Beta Stuff For Testing !

[pepone]

Here are some accurate tests, the gngeo emulator is running with "scale 2x" and "scanline 50%" :

Metal Slug X @ 200mhz : ~28 fps
Metal Slug X @ 300mhz : ~43 fps
Metal Slug X @ 400mhz : ~58 fps
Metal Slug X @ 500mhz : ~71 fps
Metal Slug X @ 600mhz : ~83 fps
Metal Slug X @ 700mhz : ~93 fps
Metal Slug X @ 800mhz : ~101 fps

Twinkle Star Sprites @ 200mhz : ~30 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 300mhz : ~49 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 400mhz : ~65 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 500mhz : ~80 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 600mhz : ~94 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 700mhz : ~108 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 800mhz : ~116 fps

And for fun :
Metal Slug X @ 800mhz without "scale 2x" and "scanline 50%" effects : ~146 fps


Wow :blink:
With sound on?

 

[Yod4z]

Metal Slug X @ 200mhz : ~28 fps
only? maybe the scal2x is realy heavy and can be made by hardware, I think on GP2x i have the same framerate

 

[pepone]

Metal Slug X @ 200mhz : ~28 fps
only? maybe the scal2x is realy heavy and can be made by hardware, I think on GP2x i have the same framerate

At first I've readed Scale2x blitter, that's what impressed me, but maybe it's only a scale by 2?
This scaling is in software in gngeo and not optimized though.

 

[Yod4z]

On GP2x at 200MHZ without raster with Metal Slug X
Without sound 56-60FPS
With sound 22KHz 1-18FPS average 5FPS
With sound 11KHz 8-38 FPS average 17-18

OK i have no memory ^^, i play Neogeo game on my GP2x without sound all the time this is for this that i was thinking about more FPS on GP2x.

Pepone on GP2x there's no scale, no?

When i get my Pandora i do some test witrh Gngeo like i have done with GP2x http://wiki.gp2x.org/wiki/Fr:GnGeo2x#Liste_des_jeux

 

[fusion_power]

All my tests where made with raster and interpolation effect, and the pandora running at 500mhz.

Here are some accurate tests, the gngeo emulator is running with "scale 2x" and "scanline 50%" :

Metal Slug X @ 200mhz : ~28 fps
Metal Slug X @ 300mhz : ~43 fps
Metal Slug X @ 400mhz : ~58 fps
Metal Slug X @ 500mhz : ~71 fps
Metal Slug X @ 600mhz : ~83 fps
Metal Slug X @ 700mhz : ~93 fps
Metal Slug X @ 800mhz : ~101 fps

Twinkle Star Sprites @ 200mhz : ~30 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 300mhz : ~49 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 400mhz : ~65 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 500mhz : ~80 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 600mhz : ~94 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 700mhz : ~108 fps
Twinkle Star Sprites @ 800mhz : ~116 fps


And for fun :
Metal Slug X @ 800mhz without "scale 2x" and "scanline 50%" effects : ~146 fps



Very informative, Thanx. Without luxury things like Scanlines (and does scaling really eats FPS? I thought this is a simple hardware feature) I could imagine, Metal Slug @ 200MHz runs not slower onto the Pandora than onto the GP2X at 200 MHz.
Oh, good Raster-Effect test is the great "Neo Turf Masters". Buggy in GnGeo (without this effect it runs fine but looks ugly), graphical correct rasters with FBA but very slow there.

At first I've readed Scale2x blitter, that's what impressed me, but maybe it's only a scale by 2?
This scaling is in software in gngeo and not optimized though.

Could this be a general performance problem for the Pandora if Games need a simple scale or can it be easily fixed at the software side?

Maybe Scanlines can also be done in Hardware. At least we can clock the Pandora to 400MHz for Full Speed (and full Sound???) NeoGeo. Not bad for the beginning.

On GP2x at 200MHZ without raster with Metal Slug X
Without sound 56-60FPS
With sound 22KHz 1-18FPS average 5FPS
With sound 11KHz 8-38 FPS average 17-18

OK i have no memory ^^, i play Neogeo game on my GP2x without sound all the time this is for this that i was thinking about more FPS on GP2x.

Pepone on GP2x there's no scale, no?

When i get my Pandora i do some test witrh Gngeo like i have done with GP2x http://wiki.gp2x.org/wiki/Fr:GnGeo2x#Liste_des_jeux



Uh, I played Metal Slug X a very long time onto the GP2X and it has more than 8-38FPS with 11Khz at 200MHz Clockspeed I think (RAM Tweaks enabled). It has slowdowns but You can play it good. I think the Pandora Could handle this game with full 44.1Khz Sound at 300-350MHz if the Emu is really optimized. (can the SGX used for something to accelerate? Or is this part only in 3D acceleration useful? )

...oh does the Pandora need (or profit) also from RAM-Tweaks or was this only useful onto the GP2X?

 

[Yod4z]

may be more option like Hq3 scaling for those who want to use Neogeo game with great scaling at 500Mhz. Can be done with 3D chip?

I would love an emulator with option to set otimaticaly the cpus freq to the need for the game to get 60FPS but i don't think is possible.

Ram Tweak are only for GP2x not for other system.

I don't know if the Pandora version use the Notaz 68k ASM core but may be it can do some speed trick

 

[fusion_power]

I would love an emulator with option to set otimaticaly the cpus freq to the need for the game to get 60FPS but i don't think is possible.

Well, I HOPE this will be a standard main feature of the Pandora: automatic clocking to have optimal Clock speed to keep constant 60FPS (or 30 FPS or whatever a Game need)
AFAIK, the OMAP Chipset is designed to have such power saving features but I don't know if the Chipset or the OS can do this automaticly or every single program has to support this feature or control it per instructions.

I hope we will find this out as soon as possible, I don't want to waste a single MHz and keep a battery charge as long as possible...without minimizing gaming fun of course! (No more low res sound in Emus or disabeling graphical effects to win Performance!!! ^_^ )

 

[Chip]

Well, I HOPE this will be a standard main feature of the Pandora: automatic clocking to have optimal Clock speed to keep constant 60FPS (or 30 FPS or whatever a Game need)
AFAIK, the OMAP Chipset is designed to have such power saving features but I don't know if the Chipset or the OS can do this automaticly or every single program has to support this feature or control it per instructions.
From what I've read, if at any time you're not giving the processor something to do, it goes to sleep. So if the emulator is written to run at a constant frame rate, and the processor finishes a frame early, it will simply sleep (using significantly less power) until it is time to make the next frame. This does require that the emulator be written a specific way, but as I understand it, it's not so much making the processor run slower as having it "do nothing" correctly when there's nothing to do.

Perhaps an actual programmer can fill us in on the specifics.

 

[Cpasjuste]

On GP2x at 200MHZ without raster with Metal Slug X
Without sound 56-60FPS
With sound 22KHz 1-18FPS average 5FPS
With sound 11KHz 8-38 FPS average 17-18

OK i have no memory ^^, i play Neogeo game on my GP2x without sound all the time this is for this that i was thinking about more FPS on GP2x.

Pepone on GP2x there's no scale, no?

When i get my Pandora i do some test witrh Gngeo like i have done with GP2x http://wiki.gp2x.org/wiki/Fr:GnGeo2x#Liste_des_jeux




Some things to note :
GnGeo is compiled with the C 68k emu and ASM z80 emu, because there is a bug with the cyclone asm core, which prevent some tile/layer to be drawn, and since i'm not an ASM guru, i can do nothing for now, but we can see some improvement here in the future.
Second thing to note, all is down in software, so we can image some easy improvement in the future.

For pepone :
It was not the scale2x effect, but scale x 2 like you tought.
With the scale2x effect, 22khz sound and 500mhz Cpu we get 54 average fps on twinkle thing sprite.

 

[fusion_power]

Sounds plausible, Chip.
I just had the PC in my mind. No programm needs to tell the modern CPUs how fast the Clockspeed has to be. The Processor simply clocks low when there is no busy stuff to do and clocks high when a program needs power. AFAIK you only have to set this once in the Bios. (I only have a old PC with constant clockspeed so I don't know the details how the modern CPUs manage this feature)

 

[craigix]

Wow, those stats are using the C core?!

 

[pepone]

Some things to note :
GnGeo is compiled with the C 68k emu and ASM z80 emu, because there is a bug with the cyclone asm core, which prevent some tile/layer to be drawn, and since i'm not an ASM guru, i can do nothing for now, but we can see some improvement here in the future.
Second thing to note, all is down in software, so we can image some easy improvement in the future.

Strange, the cyclone core work without any problem on other arm platform.
Maybe some kind of regression with the cortex?

QUOTE


For pepone :
It was not the scale2x effect, but scale x 2 like you tought.
With the scale2x effect, 22khz sound and 500mhz Cpu we get 54 average fps on twinkle thing sprite.


Really not bad! especially without using cyclone!

 

[craigix]

I'd like to know, out of curiosity, what it gets in terms of FPS with cyclone enabled?

 

[Cpasjuste]

I'd like to know, out of curiosity, what it gets in terms of FPS with cyclone enabled?

No prob, let's try right now ...

Ok done :

With the scale2x effect, 22khz sound and 500mhz Cpu we get 54 average fps on twinkle thing sprite with the C68k core, and 82 average fps with the cyclone core.
But like i said, there is a problem with this one, some layer are not rendered correctly, they seems to be rendered but outside the screen surface, sometime i can see a part of them at the bottom of the screen... here is what i mean :

 

[Yod4z]

wow! 8) 54 to 82 fps. I'm realy dead this is a good perf for neogeo fans . I think Notaz or Pepone can correct this "little" problem with Cyclone when they can put some handwork on Pandora

 

[RajTakhar]

You have to admit it look amazing on the Pandora now. Even more so when its been optimized a little more by perhaps Notaz, Pepone, others in the forum.

Those framrates are simply amazing given not much tweaking has occurred yet.

The only handheld I had previously which could emulate Neo-Geo MVS quite reasonably was the JXD301 - but only for a certain number of games.

The Gizmondo actually worked well, but again it was limited to a certain number of games as you had to process the roms via an app on the PC.

Now this begs a question - Are the Neo-Geo roms just placed as zip files under a directory or does some form of trimming activity take place against them?

Additionally will it be capable of playing neo-geo CD files? (i know the zip had the bios files but i was unsure that the emulator ran them or not) :unsure:

That would be wicked as you would then be able to play the not well known shoot em ups such as Iron Clad can be played - I had this many moons ago and miss it, back in the day the blumming CD cost me more than the Pandora.

Great Work - Now Someone please port a PC-Engine Emulator (Ok I love Shoot-em-ups )

I'd like to say great work to Cpasjuste and thanks for all the stuff so far - you laid the foundations for some really good emulators to be available for the Pandora

 

[Yod4z]

Now this begs a question - Are the Neo-Geo roms just placed as zip files under a directory or does some form of trimming activity take place against them?

No need to do some trick juste use the rom as zip file like on your PC, the Pandora have enough memory (256Mo) to put large NeoGeo ROMs

 

[ldesnogu]

Strange, the cyclone core work without any problem on other arm platform.
Maybe some kind of regression with the cortex?

This might be due to the use of what ARM calls "UNPREDICTABLE" instructions or behaviours. I've seen such instructions used on GBA, and some of them won't behave the same on Cortex-A8. For instance, LDR r0,[r0],#12 shouldn't be used.

 

[fusion_power]

Strange, the cyclone core work without any problem on other arm platform.
Maybe some kind of regression with the cortex?

This might be due to the use of what ARM calls "UNPREDICTABLE" instructions or behaviours. I've seen such instructions used on GBA, and some of them won't behave the same on Cortex-A8. For instance, LDR r0,[r0],#12 shouldn't be used.

Is this a problem that can be fixed?

And how fast is the NeoGeo emulator with plain hardware scaling (2x) and no additional filters?

 

[notaz]

there is a bug with the cyclone asm core

Sure about that? There should be no problems with Cyclone, lots of projects use it without problems, including MAME and Amiga emus. The last time I looked at gngeo code it was using some old cyclone version, make sure you use one from here. There also might be problems with glue code between Cyclone and the rest of emu.

This might be due to the use of what ARM calls "UNPREDICTABLE" instructions or behaviours. I've seen such instructions used on GBA, and some of them won't behave the same on Cortex-A8. For instance, LDR r0,[r0],#12 shouldn't be used.


I'm quite sure I haven't used anything like that.