Transfers... Tranzfers..

[MonkeyChops]

since chip said thy have enough money to make pandoras for all the direct deposit guys and everyone else would have to wait for batch 2, this is most certainly seems like a cashflow problem.

My questions are: where would the money come from for the second batch if you don't have it now? would it really be a second batch if you already ordered many of the parts for 4000 pandoras and are only sending 2000 units? why would we wait for a second batch and not just wait for the first 4000 to get finished and order once they are in stock? for pre orderers who have to wait for the second batch, would we have to pay full price again, losing the money from the transfer rates?
Many people including myself used a credit card and pid it off long ago and simply don't have the cash laying around for a transfer. I'm now trying to pull together the cash as it sounds like if I don't transfer or send a check I will be out the exchange rate money. Is it a for sure deal that openpandora is eating the cost of the transfer fees? do I just deduct it from the total? don't they want some proof of what it cost me? I think I'd rather pay by check if possible. Can we get an official word on checks? Gift certificate idea sounds good also. how about an offical word on that, or any offical word at all would great at this point. I hope devs are quit b/c they are scrambling to show us an almost finished product.

this project/community has more drama than day time television...

 

[Alex777]

I don't know if anyone already suggested this, but why not have CC preorders like we do in the states?

Basically, it involves taking people's CC information, saving it in a secure database somewhere, and when the Pandoras are shipping, charge them then.

The preorders are used to see if there's enough interest in whatever's being made to make doing it worthwhile. If there isn't (there clearly is, here), the CCs of the people who did preorder are never charged.

 

[Bronek]

Basically, it involves taking people's CC information, saving it in a secure database somewhere, and when the Pandoras are shipping, charge them then.

Because, I suppose, it's illegal to majority of merchants in Europe. I guess only financial instutions are allowed to use stored CC data for shoppping (yes, Amazon is financial institution - http://www.fsa.gov.uk/register/firmBasicDe...s.do?sid=174355 )

 

[monvmentvm]

since chip said thy have enough money to make pandoras for all the direct deposit guys and everyone else would have to wait for batch 2, this is most certainly seems like a cashflow problem.

My questions are: where would the money come from for the second batch if you don't have it now? would it really be a second batch if you already ordered many of the parts for 4000 pandoras and are only sending 2000 units? why would we wait for a second batch and not just wait for the first 4000 to get finished and order once they are in stock? for pre orderers who have to wait for the second batch, would we have to pay full price again, losing the money from the transfer rates?

Because they have (sub)batches of 400. They just make 5 of these batches and all 2000 pandoras that were paid for are ready to ship. Afterwards it won't take long to make more of these batches so they are then able to accept CC orders properly.

 

[MonkeyChops]

My questions are: where would the money come from for the second batch if you don't have it now? would it really be a second batch if you already ordered many of the parts for 4000 pandoras and are only sending 2000 units? why would we wait for a second batch and not just wait for the first 4000 to get finished and order once they are in stock?

Because they have (sub)batches of 400. They just make 5 of these batches and all 2000 pandoras that were paid for are ready to ship. Afterwards it won't take long to make more of these batches so they are then able to accept CC orders properly.

so would they just continue production and ask for money from pre orderers as the pandora became available in q order? so basically if you pay by transfer u get bumped up in the q? that sounds good to me. but if it means they are going to make the 2000 and then take a couple month break before continuing production and cc preorderers lose the exchange rate money, that definitely doesn't sound good.

 

[MDave]

About 1000 of the 4000 were pre-ordered through Bank Transfers, but this was weeks ago. The target for bank transfers was 1800. Wonder if this is still the case?

EDIT: Craig's post here: http://www.gp32x.de/board/index.php?s=&am...st&p=680586

 

[st0kes]

since chip said thy have enough money to make pandoras for all the direct deposit guys and everyone else would have to wait for batch 2, this is most certainly seems like a cashflow problem.

Can someone in a position of official knowledge please tell me how much time I have left to convert my preorder into a direct credit transfer before I lose my place in the first batch? The first I heard about CC orders not being accepted in the first batch was today in this thread. An email would have been nice.

Please don't speculate if you don't know - there's been enough of that in this thread already!

Cheers.

 

[monvmentvm]

My questions are: where would the money come from for the second batch if you don't have it now? would it really be a second batch if you already ordered many of the parts for 4000 pandoras and are only sending 2000 units? why would we wait for a second batch and not just wait for the first 4000 to get finished and order once they are in stock?

Because they have (sub)batches of 400. They just make 5 of these batches and all 2000 pandoras that were paid for are ready to ship. Afterwards it won't take long to make more of these batches so they are then able to accept CC orders properly.

so would they just continue production and ask for money from pre orderers as the pandora became available in q order? so basically if you pay by transfer u get bumped up in the q? that sounds good to me. but if it means they are going to make the 2000 and then take a couple month break before continuing production and cc preorderers lose the exchange rate money, that definitely doesn't sound good.


No they won't. As long as they have the needed pieces they'll just produce some more batches and from my understanding they should have everything but the cases and final keyboards now.

 

[hells_dark]

Well, i'm looking at transferz but english is not my mother tongue..
So i have difficulties filling the fields..
(NEED TUTORIAL)

 

[MonkeyChops]

Please don't speculate if you don't know - there's been enough of that in this thread already!

fair enough

speculation is all we have at this point. only thing close we have to offical word is from chip and even that seems like speculation.

 

[Ryzure]

Well, I'm trying the Tranzfers.com route. Have any other people in the US used this service? I'm not quite sure what to do after signing up, I thought about emailing the Gp32x store for more info, but I don't know their email either. Or even how much to send for that matter. Any help?

 

[moxie]

you should have given all the info you could, the main one being how many more people still need to pay for there pre-order.
How many people need to preorder? None. We don't need money from anybody else to make Pandoras for those who have already paid. I'm trying to convince Craig to call off additional preorders entirely and just make units for the existing orders. Obviously no CC merchant system is willing to sell preorders, and anybody who is willing to pay via bank transfer has already done so. We'd like to be able to provide a reorder option for everybody who ordered originally, but obviously that just isn't possible.

Those who are not comfortable with a bank transfer are welcome to wait until we have Pandoras in stock and can accept normal CC orders.

Yay, already. And a small bot that patrols the boards and auto-bans anyone doing the "I'm really, really, panties-in-a-bunch mad at them pandora peeple, coz they don't let me use my credit card WAAAA!!!"? Might get the boards back to readable status.

It's, like, not rocket science. You want to preorder a non-existing product with protection? Yes, and I'd like to meet my unmarried friends wife and hear the sound of one hand clapping. Not to mention the obvious one: To have my cake and eat it too.

You don't preorder a non-existing, not yet finished product with protection. That is incompatible terms. Well, unless you're talking about typing in the bank transfer details whilst wearing a rubber, but that is a different kind of protection (and might indicate that you got your priorities wrong). In something like this - preordering a nonexisting item from an enthusiast operation - there is always the chance that it'll all come to nothing. That is always the risk. That is why the banks won't do the CC thing (and they really shouldn't) - this risk is something you, the preorderer, has to take. Other people have already talked about trust, but there is another side to it - Doing something like this is a gamble. Always. Never mind how much you trust somebody, shit can (and will, obviously) always happen. The bank won't gamble for you - tough luck (They will, however, gamble your money on the stock markets for you, un-asked for, but that is another subject).

Yes, I've paid with bank transfer. If the shit hits the fan, my money might possibly be lost. Know what? I knew this, and you all knew this, from the start. If you for some reason cannot possibly stand for that possibility, then stop whining and wait for proper order process, once stuff is built and tested. Then you will get yours after I get mine. That's the price you pay for not gambling.

Just to add another point of observation: I'm swedish. If I go to bokus.se (swedish net-bookstore) and order stuff, I can decide to pay with CC, bank transfer or by bill. Bill, in this case, means they put a bill in the package they send me, and I'm expected to pay this within a month of reciept. But nevermind that - This very common, very established net shop accepts bank transfer, and people use it. If I buy stuff on tradera (swedish ebay-eqivalent) from another individual, it would be very rare if the payment process wasn't "I transfer the money via bank transfer, seller sends stuff when he sees the money in his account". It works, people.

By this, I'm not saying "Craig&Co did nothing wrong, ever, damn you for complaining about my personal heroes whaaaaa". Craig does things wrong sometimes. Like opening a thread like this and not guard it like a hawk. But in this case, the error is not in trying to jump through hoops to let the CC-only people in too - The error was to allow CC preorders from the start.

 

[Alpha2]

What we really need right now is to just stopp the ordering process all together for anyone not capable or willing to go through the transfer process. because obviously this part of the process should have waited until the production stage of the project. if they have the money to produce the first 4000 then just do it and then tell the preorderers who can't pay with transfer when they can send the money that's been refunded.

Simple as that.

 

[DCillusion]

Yay, already. And a small bot that patrols the boards and auto-bans anyone doing the "I'm really, really, panties-in-a-bunch mad at them pandora peeple, coz they don't let me use my credit card WAAAA!!!"? Might get the boards back to readable status.

It's, like, not rocket science. You want to preorder a non-existing product with protection? Yes, and I'd like to meet my unmarried friends wife and hear the sound of one hand clapping. Not to mention the obvious one: To have my cake and eat it too.

You don't preorder a non-existing, not yet finished product with protection. That is incompatible terms. Well, unless you're talking about typing in the bank transfer details whilst wearing a rubber, but that is a different kind of protection (and might indicate that you got your priorities wrong). In something like this - preordering a nonexisting item from an enthusiast operation - there is always the chance that it'll all come to nothing. That is always the risk. That is why the banks won't do the CC thing (and they really shouldn't) - this risk is something you, the preorderer, has to take. Other people have already talked about trust, but there is another side to it - Doing something like this is a gamble. Always. Never mind how much you trust somebody, shit can (and will, obviously) always happen. The bank won't gamble for you - tough luck (They will, however, gamble your money on the stock markets for you, un-asked for, but that is another subject).

Yes, I've paid with bank transfer. If the shit hits the fan, my money might possibly be lost. Know what? I knew this, and you all knew this, from the start. If you for some reason cannot possibly stand for that possibility, then stop whining and wait for proper order process, once stuff is built and tested. Then you will get yours after I get mine. That's the price you pay for not gambling.

Just to add another point of observation: I'm swedish. If I go to bokus.se (swedish net-bookstore) and order stuff, I can decide to pay with CC, bank transfer or by bill. Bill, in this case, means they put a bill in the package they send me, and I'm expected to pay this within a month of reciept. But nevermind that - This very common, very established net shop accepts bank transfer, and people use it. If I buy stuff on tradera (swedish ebay-eqivalent) from another individual, it would be very rare if the payment process wasn't "I transfer the money via bank transfer, seller sends stuff when he sees the money in his account". It works, people.

By this, I'm not saying "Craig&Co did nothing wrong, ever, damn you for complaining about my personal heroes whaaaaa". Craig does things wrong sometimes. Like opening a thread like this and not guard it like a hawk. But in this case, the error is not in trying to jump through hoops to let the CC-only people in too - The error was to allow CC preorders from the start.



I think it's already been established, on these forums, that the Swedish have no crime, & get a free puppy with every happy meal. Too bad for all you haters that live in other countries, (that you apparently chose before your birth to live.) You were right about us knowing this from the beginning. You just forgot to mention that it was from the beginning of today

 

[Perky_Goth]

Is that all true, or have I misunderstood something?

Yes. Every single EU country is different. Which is both great and sucky at the same time.

 

[Vorporeal]

I'm thinking of going the standard bank transfer route. The fee for an international transfer is USD $40 though. Craig had said at one point that part of these fees might be subsidized by OpenPandora Ltd. Any official statements on how much of that $40 might be subsidized?

 

[Eniko]

I think it's already been established, on these forums, that the Swedish have no crime, & get a free puppy with every happy meal. Too bad for all you haters that live in other countries, (that you apparently chose before your birth to live.) You were right about us knowing this from the beginning. You just forgot to mention that it was from the beginning of today

I do believe Moxie was responding to such outrageous claims as "no shop in the world ever anywhere does this!" when in fact plenty do. Of course said person also ignored the evidence presented multiple times in a row so eh...

 

[DCillusion]

What Moxie was leading to was that we should all shut up because we knew it was a gamble from the beginning. Even the responses are due to a thread posted on January 16th. There are, like, 4 or 5 posts in a twenty page thread about a bank transfer; so it's obviously not the norm'.

That's why I'm for the Gift Card. It seems the only sensible idea so far, & I think we should now start a poll at the top of this thread.

P.S. - Chip, can can you edit the official list of Dev Team updates to include Jan. 16th: The Day the Shit hit the Fan.

 

[Phawx]

So just to clarify. Because I paid with Amex and OpenPandora is going to "take the hit". Are all Amex users treated as 'Paid by bank transfer'?

 

[DCillusion]

Double post delete