PGS Windows 10 gaming handheld - GPD WIN competitor

[directive0]

That moto phone is DOPE!

Off to ebay I go to add to my collection of junk!

 

[jeeks]

omg that phone looks so weird! i want one!

 

[ElPoco]

The Motorola Flip was one of the last time a phone manufacturer tried to do something else than a brick. I kinda wish it had worked better for these different form factors, maybe it could have led to interesting designs instead of bricks, bricks and bigger bricks.

 

[TrashyMG]

I liked the Samsung Alias series honestly, only if it had a good OS and a more powerful SoC.

 

[Klumpen]

huh
[doublepost=1473254508,1473254336][/doublepost]i think the layout on the pgs is worst than my first phone

I actually love this design.

 

[Grench]

The PGS & GPD Win keyboard designs are proof that the keyboard threads (keyboard wars) here were not a waste of time. It is rare to have such overwhelming examples of failure to prove how good another outcome is.

That PGS layout though, wow - I thought I had some wild and crazy layout designs. That one is simply bizzare. It's as if someone wanted to make it as difficult as possible to use. Both the PGS and the GPD keyboards have that bizzare unintegrated approach of trying to completely separate the keyboard and the game controller key functions to the point of redundant capabilities in the foreground (arrow keys and d-pad).

At first I thought that the PGS keyboard had gone all 1930s typewriter and dual tasked O as 0. After all, who would want to do math on the thing? Of course, since their device is in theory also a phone, nobody would ever want to easily put in a 0 as a part of a string of numbers... like dialing a phone... oh, wait... um... wtf were they thinking?

 

[MJPIA]

Just saw a interview with Nadir from a week ago.
http://www.thenerdmachine.com/introducing-the-portable-gaming-system-by-portable-solutions/
Pretty much all fluff and nothing substantial unsurprisingly.
Still claiming March 2017.
I guess PGS has preorders in Japan now.

http://vsmedia.info/2016/09/02/pgs-lite/

株式会社ドゥモアが、同社が運営するキュレーションセールスの「ヴェルテ」にてPGS Lab社製ポータブルPCゲームコンソール「PGS Lite」の取扱を開始すると発表した。

「PGS」は、発表直後から超人気でクラウドファンディングプラットフォーム「Kickstarter」で40万ドルを集めながら、「無茶だ」「困難だ」との指摘のアンチ大合唱に自らキャンセルし、自力で開発に漕ぎ着けた世界で注目されている携帯ゲーム機プロジェクト。Windows 10とAndroid 6.0を搭載しており、ポケットに入る程度のサイズならがハイスペックなPC向けゲームもプレイできる性能を有している。なお、ドゥモアでは既に「PGS Lite」の上位機種「PGS Hardcore」の国内販売も行うことを先月発表している（過去記事はこちら）。「PGS Lite」の商品および販売概要は以下のとおり。

Dumoa Co., Ltd. is the company "Verte" in the curation sales, which operates PGS Lab announced that it will start the handling of manufactured portable PC game console "PGS Lite".

Lite
http://welte.jp/ca3/33/p-r-s/
Hardcore
http://welte.jp/ca3/26/p-r3-s/

Anyone know anything about Welte?

 

[darkmaximus9]

i know i loved that phone it was just 80 euros its in my collection of gadgets
its also very small its called motorola flipout again epic phone from 2012
[doublepost=1473280245,1473279970][/doublepost]omg just saw the alias series they look epic

 

[Exophase]

Except they'd only make a loss by selling GPD Wins for the prices they're trying to sell PGS devices for.

No problem, their investors agreed to cover any and all expenses.

zero is there, it's on Fn1 9.

because it's a great idea to have two function keys...

but "function 19" does sound like the name of a good sci fi thriller.

Yeah I know it's "there", just not as a first class citizen but some lesser function of another key. It is, frankly, humiliating.

 

[vcoleiro1]

To be fair on the GPD WIN, it's negatives are a left aligned KB with keys that are close to each other. As for specifically the layout , that's something entirely different, it's a standard layout, and to be fair, a positive the WIN has above the others. All the keys are there and in the standard positions.
As a side note, all GPD had to do to centre the letter keys, was to switch both columns on the right to the left, and the KB letter keys would have then been perfectly centered. I still don't know why they didn't do that at least, especially considering all the other changes they made. The keys would have been close together still, but the biggest negative IMO would have been corrected.

The Pyra has well spaced keys and centered letter keys. To achieve the spacing, it went with a reduced key KB sacrificing a full key layout, which means a number of punctuation and symbol keys are scattered to the wind. It's the trade off that had to be made to get the key spacing. And to be fair , I think most people would agree that it's the right trade off to make. But still , there was a price for that

As for the PGS, hmmm, as others have said , there is a number of issues. They would have to change it IMO to include domed keys, another coluoum so P isn't where it is and f10 and 0 can be added to the top line and also enter added. I'm sure they will make lots of changes to that though, if it ever comes out.

 

[MechaBouncer]

huh
[doublepost=1473254508,1473254336][/doublepost]i think the layout on the pgs is worst than my first phone
View attachment 29174

The Motorola Flip was one of the last time a phone manufacturer tried to do something else than a brick. I kinda wish it had worked better for these different form factors, maybe it could have led to interesting designs instead of bricks, bricks and bigger bricks.

My first Android was a Motorola Backflip:

It would close up like this with the keyboard on the outside:

Spec-wise, it was in the ballpark of the original G1 Android phone but circa 2010. So it was very low-end, but it was the first that AT&T carried. The thing is, I loved the formfactor even if I hated the performance. The keyboard was a single piece of soft plastic that would flex and the buttons were underneath and had a nice click to them. It was fairly rugged, actually. The camera being on the flip out keyboard could be used forward-facing for video chats. And the keyboard could be used as it's own stand and it could be put into a desk mode of sorts:

I actually had it worked out that I could insert it into the phone cubby in the dashboard of my car with the screen poking out and run Google Maps on it. It was super handy.

To be honest, I always wished that someone would take this kind of approach, but with an integrated gamepad instead of the keyboard. Even a cell phone case would have been nice, even if it blocked the camera. I remember that the iControlPad2 reminded me a lot of this design.

 

[Grench]

The Pyra has well spaced keys and centered letter keys. To achieve the spacing, it went with a reduced key KB sacrificing a full key layout, which means a number of punctuation and symbol keys are scattered to the wind. It's the trade off that had to be made to get the key spacing. And to be fair , I think most people would agree that it's the right trade off to make. But still , there was a price for that

Scattered to the wind? Then you clearly haven't looked closely enough. Yes, a lot of the punctuation symbols had to move to the Fn layer. However, sets of punctuation keys were maintained and symbol pairs that normally existed on one key were retained over/under their respective pair within the Fn layer. There was nothing random about the symbol placement on the Pyra layout. Placement rules and ease of use were given a -lot- of thought.

 

[vcoleiro1]

@Grench

Lets see

1) the fullstop normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard.

2) the comma normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

3) the "<" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

4) the ">" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

5) the "/" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

6) the ";" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

7) "=" and "-" where on the top row of keys on the right side next to "0", now they are on the bottom row on the left side oin the Z and X keys.

8) "?" is on the A key rather than on the right side of the keyboard rather than next to shift on the right side, It's also on a different row than normal

9) the ' and " keys, again on the opposite side of the keyboard to where they are meant to be

10) the + key normally on the top row , on the far right. Is now on the left side on the S key.

etc etc

And so on and so forth. Sure, if there are pairs they are generally together but they are nowhere near their proper placement. The placement of the punctuation and symbol keys are all in non standard and often completely opposite positions - the exception being the symbols etc on the number keys. If you use a standard keyboard and then use the Pyra KB, then a large number of the symbol and punctuation keys are not anywhere near where they are meant to be. Which is the issue I'm referring to. As I said, I understand why that is and except the trade off for why it was done. But it is still a negative.

 

[TrashyMG]

But it is still a negative.

Compared to the Pandora, the Pyra's keys look at least somewhat organized. And in the end the Pandora wasn't at all too difficult to get used to after a bit of use.

It entertains me greatly how much these keyboard discussions end up. Someone complains about the location, they say the keys would be better elsewhere, but they have to shift a ton of other keys to get it to where it is, then some other person comes in and complains why some other keys are the way they are and it's one endless argument...

 

[Yoyobuae]

I question the value of the "normal positioning" on a keyboard too small to be used as a normal keyboard. Are people really that accustomed to "normal positioning" in thumb typing keyboards?

Besides, the "normal positioning" is partially wrong layout for me (I'm used to spanish keyboard layout). Probably the same for people in countries speaking other languages.

And finally, there's nothing wrong with adjusting to the new layout. Not everything needs to be exactly like every user is accustomed to. That's impossible to achieve anyway, unless everyone has the exact preferences for keyboard layout, language, OS, etc.

 

[levi]

I like how my ISO UK keyboards are also not using 'normal positioning'

 

[Nilsnsn]

I use this layout at home: http://neo-layout.org/ (for german), took some time to adjust but feels very comfy now. BUT every other keyboard i have to use became weird

 

[rygD]

@vcoleiro1, you do understand that the Pyra keyboard, while based on the US keyboard, is also made to allow German to be typed somewhat easily, and we also attempted to accomodate other languages and uses as much as possible with what we were given to work with, right?

 

[FlapJack]

I'm good with the Pyra keyboard layout. Just as I have been fine with the Pandora keyboard for years. I get used to using a certain device. It becomes an extension of me over a short period of time IF I like functioning with said device. The keyboard wars are over. The Pyra/Pandora Team did it BETTER than anyone else. I can attest to that. I've tried hundreds of mobile devices. I look forward to the GPD Win, but I know what I'll get now, in that cramped keyboard. Good luck, you typists.

 

[Grench]

@Grench

Lets see

1) the fullstop normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard.

2) the comma normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

3) the "<" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

4) the ">" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

5) the "/" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

6) the ";" normally on the right of the M key on the right side. Is now on the left of the Z key on the other side of the keyboard

7) "=" and "-" where on the top row of keys on the right side next to "0", now they are on the bottom row on the left side oin the Z and X keys.

8) "?" is on the A key rather than on the right side of the keyboard rather than next to shift on the right side, It's also on a different row than normal

9) the ' and " keys, again on the opposite side of the keyboard to where they are meant to be

10) the + key normally on the top row , on the far right. Is now on the left side on the S key.

etc etc

And so on and so forth. Sure, if there are pairs they are generally together but they are nowhere near their proper placement. The placement of the punctuation and symbol keys are all in non standard and often completely opposite positions - the exception being the symbols etc on the number keys. If you use a standard keyboard and then use the Pyra KB, then a large number of the symbol and punctuation keys are not anywhere near where they are meant to be. Which is the issue I'm referring to. As I said, I understand why that is and except the trade off for why it was done. But it is still a negative.

Yes. There were fewer keys available left to right than on a 'normal' keyboard. Many keys could not be 'on top' and had to move to the Fn layer of the keyboard. The physical key count, placement and the double-wide space placement was already set in stone.

The dangling key to the right of the space could only be Fn. This meant that any common characters that needed ease of use on the Fn layer needed to be on the left side of the keyboard to make that two-thumb combination easier.

Many of the common English punctuation marks, normally on the right side of the keyboard, then needed to move to the left side to avoid thumb stretch. English was given priority, so the German symbols got the less favorable placement on the right side of the Fn layer.

It was decided that Fn+shift+key should be avoided. Although it is a logical extension within the Fn layer, the decision was made. This meant breaking key pairs. [ and { would no longer be able to share the same key on the Fn layer as people found the markings to be too busy and potentially confusing. However, someone (_wb_?) came up with an idea of maintaining the key pairs over/under within the Fn layer.

The blocks of keys were maintained wherever possible. This meant that the keys associatedd in sets:
`~
-_ +=
[{ ]} \|
;: '"
,< .> /?
would be maintained and kept with their associated set as well as possible with the base symbol for each key on one row and it's shifted character one row above it within the Fn layer.

EVERY symbol placement on the Pyra's keyboard was vetted for logic AND usability. There was no 'scattering to the wind'. What you're describing as a negative above is actually a very positive outcome. Yes, there was compromise to fit within the constraints of the platform and augmentations to enhance usability. It is also likely the best pocketable device English thumb keyboard layout ever brought into production.