Poll: Do You Like Keybord Font.

[hells_dark]

Is it too late to vote for Comic Sans?

Yes please. I use it for my desktop GUI, clear, curvy and readable at small point sizes. Some people don't like comic sans, I can't imagine why.

:blink:

 

[limonaati]

Personally, I would have liked to see the C64 font on the keys:

(This one: http://www.dafont.com/commodore-64-pixele.font )

 

[Olexxy]

what's the Logo key function outside of emulators?
No, that key is special. That's the system menu key.

It's tied directly to a GPIO line (all 3 keys in the middle are) instead of the keypad matrix so that it can be used at any time. It will bring up a system menu with things like a task switching menu, system options and shutdown / suspend commands. The "Pandora" key is off the table for repurposing or remapping.

Oh, is that the case for the ABXY keys as well ? I was thinking of remapping them as Fn keys, would that be a problem when using emulators/games ? And what about the shoulder buttons that are often presented as candidates for ctrl / alt ?

 

[darkblu]

speaking of classy kbd fonts - nothing beats this one:

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sin...ZX_Spectrum.jpg

 

[Caine]

QUOTE
I have respectfully made a fusion of both of their designs (hope you guys don't mind) and this is what I have come up with.

I don't mind at all. This is why I post them. If you want I can upload the svg files as well (you can edit them with e.g. inkscape).
QUOTE
I have come to the conclusion that Compose and AltGr are absolutely vital for the pandora if it plans to be a successful international product

I agree. At least one of AltGr or Compose is a must. Both would be best.
QUOTE
as well as having Ctrl and Alt on the shoulder buttons is the most efficient way to save key space and leave room for the unsatisfied to map extra keys

I believe there was a slight preference within the community to place Ctrl+Alt on the keyboard and not on the shoulder buttons. However, there are some valid reasons to put Ctrl + Alt on the shoulders:

1. When placed on the keyboard combinations are very hard if you don't use sticky keys.
2. The keyboard can only read two (or three?) keys simultaneously. This does not hold for game controls. Since Ctrl and Alt are typically used in key combinations it makes sense to put them on game controls.
3. If Ctrl and Alt are on the keyboard then combining them with mouse operations becomes very tricky to perform.
4. Having them removed from the keyboard creates quite some room for normal punctuation characters.
   The main argument against is that L and R are hard to reach when the pandora is on a table.

As a side thought. Since L+R combine very easily with thumb typing on the keyboard, it might be worth to put Fn and AltGr on the shoulder buttons instead (L: Fn, R: Alt/AltGr, Current Fn key: Ctrl/Compose). This way special characters become accessible much more easily.
QUOTE
I think 'Ins' looks best over the W key

Why? Insert and delete somewhat belong together. They are usually adjacent. In text editing they perform related tasks.
QUOTE
I didn't put Volume +,Volume -, and Mute due to the pandora already having a volume-controlling thingamabob

O yeah, I forgot about that You are right, they can go. I had so much spare space that I just wanted to put some more features on there So, that makes a total of seven free keys for customization.
QUOTE
I didn't add Num Lock, Scroll Lock, and the Fn options to the D-Pad because I feel it would over-complicate the basic controls.

Fair enough. None of the labels on the game controls would be printed on the design anyway. All keys are software controlled, so this doesn't really change my design in any way. You don't use NumLock or ScrollLock a lot.

Some remarks about mouse usage. I would not leave out the Middle Mouse Button key on [Y] (or [X]) since the combination [A]+ is not easy for people with big hands.

I have not yet seen any other solutions to mouse key usage when using the stylus.
In my approach you would hold the pandora in your left hand with your thumb on the dpad. To left click hold dpad left and touch the screen, to right click hold dpad right, etc... (default=left click). This approach can also be seen in ScummVM on the Nintendo DS.
The touchscreen would be more natural and quicker than using the joysticks and this way you can easily enhance the power of the stylus.

I don't see a lot of support for this idea. Is it not a relevant issue, is it too complicated or do you all prefer to use the joystick instead?

 

[MDave]

QUOTE
The main argument against is that L and R are hard to reach when the pandora is on a table.


This is actually a very weak argument. It's not going to be comfortable thumb typing on the keypad while it is on a table anyway. Yeah, you could use your fingers to simulate a real keyboard, but that's not it was designed for because the keys are so small. It is not ergonomically friendly to type in that fashion. Try it with a cell phone or something.

 

[Klaus]

Is it too late to vote for Comic Sans?

Yes please. I use it for my desktop GUI, clear, curvy and readable at small point sizes. Some people don't like comic sans, I can't imagine why.


Sounds like the desktop from hell!

 

[salasq]

what's the Logo key function outside of emulators?
No, that key is special. That's the system menu key.

It's tied directly to a GPIO line (all 3 keys in the middle are) instead of the keypad matrix so that it can be used at any time. It will bring up a system menu with things like a task switching menu, system options and shutdown / suspend commands. The "Pandora" key is off the table for repurposing or remapping.

Ach bugger. :huh:

Select? It's possible to remap it to Control, obviously - and that one goes spare if we have shoulder Control.

What's the status of ABXY re: the table?

 

[Dubya']

speaking of classy kbd fonts - nothing beats this one:

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sin...ZX_Spectrum.jpg
It looks exactly like the font on my Microsoft keyboard. The use of this font in so many different keyboards should be a clue that it should be the one used on Pandora.

 

[nikkopt]

Offtopic: I remember reading somewhere that we can only press two buttons on the keyboard at the same time. Is it still like this?

 

[urjaman]

Offtopic: I remember reading somewhere that we can only press two buttons on the keyboard at the same time. Is it still like this?

See this.
In short: The keyboard matrix can detect max 2 keypresses. The gaming controls aren't affected by this limitation.

 

[gbouilland]

Something new, maybe not for everyone ?

Dedicated TAB key. Ever needed [Alt +] Shift + Tab for example ?

A more conventional one, better compromise...

Finally, assuredly not to everyone's liking

Comments welcomed !

 

[Bronek]

Something new, maybe not for everyone ?

Dedicated TAB key. Ever needed [Alt +] Shift + Tab for example ?

OK, but why put blue Tab symbol over space then? Use this location for something useful, like Compose or AltGr. Also, I see there is some free space left for currency symbols ...

 

[MDave]

F0?

Is it supposed to be F10?

 

[cosurgi]

F0?

Is it supposed to be F10?

yes, of course. In fact EvilDragon used this convention, see the render. I thought that it's neat, so I copied it. It wasn't like this in previous designs.

 

[j.pickens]

F0?

Is it supposed to be F10?

Yes, lots of the keyboard layouts use this to keep it simple.
Personally, I think you could do without the blue F on the number keys, Function key would be assumed.
Perhaps use the space for Compose characters.

 

[gbouilland]

Something new, maybe not for everyone ?

Dedicated TAB key. Ever needed [Alt +] Shift + Tab for example ?

OK, but why put blue Tab symbol over space then? Use this location for something useful, like Compose or AltGr. Also, I see there is some free space left for currency symbols ...


Oups, my mistake, Space should be free of anything else

Regarding Compose or AlterGr, they can be mapped as function shoulder keys like in Kagato's layout.

As for free keys, I still think it's better to let them blank so everybody can map them as they see fit i/o make them useful to only some people and then it's confusing even after remap... this is only my viewpoint though.

F0?

Is it supposed to be F10?

Yes, lots of the keyboard layouts use this to keep it simple.
Personally, I think you could do without the blue F on the number keys, Function key would be assumed.
Perhaps use the space for Compose characters.


Remarks taken into account

 

[RoboShmup]

I took some of the advice and tweaked my format a bit. Here's my new layout.

Now there is less of a chance of uncomfortably placing both of your hands on the right side of the keyboard.

Not quite sure where to put the wifi and brightness buttons, but I'll see what you guys think.

 

[hells_dark]

I think enough layouts have been done..
We just have to wait the final layout to show up.

Could we find another subject than the keyboard layout now ?
I'm sure the team is aware about what the majority want, and will give us a good layout and font.

 

[PandoraSuechtig]

The original use of Serif is to ease reading long texts. They fake a base line (check a page in your newspaper) which makes it easier to follow the text, differ lines and switch to the next line at the end. But for stand alone letters or headings (check again your local newspaper) you don't use serifs (no advantag from a "baseline"), because non-serif fonts in small texts or stand letters alone are much easier to read. That's why practically all keyboards use non-serif fonts.
In modern times some mags use non-serif fonts in texts, but they are more difficult to read.
About the layout: would prefer having all special characters used in the shell on the keyboard, those language specific letters i can without and a dedicated tab would be nice. could some dosbox or linux software suffer from a missing F11 and F11?