BenTolputt
Member
I'm Aussie and I've yet to receive an email on it. I've been checking and so far, nada.
I ordered via debit card and as yet no refund either.
I ordered via debit card and as yet no refund either.
fettouhi said:Let me get this straight. Regarding the reordering, is it only costumers who have ordered directly from gbax.com that will be affected? I ordered my pandora from (live in Denmark)
http://openpandora.org/retro.html
and I paid with my visa.
My order was through http://openpandora.org/retro.html and I need to re-order.
To the various people wondering about randomness etc: It is possible that they cannot declare a reason - that happens in business. They have given the forum the information, Chip has communicated with Craig and started the 'official' post and anybody affected will be told by email, ie personally, privately, confidentially, professionally.
When it's done it has been said that they will tell everybody it's done.
If this were most other companies you would not find out until you got an email and even that would not likely give as much detail, or give away a massive spec increase.
We've said it before, but relax, wait and see if you get an email.
fettouhi said:Let me get this straight. Regarding the reordering, is it only costumers who have ordered directly from gbax.com that will be affected? I ordered my pandora from (live in Denmark)
http://openpandora.org/retro.html
No. By GBAX I meant "Craig's store". There were a couple different URLs provided for different regions, but everything except Germany and Turkey (and maybe Spain? I don't remember if they had their own shop or not) went through Craig's bank and is potentially affected.
Zarneth said:And to all the folks posting "I haven't gotten anything yet!", please keep in mind that it's only been one day. Each refund has to be done individually, and as I said in the original post, the whole lot is expected to take about a week.joa said:Also, changing the definition of credit card for the sake of this issue doesn't help either.
Do you mean debit cards counted as credit cards? It's because at the receiving end it all looks like credit cards. Debit cards are just a dirty hack on top of the existing credit card system. B)Exactly. The reason that you can use debit cards, gift cards, etc. as credit cards is because banks treat them as if they were credit cards. There is no differentiation on the merchant side between different types of cards. As far as Craig or his bank can tell, they are all credit cards.
Would you happen to know if these are being done in any particular order? I ordered within moments of the pre-order going live, and haven't received an email, whereas a friend of mine who ordered about an hour later has had one.Chip said:And to all the folks posting "I haven't gotten anything yet!", please keep in mind that it's only been one day. Each refund has to be done individually, and as I said in the original post, the whole lot is expected to take about a week.
cools said:Would you happen to know if these are being done in any particular order? I ordered within moments of the pre-order going live, and haven't received an email, whereas a friend of mine who ordered about an hour later has had one.
Other than geographically, as listed in my original post, I do not believe there is any pattern.
Phawx said:CTfan,
Look, I can see you are really upset. We got a RAM upgrade free of charge. That should be enough. Why bother saying Paypal was FUBAR when you were a propellant supporting Paypal?
Demanding MORE from Pandora Co. is silly. If you honestly feel that Pandora Co. isn't doing enough for you, ask for a refund.
Otherwise it just seems like you are complaining for the fun of it.
...says the typical drive-by newbie that hardly participates in the community at all. The RAM and NAND upgrades are great, don't get me wrong, but I'm not demanding more from Craig and Co., just what they promised. Shipment by late November, pictures of a final pre-production prototype (that was supposed to be weeks ago) and a GUI, which they have now shown us. Again, the current situation isn't exactly bad, but the old saying, "Don't make promises you can't keep" is applicable here.
+1 for sheer common sense.CronoTriggerfan said:Again, the current situation isn't exactly bad, but the old saying, "Don't make promises you can't keep" is applicable here.
BeefJerky said:Just out of curiosity, has anyone yet had confirmation of the refund going through?
Apart from the fact that the BIN identifies it as a debit card, and that debit cards attract a fixed fee rather than a percentage of the transaction...Chip said:There is no differentiation on the merchant side between different types of cards. As far as Craig or his bank can tell, they are all credit cards.
Those first two options both make logical sense to me. I don't understand why so many people who are presumably adults, (or at least teens!) are choosing the third option. It's painfully obvious that it won't accomplish anything.CronoTriggerfan said:Shipment by late November, pictures of a final pre-production prototype (that was supposed to be weeks ago) and a GUI, which they have now shown us. Again, the current situation isn't exactly bad, but the old saying, "Don't make promises you can't keep" is applicable here.
Ok, so they're a little bit behind? What're you going to do? Whine about it?
Behind, on-time, ahead of schedule, your options stay the same. You can :
-- Stay the Course and wait.
-- Give up hope and demand a refund.
-- Whine like a child and stop your foot. (Making empty threats is optional.)
CronoTriggerfan said:...says the typical drive-by newbie that hardly participates in the community at all.
Dude, enough with the trolling.
chiark said:Apart from the fact that the BIN identifies it as a debit card, and that debit cards attract a fixed fee rather than a percentage of the transaction...Chip said:There is no differentiation on the merchant side between different types of cards. As far as Craig or his bank can tell, they are all credit cards.
If you don't like speculation, skip the rest of this.
I've been thinking about this, and am now slightly concerned about the funding of Pandora. Here's my supposition, making the assumption that pre-ordering was to fund the manufacturing process because it couldn't be funded in other ways:
- Money has come in from the preorders paid on credit/debit cards
- Parts have been ordered on the basis money is in
- Bank is saying that they will not release money from cards because of high risk of chargebacks
- manufacturers needs paying or demand payment up front due to unknown credit rating of Pandora/...
- specs change. Now risk of chargeback is large as people may receive goods "signficantly different" from as advertised and therefore will drop immediately on the merchant's head. Bank could end up carrying can - see below.
- Bank will not release funds
- refunds are being sent from the "held" pool of money because bank will not release funds.
- manufacturer still needs paying...
I can't blame the bank for being awkward whatsoever.
Worst case scenario is that Pandora can't deliver the product it promised, people claim the money back off their credit card issuer, credit card issuer claims money back from merchant acquirer (Craig's bank). Bank tries to get money back off Craig, to find that it's all gone paying manufacturer.
Bank is left exposed to the tune of £800,000 (4000x200) only secured on incomplete pandoras or parts from manufacturers. This assumes no funds are available from the devs or other businesses they are involved in, which might be utterly wrong!
In the current scenario of the world's state of financial institutions, do you think they're going to take a punt on a relatively unknown player, or do you think they're going to dig their heels in a bit?
FWIW, I don't have a mail yet and despite trusting the devs I wouldn't send a bank transfer. Once the refund is in, I'll happily pay again... With credit card.
Great post. Now, if Chip/Craig can be open about the situation I'll happily reorder with a credit card. If another variant of "Everything's fine" is produced, I'll keep my money.
Thanks, but do bear in mind it is pure speculation and is undoubtedly wrong!ngchol said:Great post. Now, if Chip/Craig can be open about the situation I'll happily reorder with a credit card. If another variant of "Everything's fine" is produced, I'll keep my money.
chiark said:Apart from the fact that the BIN identifies it as a debit card, and that debit cards attract a fixed fee rather than a percentage of the transaction...
This is only true for merchants who are set up to accept debit cards. Some are, most aren't. If you didn't enter your debit pin number then it is a credit card transaction.
As for the speculation, you're reading way more into the situation than is really there. There is absolutely no risk that the first batch will not be made and delivered. Well, no financial risk, anyway. If a meteor turns the factory and all the parts into a smoking crator then we're probably screwed. Nothing less than that sort of disaster could totally prevent production. This bank thing is a hassle, but nothing more than that.