Pandora OS Vs Android

[notaz]

Well, as if I posted anything that is not true.


Actually, I kind of agree what Dunny posted one page back. This place is becoming fanboy hut, and is getting more and more like the PSP community. No wonder Prometheus left, no wonder more sane people are going to leave.

 

[Exophase]

Foxgod, I don't really care what you think. As far as I'm concerned your posts are below useless. Your knowledge and comprehension skills are zero and all you do is inject misunderstanding after misunderstanding after misinformed and misplaced intentions where they don't belong, all with some completely incomprehensible sense of entitlement.


So whatever. Maybe in your head everything is great if no one questions what Craig says or does and we all pretend everything is great and positive. In the real world us grown ups understand that sometimes the situation calls for a little "negativity."

 

[Foxgod]

Well, as if I posted anything that is not true.


Actually, I kind of agree what Dunny posted one page back. This place is becoming fanboy hut, and is getting more and more like the PSP community. No wonder Prometheus left, no wonder more sane people are going to leave.

But what good comes from constant flaming?


People want to see this thing to keep going.


If everybody attacks each other it will be over in no time...

 

[T.T.]

true, an eye for an eye make the whole world blind

 

[Foxgod]

Foxgod, I don't really care what you think. As far as I'm concerned your posts are below useless. Your knowledge and comprehension skills are zero and all you do is inject misunderstanding after misunderstanding after misinformed and misplaced intentions where they don't belong.


So whatever. Maybe in your head everything is great if no one questions what Craig says or does and we all pretend everything is great and positive. In the real world us grown ups understand that sometimes the situation calls for a little "negativity."

What you fail to understand is the importance to keep something going, instead of working it to the ground with useless ranting and throwing crap.


Its not like the OP team got any space currently to improve things easily, onl;y way to keep going is by cutting them some slack, and hopeing for better times.

 

[Christoph.Krn]

By sending out dozens of free Pandora consoles

If you are talking about boards, while they are expensive, they have no practical use except developing software for them (i.e. working for you). This was not enough to motivate people. If you sent full pandoras, it would be really interesting to hear who got them besides me. Yes I got one, but the cost of doing all the work that was needed by some company or consultants would far outweight the price of all that stuff you and MWeston sent here. That pandora's CNC case is now falling apart anyway, it has a low-grade LCD.

making donations to them

Again, would be interesting to know who, I've got nothing from you.

getting drivers, information and databooks from TI,

Can't recall any here, unless you mean NDA stuff for MWeston so he could do board design.

setting up a team which created an open source mini computer

Would love to hear more about that.

Does this mean you're doing the work for fun (i.e., there's no 'commercial' agreement/contract, with a compensation that would be called appropriate were this a different, but comparable, setting)?


Please clarify!

Hey guys, this is the


Prometheus: WTF ?!??!


thread...

It is. It makes a lot of sense though to discuss related issues -- that's what determines the future. It probably makes a lot more sense than just to discuss what has been, and then wondering one day why everything just got worse.


I guess Prometheus would appreciate all the comments regarding her departure, but they're not going to change anything for the better, which is the most important thing. I don't want to speak for Prometheus, so I just ask you to think for yourself what thing you believe that she would prefer people to do.

 

[ekianjo]

What you fail to understand is the importance to keep something going, instead of working it to the ground with useless ranting and throwing crap.


Its not like the OP team got any space currently to improve things easily, onl;y way to keep going is by cutting them some slack, and hopeing for better times.

There's a reason for "throwing crap". You have people working hard to develop the OS for the current and future Pandora while at the same time, there seems to be so much push for "Android" (look at the Pandora 1Ghz page from Craig) - which makes one wonder if Android is really that much of a deal-breaker if it is included or not. It seems to me that most of the costumer base was OK with not having Android to begin with, so why is this becoming so much of a "feat" ?


And "negative crap" is feedback. When it comes from the most active members of this community (in terms of development), I'd be very concerned if the OP Team ignored it. If you don't listen to your customers, in real life, you don't have a business. It's as simple as that.

 

[Foxgod]

What you fail to understand is the importance to keep something going, instead of working it to the ground with useless ranting and throwing crap.


Its not like the OP team got any space currently to improve things easily, onl;y way to keep going is by cutting them some slack, and hopeing for better times.

There's a reason for "throwing crap". You have people working hard to develop the OS for the current and future Pandora while at the same time, there seems to be so much push for "Android" (look at the Pandora 1Ghz page from Craig) - which makes one wonder if Android is really that much of a deal-breaker if it is included or not. It seems to me that most of the costumer base was OK with not having Android to begin with, so why is this becoming so much of a "feat" ?


And "negative crap" is feedback. When it comes from the most active members of this community (in terms of development), I'd be very concerned if the OP Team ignored it. If you don't listen to your customers, in real life, you don't have a business. It's as simple as that.

Ofcourse i agree with all that, but i just dont think the OP team got much space currently.


They are kind of with their backs against the wall, putting more pressure will do more harm then good.

 

[notaz]

Does this mean you're doing the work for fun (i.e., there's no 'commercial' agreement/contract, with a compensation that would be called appropriate were this a different, but comparable, setting)?

No agreements, no compensation, like everyone else who did firmware work, for the idea. AFAIK this is also true for the core team (Craig/ED/MWeston/Fatih).

 

[Scntrblob]

Craig, if you really believe that notaz is trolling you, then there would be something seriously wrong with you.


Seriously, you're on the best way to lose your main developer. It HAS to be obvious, even to you, that without notaz, there is no pandora 2.


If I could give you any advise, not that you would even consider it, then take a step back, work on the website, handle your costumers and let the pandora 2 be a community handheld again, not something based on your personal, misleaded views, that have proven to be not what the people here, maybe except some fanboys popping up recently, want.

 

[ekianjo]

Ofcourse i agree with all that, but i just dont think the OP team got much space currently.

When you don't have much space, the best thing to do is to listen to your core customers, not the hypothetical ones based on a fictional system.


There's so much crap going on about "the P2 having true HD screen", the "P2 going to be the best handheld device out there in terms of specs", "Android right from the start", it's just like building a Homer Simpsons Car all over again. (if you havent seen that episode, go and watch it... an excellent metaphor for poor designers out there).


Designing a system is not about having "Everything".


It's about making choices. Decide what is necessary, what is mandatory and what is not. How do you make these decisions ? You do your homework. You look after your customers of potential customers and you check your ideas with them. Not piece by piece, but as a WHOLE. If you ask piece by piece "do you want a HD screen", "do you want 10 USB ports? ", "Do you want Android ?", etc... you will get nowhere. When the system will be out, people will not have that choice, they will be faced with a single system and no open questions. So, when someone from the OP team talks about P2, I expect them to bring a number of full-fledged scenarios regarding what the actual specs of each scenario would be. Not piece by piece of each part/component.


There's a severe lack of product development experience, from what I can tell.


Now instead of taking the feedback in a negative way, the ones responsible for the design decisions should understand :


- where the feedback is coming from (it's not because the feedback is negative that it has no ground)


- they have to start addressing the issues raised and take this opportunity to improve


Or else, stop communicating altogether about "potential specs" until they decide something,


The fact is, you have thousands of Pandoras in the wild, you probably have a reasonable amount of the existing costumers who are willing to get a Pandora 2 when it comes out, and you know what, you can REACH these potential customers easily.


Now, up to the OP team to listen to their existing customers or not.


I think it's a mistake not to, but in the end it's up to them.

 

[sswam]

I would volunteer to be a mod. Care to try a different style of moderation?


I would be more of a BOFH than the average mod.


2/3 of the posts in this thread would be deleted or moved.


If you want to fight, can do it in a PM or fight-club thread,


not in a thread that's should be a tribute to a great moderator.


The topic here would get edited too.


Try to google "wizardstan" "horse penis".


Is this really appropriate?


Does it reflect well on our community, that one of the more prolific posters has this as his sig?


Would it encourage your sister or mom to join the conversation and to buy a Pandora?


Sure, I think it's a funny sig, but it should not be repeated several thousand times all over the forum.


That person would lose signature privileges under my proposed "reign of terror".

 

[DaMummy]

:{


to be fair, who googles "horse penis" and expects anything better than the sig?

 

[Wrath Of Khan]

Hopefully 1ghz sales when production is ramped up will make some profit then notaz and op can get their grubby mitts on some money. As regards to talk of the p2 It's still an entirely unknown quantity.We don't really know what the specs are or anything yet.Craigs dropped snippets but it's a long ways off for now.the fact that people get so worked up about every detail about the p2 shows just how much they are looking forward to it.Im simply eagerly waiting for it but am going to wait and see what it will be in the end.

 

[McLovin]

So whatever. Maybe in your head everything is great if no one questions what Craig says or does and we all pretend everything is great and positive. In the real world us grown ups understand that sometimes the situation calls for a little "negativity."

Well, true. But only if you can think of a positive outcome of your "negativity". At the moment, your arguments are pretty much destructive and I'd call that childish.


So, be constructive. How can things change for the better?


In the end, if this community really wants a p2, we better start collecting money to pay notaz for the os work, But, from what I read all over the board, I'd not be surprised if that wouldn't improve notaz's motivation a single bit. I'm not even sure the majority of this community wants a p2.

 

[pmprog]

2/3 of the posts in this thread would be deleted or moved.

Have you been reading any of these threads? There's already enough concern over "censorship" of the boards. Would you take Notaz's comments as "trolling Craig"? Would they get deleted?


Forcing people to battle over PM means you could end up with several common concerns being talked independantly, consuming far more time for people like Craig, where all the questions generally are pointing.


IMHO I think you'd be the wrong type of moderator for the Pandora boards at this point in time.

 

[b_o_b]

People come and people go. Especially people who are really dedicated can be disappointed about anything really. You see that on all kind of forums. I am not too worried if someone leaves the board even if she is an appreciated mod.


Notaz is another story, he is the most important developer for the Pandora. Without him the Pandora would be a lot less useful.


Guys with his talent can usually earn quite a bit so I don't think money is the main motivator for him. I did donate a couple of times, but that is just a small token of my appreciation. Like buying a guy a beer because he helped you out.


I think the main problem is that Notaz (but correct me if I am wrong) feels Craig is benefiting from his hard work but he doesn't give him the appreciation he deserves.


TBH I don't see Craig as the main Pandora guy anymore, that is ED and it looks like he is doing his best to keep the community and the main devs happy.

 

[sswam]

Have you been reading any of these threads? There's already enough concern over "censorship" of the boards. Would you take Notaz's comments as "trolling Craig"? Would they get deleted?

I didn't find Notaz's posts or Craigs posts offensive.


The right to free speech in public stops when you are disturbing the peace or defaming someone.


I would not delete posts without warning. I would move overly aggressive posts to a 'fight club' board or thread, and link them from the original thread. Obscene posts can get deleted or moved to an 'offensive' board or thread. Off-topic posts can get moved. Simple complaints and dissent can stay, if it's reasonably polite and on-topic. I have toolz skillz.


People who want to read the normal boards without wading through crap could do so.


I want nice people to feel welcome and safe here.


Terms of use seem to have been neglected. I'd like to enforce them more or less, allowing for humour of course.

You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this bulletin board to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law."

It would be better for angry people to use PM, rather than disgracing themselves in public.

IMHO I think you'd be the wrong type of moderator for the Pandora boards at this point in time.

The other mods could fire me if I screw up too badly.

to be fair, who googles "horse penis" and expects anything better than the sig?

The point of googling it was to count how many times this sig appears. It said 1750.


I see your sig in almost every thread. I admit, it's funny. I would like to see the original context.


Post it somewhere then get rid of it. We don't need this in every damn thread.

 

[_wb_]

to be fair, who googles "horse penis" and expects anything better than the sig?

That is not the problem. The problem is people googling "OpenPandora" and getting horse penises.


In general, this forum generates quite a lot of bad PR for the Pandora project, mostly of course because of all those people that are complaining about having to wait (understandably), but once they get their Pandora they're too busy having fun with it to come back to the forum to post positive stuff. You typically only hear back from them when they have some problem. To be honest, when I ordered my Pandora some months ago, I expected to have to wait several years and then get something with a broken display and case cracks and broken wifi and nubs etc etc, based on what I read on this forum. For the record, I got my Pandora after one month and it has no hardware problem whatsoever.


Much of this could be avoided if the main website would be (even) more open about the progress than it is now. A production update once every 2 months is not enough. Initial problems like PTOD and broken wifi should be mentioned clearly, and more importantly, it should be mentioned that they are fixed now.


The secrecy around the Pandora 2 is understandable for many reasons, but it makes it less of a community project since it is absolutely unclear to what extent community suggestions are taken into account. I think respected contributors like notaz should at least get more information and preferably have a large impact on the design of the P2.

 

[ZXDunny]

[snipped over-aggressive megalomania]

Assuming that there is a "governing body" who reviews and appoints moderators, I would like to make one thing perfectly clear -


"The people who should not be in power are those that seek it"


Beware, folks. You've all seen what happens to people who try to gain power or put themselves forward for a position of authority - they're called Politicians, and it is precisely because they seek power that we should avoid appointing them.


D.