World News Thread (Politics,whatever)

Mese96

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BTW: Did anything change for the ever rising German debts thanks to compound interest since the war?
https://www.thelocal.de/20180105/debt-clock-in-berlin-runs-backwards-for-first-time-in-22-years
Must have been directly after they sold lots of state owned property to private investors again, because
https://commodity.com/debt-clock/germany/
If you look at the "Schuldenuhr" of the Bund der Steuerzahler directly, it is still running backwards.
https://www.steuerzahler.de/
 

Bosbeetle

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Apparantly the dutch farmers strike was also reported on the bbc,


it keeps parsing the bbc link into a movie but the story attached to it is the thing I wanted to share www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-49891449

I especcially like the kids from close to my hometown who went to school on their toy tracktors. (also like the way the bbc reported it "christian school" which are almost all schools in the netherlands so we wouldnt ephesise this, and farmers town Ommen which is untrue but the specific school is one in a farmers community that is a "neighbourhood" of Ommen)
 

Klumpen

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Let me get this straight: They protest against being blamed for CO² emissions...
by driving their monster vehicles for hundreds of km to some capitol for no agricultural reason?
 

levi

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Not CO^2 but NOX (a combination of nitrogen oxide and dioxide I recall), which the kind of diesel engines in tractors famously produce lots of. But at least they were slowing down the other traffic, which might have some effect I'm not quite sure.

Seems the BBC are even more confused and start referring to nitrous oxide, which I think is laughing gas and nothing to do with NOX.

But they weren't saying they want to produce less NOX, they were saying don't blame us if you want to drink milk and eat meat.
 

FBnil

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Let me get this straight: They protest against being blamed for CO² emissions...
by driving their monster vehicles for hundreds of km to some capitol for no agricultural reason?
Almost but no. Our government said they want to half the farming in the Netherlands. The farmers, in order to survive the low prices for their produce, already had to re-invent themselves by either going industrial-size or by going bio. Many already keeled over. (gone are the yesteryears of overproduction where the farmers threw away the milk on their field because it was cheaper than selling it; we still have overproduction though, and that makes for cheap food for the poor)
However, if you half the farmers (and keep the output the same) then there would be a hungry population. The solution? Truck drive all the food from other countries like Spain. Now imagine a war where the roads are destroyed and supply stops...
They take away our russian gas, our trees, then our food, lower the quality of schooling.... it's not the way it should go.

Edit: and farmers are honest. No cartels for milk, for example. So cheap milk.
 

WizardStan

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Truck drive all the food from other countries like Spain
But that makes things worse. The farms still exist, just because it's in another country doesn't make it less polluting.
If there's a surplus, the smart thing to do is to dial back production until it meets demand so there's no waste. Smarter, I should say, at least than arbitrarily cutting local supply in half and then importing because now you're running a food shortage. I'm certain there are smarter things than that to be done, but I'm not privy to figuring out what they are.
I'm hoping I don't have the full story here and it's not that clear-cut.
 

Bosbeetle

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Let me get this straight: They protest against being blamed for CO² emissions...
by driving their monster vehicles for hundreds of km to some capitol for no agricultural reason?
No not really they were mad about being blamed about NH[sub]3[/sub] (btw the 2 of CO 2 should be subscript) emmissions and depositions that is now blocking a lot of building projects. Some goverment officials said they should halve their livestock. And they are kind of fed up with being pointed at for being the "baddies" while we do keep expanding our airport and flights. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle... The NH[sub]3[/sub] limits in the netherlands are extremely low and the NH[sub]3[/sub] measurements are kind of dodgy/unclear. The farmers actually got a lot of support from the public. Arguabaly not always for the right reasons.. (there are some douchebags that brought a confederate flag.. to a rally in the netherlands :'( )
[doublepost=1570088807,1570088393][/doublepost]
Almost but no. Our government said they want to half the farming in the Netherlands. The farmers, in order to survive the low prices for their produce, already had to re-invent themselves by either going industrial-size or by going bio. Many already keeled over. (gone are the yesteryears of overproduction where the farmers threw away the milk on their field because it was cheaper than selling it; we still have overproduction though, and that makes for cheap food for the poor)
However, if you half the farmers (and keep the output the same) then there would be a hungry population. The solution? Truck drive all the food from other countries like Spain. Now imagine a war where the roads are destroyed and supply stops...
They take away our russian gas, our trees, then our food, lower the quality of schooling.... it's not the way it should go.

Edit: and farmers are honest. No cartels for milk, for example. So cheap milk.

To nuance this most of our products are for export so we grow more than we eat.
 

levi

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No not really they were mad about being blamed about NH[sub]3[/sub] (btw the 2 of CO 2 should be subscript) emmissions and depositions that is now blocking a lot of building projects. Some goverment officials said they should halve their livestock. And they are kind of fed up with being pointed at for being the "baddies" while we do keep expanding our airport and flights. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle... The NH[sub]3[/sub] limits in the netherlands are extremely low and the NH[sub]3[/sub] measurements are kind of dodgy/unclear.
NH₃ is more commonly known as ammonia. That's toxic in high concentrations, but has very little to do with climate change as far as I can see (wikipedia doesn't mention in). I wonder what their reasoning is for such low limits?
 

Bosbeetle

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is more commonly known as ammonia. That's toxic in high concentrations, but has very little to do with climate change as far as I can see (wikipedia doesn't mention in). I wonder what their reasoning is for such low limits?
No Idea about the low limits but the depositing of NH₃ and other nitrous compounds acidifies the soil in natura2000 area's making those areas more fertile so that grasses and stuff grow but outgrow other plants. Basically the farmers are being punished for making natrue area's too fertile and acidic.
 

FBnil

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@Klumpen Excellent report (sprinkled with humor). They did not eschew the controversial topics. +1 like.
Did not know about the 2child policy. So I guess they did not.
 
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