davidgro
Member
Craig, thank you very much for clearing that up. I will remain patient and hope that my refund is eventually available.
Has *anybody* received a refund from OpenPandora Ltd (Craig's) in 2013?
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ShleeDragon
Pro-Catflip
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Hey Craig, Welcome back.... good to hear from you
This is a little strange (but totally understandable) that you're quitting now - considering you've finally got a respectable company to produce the product and kickstarter was such a positive journey (I'm looking forward to the iCP2).
ED can start a kickstarter for the Pandora 2 if he wants..... if it's over.. it's over.
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kuru
Who the heck is Stephan Kramer?
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MrBazil2k
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Count me in for that as well pls ^^
+2
I wonder what that team is. You told me that a few times, that I won't take any of your advice, but exactly the opposite is the case.
You wanted a produce the 1GHz units earlier and sell them as preorder for a higher price -> I did that (even though some mentioned it might kill all current sales, which it did).
You wanted to create a new website and heavily worked to promote Pandoras to increase sales -> as soon as the website was legally okay, it was brought online. I'm still waiting for that massive promotion...
You thought about new prices and packages for the Pandora -> I followed that advice as well.
So what advice didn't I follow? I can't really remember a lot other advices from you.
Well, yes and no. Based on the number you gave me when I developed that business plan, you should have about 150 preorders left now, which would be according to plan.
I can't really do much if suddenly it turns out you need a few hundred units more, can I?
Yep, based on sales, which you wanted to massively increase with promotion... which hasn't yet happened - or at least I haven't seen where.
Hmm... not really. I (and even some mods) tried to explain to you WHY your posts often lead to flame wars. No one told you to reduce your forum presence or leave completely for weeks,
What people were missing were honest answers to their questions, updates (also to the iControlPad2 stuff), etc.
Tell everyone honestly what's going on and people will react according to that.
Always behaving like you're hiding something or making promises you can't keep again and again makes them dislike you.
Be open, honest, let them know how they can help you, and they will help.
Me and the community are not your enemies. Most are here to help. But you have to be honest with them to receive the help you seek.
Well, the basic business plan was even posted to the public, and you could've always gotten a detailed copy if you ever asked me.
The basic plan (back to August 2011)
About 1300 preorders left (from both of us, about 800 of those were yours). You had parts left we could use for the production, and if you had too many refunds, I would buy these parts off you and accordingly reduce the amounts of Pandoras you get.
So basically, I grabbed enough investments and calculated the new Pandora price to...
1. Start production in Germany
2. Fulfill 1300 preorders and get the full money of the investors back with 2500 sold Pandoras (so with 4000 produced Pandoras, all preorders would've been fulfilled and the full invested money would be back).
This was planned in batches of 1000, meaning:
The first batch of 1000 Pandoras fulfilled xxx preorders for you and xxx preorders for me, the rest had to be sold.
And so on.
The plan was laid out very tight (it wasn't possible otherwise, sadly), so any additional Pandora preorders you suddenly have would lead to problems.
That's why the number you gave me back then (those 800) was very important.
ZXDunny
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Before anyone gets upset at the prospect of "No Pandora 2", please everyone bear in mind that Craig said that. He's not the most reliable chap, his communication skills and his inclination to communicate both appear to be very low indeed, and he's not a chap you can trust based on past performance.
With that in mind, can we get an answer from ED regarding plans for a P2?
D.
With that in mind, can we get an answer from ED regarding plans for a P2?
D.
Yes, as it was too much of a rollercoaster ride and Craigs and my approaches to handle a business are totally different
Well, that was the plan back then... so no need to blame him for that.
Yes, it is an awesome device and Craig was the one who created it.
I really hope as well this will have a semi-happy ending (with no one seriously hurt), I also appreciate the post here from Craig.
I really hope he understands that no one here is his enemy, but trying to help out... which will only work if he is open and honest about the situation.
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As mentioned, it all depends on how the Pandora works out now.
Right now, it's looking good, so much good software has been released, but more promotion has to happen (I'm currently working on that).
Askarus is currently helping out every day in my shop for a while, doing upgrades and repairs, so I have a bit more time to do that.
I still want to make a complete "What's the Pandora?"-Video, setup an affiliate system for my shop (promote the Pandora and get 10 EUR for each sale made through your banner, or something like that), and about 10 units are currently in the hands of bloggers and press reviewers... and this time I made sure they really know it's not a 08/15 system which they can test in a few hours. They should keep it for weeks and play whenever they like to.
MrBazil2k
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Hey I just found the right video for this situation =D
German Version :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hC-oDguGjHY#t=2m49s
(Hopefully it starts at the desired time 2:49)
English Version :
https://www.youtube.com/embed/_2vGYLC87gU?start=57&feature=oembed
(Hopefully it starts at the desired time 0:58)
No offence with these videos btw =D
German Version :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hC-oDguGjHY#t=2m49s
(Hopefully it starts at the desired time 2:49)
English Version :
https://www.youtube.com/embed/_2vGYLC87gU?start=57&feature=oembed
(Hopefully it starts at the desired time 0:58)
No offence with these videos btw =D
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Sorry to hear that you have given up on the Pandora project, Craig, but I understand (from a business perspective) that you don't want to spend any more time on this, because obviously, this is not an effective way to make a living.
In my opinion, it would be best now to give your remaining pre-order list to ED so he can directly get the units to those people and provide them with ETA's etc. I think that would help a lot to avoid a "bank rush" situation in which most of your remaining pre-orderers simultaneously ask for a refund, hoping to get it before OP Ltd. is dead, forcing OP Ltd. into liquidation.
In my opinion, it would be best now to give your remaining pre-order list to ED so he can directly get the units to those people and provide them with ETA's etc. I think that would help a lot to avoid a "bank rush" situation in which most of your remaining pre-orderers simultaneously ask for a refund, hoping to get it before OP Ltd. is dead, forcing OP Ltd. into liquidation.
craigix
Mega GP Mania
I don't think anyone is my enemy Ed, I've got better things to do.
You do however seem to enjoy posting inaccurate arguments like that ^ over and over again, yes you did some things we suggested, but all far too late. Christmas was the last real chance to promote the Pandora and you just did nothing. Even though at one point I was trying for days on end to speak to you (with no answer).
That new website was ready a year or so ago. There have also been numerous amounts of advice you didn't take and the website is still not complete, I could list so many things I've suggested to you but you don't ever make any attempt to speak to me. When did you last strike up a conversation with me? Or Michael, or Dave?
But as soon as I post something here, suddenly you're online... suddenly I get a reply.
Oh and I don't communicate enough? It's rather hard to do that when you don't answer my emails, or PMs, or commit to anything being a fact.
Go ahead, blame me for whatever you like, but the fact is you have been in charge for a VERY long time now and you can't keep blaming me forever.
That you have a Pandora to sell is because I paid for the development of it all, and Michael Weston designed it and DaveC made the case.
Shame you never speak to any of us anymore, blame me for whatever is going wrong, act as if we're a bit of an awkward part of history... and then you wonder why we're not really interested in promoting it?
And I told you over and over again when you were taking this over that the returns were coming in at an alarming rate, and yet here you posting that somehow that took you by surprise and now there are many more units to replace, suggesting I somehow lied. You have known about the rate of case, LCD and PCB failure for as long as you have been in charge with constant emails and reminders from me about just how bad the situation is/was.
It's time for you to stop with with 'saviour of the community' thing and actually start taking your own advice and be honest about things.
You do however seem to enjoy posting inaccurate arguments like that ^ over and over again, yes you did some things we suggested, but all far too late. Christmas was the last real chance to promote the Pandora and you just did nothing. Even though at one point I was trying for days on end to speak to you (with no answer).
That new website was ready a year or so ago. There have also been numerous amounts of advice you didn't take and the website is still not complete, I could list so many things I've suggested to you but you don't ever make any attempt to speak to me. When did you last strike up a conversation with me? Or Michael, or Dave?
But as soon as I post something here, suddenly you're online... suddenly I get a reply.
Oh and I don't communicate enough? It's rather hard to do that when you don't answer my emails, or PMs, or commit to anything being a fact.
Go ahead, blame me for whatever you like, but the fact is you have been in charge for a VERY long time now and you can't keep blaming me forever.
That you have a Pandora to sell is because I paid for the development of it all, and Michael Weston designed it and DaveC made the case.
Shame you never speak to any of us anymore, blame me for whatever is going wrong, act as if we're a bit of an awkward part of history... and then you wonder why we're not really interested in promoting it?
And I told you over and over again when you were taking this over that the returns were coming in at an alarming rate, and yet here you posting that somehow that took you by surprise and now there are many more units to replace, suggesting I somehow lied. You have known about the rate of case, LCD and PCB failure for as long as you have been in charge with constant emails and reminders from me about just how bad the situation is/was.
It's time for you to stop with with 'saviour of the community' thing and actually start taking your own advice and be honest about things.
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craigix
Mega GP Mania
I would do that but Ed has never given me a solid answer on what woud happen in the situation of OP Ltd going in to liquidation. That's the main reason I'm still running it. I won't let it go if it means people will just be left abandoned with no Pandora.
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Never eat yellow snow!Okay guys ... I am heading off to the courtyard making some more snow-cones ...
citrus or strawberry anyone ?
*refering to my last post above*
Well I don't think OP Ltd needs to go in liquidation before you can give that list to ED. OP Ltd would still be the company that has to pay back refunds and provide repairs under warranty; it makes sense to try to keep it alive at least until the warranty of most of its customers expires. But at least giving your queue details to ED would give you one less thing to worry about and would make it easier for ED to get those units shipped as soon as he can.
craigix
Mega GP Mania
Unfortunately this is the only place I get a timely answer from Ed.
I don't like doing this but people ask me why I don't defend myself on the forums, so sometimes I have to say something or everything not defended becomes fact.
I don't like doing this but people ask me why I don't defend myself on the forums, so sometimes I have to say something or everything not defended becomes fact.
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