will take another week, so we also won't make it for the GamesCom, BUT again it should be finished mid September.

    We need to send submit the printing file for the keymat next week, so we're currently heavily discussing about the keyboard layout (in the keyboar layout section of the boards).


    The case

    Well, not much to report here. It's finished, the last print showed that everything fits and is working fine, so we will have printed cases ready at the GamesCom.
    In case you missed it on twitter, here is a picture of the backside of the Pyra with the latest printed case.
    The shoulder buttons work REALLY well! You can easily press one, the other one or both comfortably :)


    PyraBackside.jpg


    Shortly after the GamesCom, work will start on the mold, so real plastic cases should pop up in October / November... and then we can create thousands of cases within a few days :)


    3D driver

    The bad news: As the OMAP5 is in legacy mode for TI, the 3D driver will not be further developed.
    The good news: We are in luck to be in good contact with some TI employees.
    Two other SoCs from TI use the same SGX, and the binary blobs should work on the OMAP5 as well.
    The GFX team will try to test them, so we should get updated drivers (though it will take time until early 2016).


    Pyra Mobile Internet

    Yay, we got out own internet tarif!
    The offer is only valid in Germany, but I think it's pretty good (I compared it to others, and they were all more expensive).

    Speed: Up to 21,6MBit/s (4G/LTE)
    Network: D2
    Contract Period: 24 Months, Renewal possible
    Included volume: 3GB/month with 21,6MBit/s, after that it will be throttled to 64kbit/s (no additional costs!)

    It can be used with any mobile internet device in Germany. No simlock or similar.
    Perfectly suited for the Pyra when it's out (of course), but also perfect for tablets, Mifis, LTE-Router, etc.

    Normal price is 12 EUR per month - but right now, I got a special deal. If you order it until end of July, you get 3 months for free.
    And you can also use this voucher: 5GFKT2BM
    This will lower the price to 10 EUR per month. Together with those 3 months for free, you've got 8,88 EUR per month, for full high-speed mobile internet!

    You can find more information and order it here: DragonBox Shop Pyra Mobile


    Other quick information

    Updated LCD Cables are in production and should be finished until the end of July.
    3000 batteries are on the way to us and should arrive middle until end of August.

    In case you want to help us with donations, you can now donate using our shop and therefore do that via PayPal, Credit Card or Bank Transfer.
    Go here to do that: https://www.dragonbox.de/de/103-spenden

    And if you want to support the project with a larger investment (and interest), contact me directly (EvilDragon@openpandora.org).
    While it's not necessarily needed, it will surely help us getting all parts in time.

    The BEST way to help us though will be sharing all our videos and posts when the final prototype is ready.
    We need at least 1000 preorders - but the more we get, the easier it will be for us :)

    That's it for today - feel free to ask any questions here in case you have some :)
     
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  2. slaeshjag

    slaeshjag ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    As I've mentioned before, there's EU PCB houses that can make 10 layer boards in a week. Although it costs a whole lot  :rolleyes:

    A shame about the 3D drivers. I probably won't order before I know we actually will have a 3D driver...
     
  3. TrashyMG

    TrashyMG Sarcasm Dispenser Staff Member

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    So how much money can the community here throw at Ti to make it more of a priority to try these SGX drivers? Because it sounds like it's just a matter of clearing someone's schedule from what I read in the emails.
     
  4. WizardStan

    WizardStan Mega GP Mania

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    That does sound like a dangerous situation with a light at the end of a long dark tunnel full of traps. Fingers crossed we don't trip too often getting there.
     
  5. EvilDragon

    EvilDragon Administrator Staff Member

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    Hm, we checked with various big ones. According to them, it's not physically possible.

    If you know one, let me know and I'll contact them. Depending on the price, we would make use of them.

    Well, we will HAVE a 3D driver. The current one can be used with a lot of hacking around (as notaz showed last year at the GamesCom).

    The new drivers should require less hacking though.

    It wasn't any different with the Pandora :)

    The first versions of the OS were horrible in many regards, why should it be any different with a new device? :)

    Hm, not sure they'll do that, but I could ask ;)
     
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  6. Urben

    Urben Very Active Member

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    Well even if the drivers are old, we got them don't we? I guess until the updated come (I hope they do) we will be fine with the old ones.

    I'm thrilled to see one at the Gamescom. The CPU Board isn't too bad, I'm just sad I won't be able to experience the final feeling of the keymat.

    I won't get the tarif right away since I got no mobile internet device right now, maybe in the future. But I must say I quite enjoy using SIM cards which aren't registrated on my name.

    I'm not sure if I can pay you a visit, tell you my name is Elvis and I put the cash on the table without any further questions, but I will ask you that in private when the time comes :p .
     
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  7. slaeshjag

    slaeshjag ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    They can be used on the ancient unstable ubuntu 12.04 that Ti provides with lots of hacking around. Before I see it on an up-to-date distro, I consider it moot.

    I can't say for sure that it's possible, as I've never gone further than using online quotations. The one I know of off the top of my head, whose online quotation does allow for 7 wd delivery of 10 10-layer boards, is eurocircuits.com.
     
  8. EvilDragon

    EvilDragon Administrator Staff Member

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    The DreamCast emulator shown at the GamesCom last year was with standard Debian Jessie.

    I never even tried Ubuntu :)
     
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  9. Bosbeetle

    Bosbeetle Terminally lost

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    This 3d Driver issue makes me even more optimistic about the modular pyra design, a very good choice to do a CPU board. :)  
     
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  10. thatgui

    thatgui Advanced Member

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    I don't know if they "fit", but I guess it won't hurt throwing it in: http://www.contag.de/leiterplatten.php?express_speed-nolimit.html
     
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  11. EvilDragon

    EvilDragon Administrator Staff Member

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    Well, yes. The better the Pyra sells, the higher the chances to get companies to sell me their SoC.

    However, if everyone is too scared to order the Pyra because the software won't be completely working from the start, it's Game Over.

    That's the only thing I'm scared about: Not getting enough preorders. Everything else can be sorted out.

    Then again, I could also try Kickstarter if we won't get enough preorders, but it'll push back the release as I couldn't order parts before Kickstarter is over.
     
  12. WizardStan

    WizardStan Mega GP Mania

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    I've seen a number of kickstarters get funded within days, take those numbers to a bank, and get an immediate loan so production could start right away.Even if you couldn't do that, you'd kind of have to anyway with the pre-orders, yeah? Wait until there's enough for a batch run? What's a few extra weeks?

    Kickstarter may take a little longer and they'll take their cut of the money, but you can't really argue with the publicity that it brings. I'm in no matter what you decide, I think I speak for most here that we'll offer whatever support we can. :)
     
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  13. Bosbeetle

    Bosbeetle Terminally lost

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    You really think you won't get enough pre-orders? I guess all the regulars here on the forum will at least do a pre-order... I would see a kickstarter as a final option since I think you can get enough people to pre-order without a middle man.
     
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  14. matzesu

    matzesu Hardcore Member

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    I would rather prefer the good old preorder like on the Pandora via your Shop and then Bank Transfer via Terminal,


    Place the Preeorder and then wait the Months it will take until the UPS Guy rings on my Door Bell..


    Progress seems quite amazing, and im looking forward for the 10000000 Videos of the Pyra Prototyphe..


    Was it originaly planed to made the cpu board in 10 layer, or is it because some traces are to narrow??


    And how to went from 8 layers to 10 layers??


    Pyra for Chrissmass?? Lets wait and trink some Coffee, Tee, Cola or Beer ..
     
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  15. EvilDragon

    EvilDragon Administrator Staff Member

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    No need to do that. GC is ordering the parts, and as soon as the Kickstarter is funded (even early), I'm sure GC would be happy to order knowing the payment is secured.

    I'm always concerned about stuff like that.

    That said, I also had hoped to be able to sell the remaining Pandoras, and it turned out they sell faster than we can build them :)

    It's better being careful than too optimistic (like Craig was).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 7, 2015
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  16. Hồng Thất Công

    Hồng Thất Công Đả Cẩu Bổng Pháp

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    Yay! Will be ordering in two months! :)


    Don't worry Ed, you've got my order. :)
     
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  17. matzesu

    matzesu Hardcore Member

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    Mee too :)


    And i want also a carry case, but its not neccesary yet..
     
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  18. FaeMinx

    FaeMinx Rainbow Liberation Instigation

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    Great news about the plastic key caps! :)


    Sad to hear about the 3D driver, but I almost expected something like that.


    It hardly even phases me because I know we can get a new soc in a few years time.


    My big concern is the keyboard driver and how the keyboard actually functions... But I'm only being swayed by what I've read on these boards... I may be worrying over nothing.


    I *was* hoping for perfect dosbox and QEMU as I have a lot of win98 stuff I want to run.
     
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  19. Urben

    Urben Very Active Member

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    Btw are any concept pictures of the caps available?

    I wasn't very pleased to hear the key had thick transparent edges around the black paint. I hope this is no longer the case.
     
  20. edgex004

    edgex004 Advanced Member

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    I'm interested to see a side to side comparison of the final case with the Pandora. The thickness looks like it has increased slightly. Too bad that it may not fit in some of my pockets anymore, but I'll still plan on finding a way to carry it everywhere somehow!
     

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