We need more drama. So here's another video.

Grench

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@EvilDragon

I do not do any business with waterjet companies, but this site has an awesome video on their front page showing a waterjet slicing through ~1cm aluminum (or some other metal) plate.
https://copeland-gibson.com/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIx7rdqcCD5QIVgZOzCh252Az6EAAYAiAAEgJeuPD_BwE
A great description of what waterjet cutting is:
https://www.fedtech.com/waterjet-vs-laser-cutting.html

Pro-hobby level machine that should be able to crank them out in a home workshop:
https://www.wazer.com/

My theory in suggesting waterjet is to have them cut the parts from sheet aluminum with the adhesive and release-paper already applied. Cutting through with the release paper side up should allow the release paper to protect the adhesive layer. I have not done this, it is only an idea/theory. A waterjet company would be able to tell you whether or not it could work.

The type of feedstock I envision:
https://www.mcmaster.com/8941k28

Though that stuff is thin enough and flexible enough that it should be simple to die cut - and flexible enough for any beveling around the edges to flatten back out during application. 0.01 cm thickness - which doesn't sound like much until you consider that household heavy duty aluminum foil is 0.0024 cm thickness. So, this adhesive backed aluminum foil roll stock is four to five times thicker than any household 'foil' you are likely to be familiar with.

Supplying options/ideas only.
 

Swordfish II

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I sent requests to about 15 companies in germany that offer various metal cutting / production possibilities. Not a single one offered that.
Do you have a company at hand that can do that?
That's what i mean. You looked into it.
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@EvilDragon

I do not do any business with waterjet companies, but this site has an awesome video on their front page showing a waterjet slicing through ~1cm aluminum (or some other metal) plate.
https://copeland-gibson.com/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIx7rdqcCD5QIVgZOzCh252Az6EAAYAiAAEgJeuPD_BwE
A great description of what waterjet cutting is:
https://www.fedtech.com/waterjet-vs-laser-cutting.html

My theory...I have not done this, it is only an idea/theory. A waterjet company would be able to tell you whether or not it could work.

Supplying options/ideas only.
So

1. You don't know anything about it
2. You don't know companies
3. You don't work with companies
4. You don't even know if it will work
5. You don't know if the adhesive will get messed up

But you decided to be the "good idea fairy" and create work when ED already had a plan in place.
 
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directive0

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So you would not mind receiving your Pyra in a box of toxic waste as long as the Pyra still works because you are not here for toxic waste exposure prevention.

We're all here for the functionality, but that does not mean that nothing else matters to any of us.
Buddy Id crawl through broken glass to get my hot little hands on a Pyra. Some plastic defects or a paint scratch is pretty low on my list of concerns. I realize thats just my opinion and nobody solicited it, but there it is.
 

Hồng Thất Công

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Just ship the Pyra with logo plate detached. Let us attach it afterwards anyway, anyhow we want. I would just leave that big hole on mine for ventilation.
 

Grench

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Just ship the Pyra with logo plate detached. Let us attach it afterwards anyway, anyhow we want. I would just leave that big hole on mine for ventilation.
You want to ventilate the raw display circuit board...? Really, that needs to be covered somehow.

I am not sure if the plastic logo piece will just fall out without an adhesive backed plate/foil/sticker to hold it in place, but I suspect it would.

I would be inclined to put the plastic piece in place, run a bead of adhesive around it filling the crack a bit then squish the plate onto it. The 'outer rim' being held in place is likely 'good enough'. Easy enough to do manually for one or ten. A royal assembly pain the neck to do for a few thousand of them.
 

Lambda

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Buddy Id crawl through broken glass to get my hot little hands on a Pyra. Some plastic defects or a paint scratch is pretty low on my list of concerns. I realize thats just my opinion and nobody solicited it, but there it is.
I think the opinions of backers are pretty important, I do not want all backers to cancel their pre-orders and then have ED declare bankruptcy.

Personally I would not mind imperfections too much either, as long as it's not something crazy like shipping the Pyra with a huge hole in the lid.
 

netlinker

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For glueing the logo, maybe hotglue is an option.
Not the kind of you will find in your local hardware store, but there are some special industrial ones with awesome properties.
This would have several advantages:
1. Solvent free, does not attack Polycarbonate or any other form of plastic
2. Very low open time, hardens pretty quickly
3. Depending on the glue, can be removed by heating if needed.
4. Very low cost

One German company I know makes several types of glue for different applications:
https://www.buehnen.de/klebstoffe

They also have special temperature regulated dispensers.
 

RZR

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@EvilDragon

I do not do any business with waterjet companies, but this site has an awesome video on their front page showing a waterjet slicing through ~1cm aluminum (or some other metal) plate.
https://copeland-gibson.com/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIx7rdqcCD5QIVgZOzCh252Az6EAAYAiAAEgJeuPD_BwE
A great description of what waterjet cutting is:
https://www.fedtech.com/waterjet-vs-laser-cutting.html

Pro-hobby level machine that should be able to crank them out in a home workshop:
https://www.wazer.com/

My theory in suggesting waterjet is to have them cut the parts from sheet aluminum with the adhesive and release-paper already applied. Cutting through with the release paper side up should allow the release paper to protect the adhesive layer. I have not done this, it is only an idea/theory. A waterjet company would be able to tell you whether or not it could work.

The type of feedstock I envision:
https://www.mcmaster.com/8941k28

Though that stuff is thin enough and flexible enough that it should be simple to die cut - and flexible enough for any beveling around the edges to flatten back out during application. 0.01 cm thickness - which doesn't sound like much until you consider that household heavy duty aluminum foil is 0.0024 cm thickness. So, this adhesive backed aluminum foil roll stock is four to five times thicker than any household 'foil' you are likely to be familiar with.

Supplying options/ideas only.
Well, that sounds nicer than it really is I'm afraid :)

You usually have 2 forms of cutting with those machines: pure water cut and abrasive cut.

With just water you can cut through most soft materials (the ones you can cut with a knife or scissors at your home, eg: cakes, rubber, fabric, thin plastic...)

With the abrasive you can cut most strong materials (stainless steel, aluminium, stone, glass...)

Cutting with abrasive is really dirty, you usually end having abrasive everywhere. Latest machines cut with the piece under water to avoid this.

Also when waterjet cutting composite materials these may de-laminate.

And also add that waterjet cutting is more expensive than laser cutting. Usually 2 to 3 times more expensive and from my experience laser cutting companies are usually more professional than waterjet cutting ones (more used to high volume production)

...

Pro-hobby level machine that should be able to crank them out in a home workshop:
https://www.wazer.com/

...
That's just a toy almost as bad as the chinese lasers (bodor). Just a low power machine with some crazy abrasive consumption. Pro companies would use one of these, that usually go from 300k € on:

https://www.flowwaterjet.com/Machines/Mach-500
https://www.tcicutting.com/en/cutting-machines/water-jet-cutting-machines-bp-c/
 

oskda

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... and i'm in for an future c64 themed case too! <3
For me the best characteristic about its color is its DARK BROWN or DARK CHOCOLATE (not black) keyboard in original Commodore 64.


But, wait a moment, Pyra keymat is black and we can't change that.

On other side Commodore 64 breadbin case is more variable: there are light brown, grey and some dark beige and grey.

C64-C is beige like lots of computers of than time. I think C64-C is more reliable and better for typing because its case shape, but for colors I choose original C64 and in that keyboard color :)

Of course, with stickers you can get C64 visual elements like simulated grille, color logo and power logo. It will be nice if colors are good.
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I know the Logo-Story. Your solution is OK and it might be difficult to mold that complex and thin edged logo into plastic.
You may think I am CRAZY (I am, of course): I think the problem is logo design with that thin edge elements. My SOLUTION is SIMPLY: design other logo, simpler and suitable for easy integration on plastic mold. In this way you can make case+logo (same mold) and you can leave only one hole (covered with small standard plastic diffuser) for LED.

Look at Nintendo DS Lite logo:

It is really simply (no blade edge/borders like actual Pyra symbol) and it is integrated in plastic mold. It may be it is simply because of that (simply to integrate in plastic mold).

Modern Thinkpad have a LED in back casing in that way and it looks ok (Pyra will be better as its LED is multicolor, while Thinkpad is only red).


In this video we can see LED is not in center of case but above center, so you can put logo in center, and LED will be over it. A nice solution. Even you can design logo so that LED point be in nice conjunction with logo (like in Thinkpad or even better because Pyra will have a logo, not a word [Thinkpad back LED is "i" point]).

It may be we are now on time to change Pyra logo. After this we will have to live with the one used forever. If it is bad designed (hard to work on plastic mold), change it, it may be you are on time now, and you will save later problems in future cases and accessories for Pyra.

A difficult logo to mold is a bad logo.

(Yes, I goy crazy with color. Forum editor is so good :) )
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I now do actually worry about having a flexible logo plate in the cutout, when there is so little surface area in the case's cutout to glue onto or in other words such a narrow rim around the actual hole. You said, it be thicker than the examples you held in your hands there, but they wouldn't get as stiff as a metal plate, I gather.
I think the same: too big hole, too small area to glue thin printed foil. I think it could be a potential weak point in Pyra case, and LCD display is under that hole :(

If they need to redesign mold to made hole smaller an/or area to glue bigger and/or space thicker for thicker printed foil (you made printed foil thicker, BUT supporting plastic under glue thinner/weaker), I think it can be better to design other logo, much simpler and suitable for integration on mold design (like I talked above).
 

levi

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I don't think any solution that involved changing the lid mould is likely to be the solution at this juncture. Maybe as part of the mould redesign for a slimmer case, but we need a simpler solution for the present problem.

And the logo design threads number almost as many and the size as they keyboard threads. It can be printed or laser cut, so it's fine.
 

Grench

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And the logo design threads number almost as many and the size as they keyboard threads.
Not even close. All your threads are belong to keyboard. :D
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I think the same: too big hole, too small area to glue thin printed foil. I think it could be a potential weak point in Pyra case, and LCD display is under that hole :(
The "hole" gets filled in first by a translucent plastic medallion the same size and thickness as the hole. The aluminum piece is essentially a thick sticker that glues/bonds over the boundary, sticking to both the lid and the translucent medallion. The aluminum simply holds the translucent piece in. It does not need to be thick.

@EvilDragon, what is the thickness/gauge/mills of the existing aluminum pieces?
 

rSl

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thanks @oskda for this nice breadbin poster! <3 this makes my morning happy starting.
yes there are a lot of nice colors in these old computer designs.
i'm not too much into decorating one computer to look completely like another system.
they all have their own pesonalities. so just a hint in a style direction would be enough for me.
it's more subtile this way and keeps the distinct looks of the systems.
but if one can swap out a complete theme fastly it would be fun nontheless.
maybe a transparent case with an oled-based paint applied from the inside, so we could theme the case via software?
we need to invent that!

on the pyra logo,
i like it, it looks like a hot coffeebean to me.
 

levi

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I take it you saw the 8/16 bit mockuped Pandora shots that used colours and things of various old computers? These computers are a fraction of the size of the original machines and are clamshells incorporating screens so the best you can do is a nod to the original, but done right it can look really something.
 

Phlyra

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I take it you saw the 8/16 bit mockuped Pandora shots that used colours and things of various old computers? These computers are a fraction of the size of the original machines and are clamshells incorporating screens so the best you can do is a nod to the original, but done right it can look really something.
Hi, newbie here! Been lurking in suspended-animation mode since July but can now finally fully use my account features, such as contributing to threads!
Anyway, was just wondering, levi, if for the benefit of those of us new to the ‘game’, you might provide a link to these mockup-ped Pandora shots (assuming they’re in a specific thread)? Would be much appreciated; I did have a quick search through the threads and Google images but don’t think I found what you’re describing...

Thanks,
Phlyra
 
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