Transfers... Tranzfers..

[Eniko]

So chip just stated some good info can someone please correct me if i'm wrong?

OP can only now accept payment via bank transfer.

If you cant, are no willing to do bank transfer you will have to wait for 2nd batch

From what I read it may still be possible to send a cheque.

 

[Esn]

So chip just stated some good info can someone please correct me if i'm wrong?

OP can only now accept payment via bank transfer.

If you cant, are no willing to do bank transfer you will have to wait for 2nd batch

That's what Chip wants to happen, but the decision isn't his to make and it has not been made yet.

 

[stustaff]

Thank you for the FAQ, but there also needs to be an FAQ about the payment systems, because there seems to be geographical culture shock.

As far as I can make out, this is the situation (correct me if I'm wrong):

BANK TRANSFERS:

-In the continental EU countries, bank transfers are secure, inexpensive, and the most common form of payment both for bill payments and for preorders

-In Australia, bank transfers are secure and common only within Australia, largely for things like gas bills

-In the UK, bank transfers are somewhere between the EU and US situation....

-In the US and Canada, international bank transfers are completely insecure and expensive; in fact, only scam artists use them

Is that all true, or have I misunderstood something?



I think you need to clarify something!

Transfers are secure in that the money you send goes to where you send it!
However they are not secure in that you get your money back if OP never ship a pandora and go bankrupt(that is what CC are for)
I have seen the posts saying you could then take OP to court if they never ship your Pandora but that ignores the fact that if Pandora doesnt ship then OP as a company will probably not exist and certainly wont have a lot of money so paying for a court case and lawyer etc is not realistic.

 

[emcp]

chip
if i may ask this question (i never read the whole thread im sick and tired reading multi page threads on the same topic)

you knew this was gonna happen, why take american reorders first instead of those or preordered first..................................

 

[peca]

...
Well does tranzfers.com work US to UK?...
Have the xoom.com payments come in fine?

I don't know, but:

Anyway, here are a few other transfer options that I've seen recommended around the net:
http://www.moneybookers.com/
http://www.neteller.com/
https://www.obopay.com/
And a slightly wacky option I've heard about that apparently works well: http://www.e-gold.com/

...Is that all true, or have I misunderstood something?

You are right at least about EU (AFAIK).

I don't understand why and how bank transfer can be insecure. Maybe due to Hollywood films, where money are transfered via long progressbar - more millions = more time B)

 

[stustaff]

I don't understand why and how bank transfer can be insecure. Maybe due to Hollywood films, where money are transfered via long progressbar - more millions = more time B)



peca see my post above its not insecure in that the money dissapears! the money WILL go from your account to OP's.
The lack of security we are referring to is that if OP went bust with bank transfer you would not get your money back(just join a list of creditors) compared to the security of a CC where you would get your money back pretty quicly

 

[Esn]

I think you need to clarify something!

Transfers are secure in that the money you send goes to where you send it!
However they are not secure in that you get your money back if OP never ship a pandora and go bankrupt(that is what CC are for)
I have seen the posts saying you could then take OP to court if they never ship your Pandora but that ignores the fact that if Pandora doesnt ship then OP as a company will probably not exist and certainly wont have a lot of money so paying for a court case and lawyer etc is not realistic.

I added the following clarification:

"(to clarify: they are secure in that the money goes to the account # you specify, but in the US/Canada the banks do not get involved beyond that; in the EU, they guarantee your transaction)"

That's what EU people have seemed to be saying, with the US/Canada people acting very surprised. I don't pretend to understand it well myself.

 

[stustaff]

"(to clarify: they are secure in that the money goes to the account # you specify, but in the US/Canada the banks do not get involved beyond that; in the EU, they guarantee your transaction)"

That's what EU people have seemed to be saying, with the US/Canada people acting very surprised. I don't pretend to understand it well myself.



Again NO they do not guarantee your 'transaction' in the EU( I should clarify I work for a bank in the UK) in any way other than the money getting there, then once complete it is nothing to do with the bank! If it turned out to be fraud you would be contacting the police and a court to take legal proceedings to get your money back.

The bank makes sure the money gets to the account and thats where their interest stops.

 

[peca]

peca see my post above its not insecure in that the money dissapears!...

You post this while I typing But now I fully understand.
AFAIK in my country (guess at least in whole EU too), I can cancel my transfer. Sure, money must be still on the way or on target account yet.

 

[Azure]

I always thought that Craig & Co. wanted to get all the pre-order stuff out of the way now so that when the Pandora is ready to ship it is ready to ship, no more delays or having to wait to sort out any more ordering before you can get your Pandora.

 

[stustaff]

peca see my post above its not insecure in that the money dissapears!...

You post this while I typing But now I fully understand.
AFAIK in my country (guess at least in whole EU too), I can cancel my transfer. Sure, money must be still on the way or on target account yet.

oh yes we could cancel but only if the money hasnt got to the receiver yet.

In this case if we transferred money today and it got to OP next wednesday and they went bankrupt on Friday a bank transfer would not give you any security in getting any of that money back.

You would be left joining a list of claiments under any bankrupcy proceedings.

 

[Esn]

So in that case, if you're saying that there's no difference except for price, why exactly are bank transfers considered so secure in the EU and so insecure in the US/Canada?

And what makes cheques so secure in the US and so insecure in the EU?

 

[salasq]

People trust Visa/Mastercard when doing international purchases because you can link the transaction to a specific purchase, an international bank transfer is very difficult to provide evidence that it is linked to any particular transaction. It is just money changing hands for whatever reason, the bank doesn't care.

Uhm, I added the order number to my transfer, which - having been logged at both banks - is enough to tie the transfer to a specific transaction.

 

[peca]

In this case if we transferred money today and it got to OP next wednesday and they went bankrupt on Friday a bank transfer would not give you any security in getting any of that money back.
You would be left joining a list of claiments under any bankrupcy proceedings.

Yes, for sure. This is the same if you order car, make advance payment, and than reseller bankrupt. You money is in kinda lawttery (as lottery but with lawyers behind).

 

[monvmentvm]

Thank you for the FAQ, but there also needs to be an FAQ about the payment systems, because there seems to be geographical culture shock.

As far as I can make out, this is the situation (correct me if I'm wrong):

BANK TRANSFERS:

-In the continental EU countries, bank transfers are secure, inexpensive, and the most common form of payment both for bill payments and for preorders

-In Australia, bank transfers are secure and common only within Australia, largely for things like gas bills

-In the UK, bank transfers are somewhere between the EU and US situation....

-In the US and Canada, international bank transfers are completely insecure and expensive; in fact, only scam artists use them (to clarify: they are secure in that the money goes to the account # you specify, but in the US/Canada the banks do not get involved beyond that; in the EU, they guarantee your transaction)

CHEQUES:

-In the US and Canada, cheques are common and secure

-In the EU, cheques are so insecure that they're outlawed

CREDIT CARDS:

-In the US and Canada, credit cards are used for almost all online transactions, particularly international ones

-In the continental EU, credit cards are considered to be worse than bank transfers and not used so often


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is that all true, or have I misunderstood something?



Are cheques in the US really that secure? (I'm just asking, because I really don't know the answer.)

In the continental EU credit cards aren't really considered to be worse than bank transfers. It's just that they aren't necessary here because bank transfers do the job well enough. At least here in Austria the banks can also refund bank transfers if you contact them. The difference to cc payments is the fact that cc companies have to refund the money out of their own pockets if something goes wrong, while banks simply transfer the money back to you from the bank account it was initially transfered to. Such accounts also have to be registered to a valid person. So if someone has big, red figures in his account, the banks will lock his account anyway. And if the situation doesn't change after some time, they'll have your address and whatever it needs to get in touch with you. And I wouldn't call that funny situation then...

That's also why cc companies are making troubles now with OP... they would have to refund the money themselves, so it's too much of a risk for them.

Edit: CC cards inside the EU are mostly used if going abroad, buying cars or for the inevitable bad: paypal.

 

[emcp]

stop talking about security of banking payments, its been discussed several times, and if your too lazy to look for it, make a seperate topic

this is for more important specific discussion, and yous are clogging up the entire topic, next we just need some idiot to bring up the topic of the craiginator pandora, honestly yous are awful at keeping on topic on this forum

we need mods

 

[MikeL]

Chip's suggestion is, in a more politically correct way, saying "If you don't want to do a bank transfer, F-OFF, we don't need to make you one."
No, my suggestion is that if it is impossible to take CC orders, we should stop trying to find increasingly sketchy solutions and face the fact that it is impossible to take CC orders at this time. If you think about it for half a minute, it is obvious that the more Pandoras we can sell, the better. If there were any way to take CC orders now, we would. We've already tried several options, and all of them have fallen through.

You're too nervous to use a bank transfer? Then don't. We're not trying to force anybody to use transfers, it's just that transfers are the only way we can accept payment at this time. If that's a problem, then wait and order a Pandora when they're in stock. We'd love to make one for you now, but if you are not able to use a payment method that we are able to accept, then you'll have to wait a bit. It's that simple.

How about the people who ordered with amex and haven't received a refund?

 

[salasq]

-In the continental EU, credit cards are considered to be worse than bank transfers and not used so often

No, it's a matter of convenience - what option does a particular store offer, which form of funds would you prefer to use at the time. It's just that transfers don't have the bad rep as they seem to have in US/UK and are therefore considered a valid alternative.

Edit: Just to add that I'd get laughed at in my bank if I attempted to cash a cheque. Might as well walk in with an IOU

 

[monvmentvm]

stop talking about security of banking payments, its been discussed several times, and if your too lazy to look for it, make a seperate topic

this is for more important specific discussion, and yous are clogging up the entire topic, next we just need some idiot to bring up the topic of the craiginator pandora, honestly yous are awful at keeping on topic on this forum

we need mods

Do you have the feeling that most people did understand the differences and what it's all about? I have not.

It was my 3rd post in a 19-page long thread btw.... can it really be that annoying?

 

[DCillusion]

Thank you for the FAQ, but there also needs to be an FAQ about the payment systems, because there seems to be geographical culture shock.

As far as I can make out, this is the situation (correct me if I'm wrong):

BANK TRANSFERS:

-In the continental EU countries, bank transfers are secure, inexpensive, and the most common form of payment both for bill payments and for preorders

-In Australia, bank transfers are secure and common only within Australia, largely for things like gas bills

-In the UK, bank transfers are somewhere between the EU and US situation....

-In the US and Canada, international bank transfers are completely insecure and expensive; in fact, only scam artists use them

Is that all true, or have I misunderstood something?



I think you need to clarify something!

Transfers are secure in that the money you send goes to where you send it!
However they are not secure in that you get your money back if OP never ship a pandora and go bankrupt(that is what CC are for)
I have seen the posts saying you could then take OP to court if they never ship your Pandora but that ignores the fact that if Pandora doesnt ship then OP as a company will probably not exist and certainly wont have a lot of money so paying for a court case and lawyer etc is not realistic.


Except that, if you pay be CC you don't need a lawyer. You just call up your account handler, consultant, etc. & explain the situation. They investigate, & you get your money back. It wasn't yours in the first place. It was the bank's. They decide not to charge you for it. Then they take appropriate action. That's why people like using CC's....to avoid lawyers.