Pandora Tincs - Multiplayer Shooter For Pandora (video)

[giovanni]

@Butterman
I exported my 2 models with your script but:

- They lost their textures (I know that in the Model Viewer you cannot see them, however they lost them also in the .blend file).
- One of them was exported a little twisted.
- In the model viewer the camera seems to be at the top of the model while in your example we see the gun from a lateral view.

However all the passages worked very well, I had no error...

P.S: Later I will post a render of my (not) AMAZING cannon. You will be astonished... kidding... It's ugly

 

[Butterman]

- The texture aren't passed in the model format, only the UV co-ordinates, you need to have them separately.
- That's strange, send me the model "jack@sorok.co.uk", I'll take a look.
- You just need to rotate the model

If you go onto "irc.quakenet.org" then join the #TINCS channel, we can give you a hand .

Thanks, you're helping me sort out all of the problems with exporting models

 

[Butterman]

OH. Giovanni, is it possible that some of your faces have more than 4 verticies?

 

[Muzz]

If you modeler guys want help with any thing 3d wise I'm happy to give a hand. Especially with model optimization and little tricks to avoid ngons. Im also in the tincs irc channell.

 

[giovanni]

OH. Giovanni, is it possible that some of your faces have more than 4 verticies?

No I modelled them in Blender that doesn't support polygons with more than 4 verticies.
However here are the 2 models (sorry, but my provider doesn't work now so it's diffcult for me to use the e-mail).

http://digilander.libero.it/giov_lol_92/Sgrapach.zip

http://digilander.libero.it/giov_lol_92/Sgrapach2.zip


This is the render
http://digilander.libero.it/giov_lol_92/Preview.jpg

And this is the view in blender and Jmodel viewer:
http://digilander.libero.it/giov_lol_92/Confronto.JPG

 

[Butterman]

I like the texture map and the model. I wouldn't say it's steam punk tho. You need like brass pipes and shizzle.

I'm definitely going to use it at an objective for now. You know, like defend the cannon! Kinda thing. It would be good for that, or even as a set-piece. You should convert that old shack of yours into JModel, I would use that too

Wait, is that animated?!

I'm getting animation into the model viewer as we speak, I wanna see this in action

 

[giovanni]

QUOTE

I like the texture map and the model. I wouldn't say it's steam punk tho. You need like brass pipes and shizzle.

I'm definitely going to use it at an objective for now. You know, like defend the cannon! Kinda thing. It would be good for that, or even as a set-piece. You should convert that old shack of yours into JModel, I would use that too

Wait, is that animated?!

I'm getting animation into the model viewer as we speak, I wanna see this in action



thank you

Yes, I think that this weapon would be perfect as a set-piece... Imagine a lot of cannon shooting aganist your troops... I made the model with this in mind...
Yes, it's not so steampunk... I hope it will fit in the style of the game... if not feel free to remove it.

A suggestion for the animation if I have no time and someone want to make it (ahahahahahahaha)... The pivot point of the cannon is setted exactly where it has to wheel around so it wuldn't be too difficult to make it rotate... When it shoots I think it will be nice to have a sort of recoil...

My old shack comprise more than 50 sticks so... It's difficult to convert all of them one at a time ...

Do it work well in the engine?

Thank you for the support
Giovanni

P.S: About the pipes yor're right but...... I'm not good enough in CG.... Sorry
P.S: I'll try to animate it and add some pipes.... I don't know if I've enough time and capabilities...

 

[Mithrildor]

Cannons would be perfect for the airship level.

Anyways , the stuff is going way to slow to finish the game in a good amount of time.

 

[Butterman]

Cannons would be perfect for the airship level.

Anyways , the stuff is going way to slow to finish the game in a good amount of time.

Whatcha talking about?

In two weeks I've:
- Perfected a camera
- Perfected my networking backbone (which is no easy task for an FPS)
- Created a model format with animation and skinning
- Which will be used as a format for maps
- Which means all I have to do is implement triangle-ray collision and we've got playable maps
- Stuff like shooting and scoring is already in

 

[Mithrildor]

Im talking about models.

 

[fusion_power]

In two weeks I've:
- Perfected a camera
- Perfected my networking backbone (which is no easy task for an FPS)
- Created a model format with animation and skinning
- Which will be used as a format for maps
- Which means all I have to do is implement triangle-ray collision and we've got playable maps
- Stuff like shooting and scoring is already in

Will your final Engine be able to handle some Level-interaction? Doors, movers, destroyable objects maybe? Or moving things at all?
I have a vision of a Steampunk Level with alot of huge moving steam engines, spinning gears, smoke, dirt etc... \^_\^

 

[Butterman]

You're in luck. My current plan for the first generation of maps, is just to use the JModel format. After I add support for multiple texturing and stuff like bump-mapping. That way, the entire level can be animated in real-time with no performance drops, because it's all pre-calculated. So you would create the level in Blender like you would a model, animate all of the moving stuff you want, then export it. Load it up in TINCS and you can add stuff like spawn points, weapons, ammo, objectives and particle emitters.

This way, we can still reach a high level of map quality and complexity, while still allowing users to modify the maps in the game, you could change the entire flow of the map by modifying only weapon spawns!

 

[giovanni]

Are you planning to implement the Jmodel Export script?
I know it can slow down the developing of the game but it can open the door to external helps.
I'm very thankful for your availability to accept helps but actually it's very difficult to make our model compatible with the engine.
I think that in effects we just need multiple selection and export and maybe a better model viewer... nothing more...

One help:
I tried to animate my model... What I had to do to export this animation? And what about models that have more than one animation (like: normal status, shot, explosion)?

Thank you

P.S: I'm planning to remodel from zero, my cannon and other weapons... What are the most important characteristics that make a model steampunkish?

 

[Butterman]

I"m working on getting the JModel format drawing out with vertex arrays, I"ve run into a few little problems that are taking a while to sort out. It's to do with texturing. Once that's done, I"m going to include this stuff into the model viewer, add a camera and make the object animated. Then re-release the model viewer along with the source code for it.

I"m also working on multiple texture support per mesh for the format. Which will basically mean, you turn your object selection into one mesh, with two different textures applied to it, then export that . I want to give to the exporter a GUI too, but that's far down on my list.

Animation is auto-magically exported with the file, it happened by accident with one of your models that you sent me, which is why I thought you had animated it. So just set your model to the first frame, then press export and it should work! If you want more than one animation you can do it like so.

First animation, frame 1 - 20, second animation, frame 20 - 60, etc etc,

You get me? Like, have different sections of the same big animation split into lots of different ones? Then just export the one big file. I"m going to add in a system, so you can input which animations are which into the format. We will probably have a standard too, so like, for guns, 1 - 20 will always be the idle animation, 20 - 40 will always be the shooting animation.

But it's still early days for all of that yet. Your last question, it's probably best to ask an artist, like Muzz will be around here in a few hours I'm sure he will answer it in detail

 

[Muzz]

I don't really like the direction of going for a steampunk style game, but if you want to model it guess i can give you a bit of direction .

The most important thing is to think about how the weapons work work irl and not just throw on old looking greeble, while gathering a lot of reference from the Victorian era and industrial revolution.

If you wanted to go cliche steam punk you could always add in a few chunky cogs and call it done but no that is a cop out.
So say if you wanted to do a proper job of the steam cannon, how do steam cannons work? Well first of they build up pressure with a boiler creating the steam, which then is piped to the actual cannon part (probably best to still look at traditional cannons for this.). Then there needs to be a mechanism to release the cannon ball when it has enough pessure, and it also needs a reloading mechanism.

Also if you want some good stuff to watch for inspiration, check out the movie steamboy .

Overall its just about thinking and finding good reference... Oh and not sticking random glowing lights on it.... because that is NOT steampunk.

As far as the art style i would like to see, i should have a good page with some pretty pictures to look at when i get home from college and work tonight . I think i just might be able to sway you guys off steampunk. Or perhaps i'm just being an optimist.

 

[fusion_power]

You're in luck. My current plan for the first generation of maps, is just to use the JModel format. After I add support for multiple texturing and stuff like bump-mapping. That way, the entire level can be animated in real-time with no performance drops, because it's all pre-calculated. So you would create the level in Blender like you would a model, animate all of the moving stuff you want, then export it. Load it up in TINCS and you can add stuff like spawn points, weapons, ammo, objectives and particle emitters.

This way, we can still reach a high level of map quality and complexity, while still allowing users to modify the maps in the game, you could change the entire flow of the map by modifying only weapon spawns!

Blender sounds good to me. I have no Texturing and Animation skills (UV Texturing is so evil ) but I think I could try some experiments with Level geometry etc...
Maybe there yould be a Blender preset file with the right scale and measurements included? I always wanted to try some kind of level with Blender, I've downloaded some examples where you can walk and jump within the Blender Game engine, very basic but you can test the Level.
Is it important to only use Triangles? Blender uses quads too but I don't know if your Engine support Quads.

 

[Muzz]

Model with quads, its faster and much easier, especially for beginners. If we need it in tris you just convert it to tris automatically.

Truth be told that quads are actually better for characters as they animate better, though you miss out on a small amount of poly saving techniques.

 

[fusion_power]

Yes, I'm sure I find the right option (quad to tris or tris to quad) when I'm start searching. ^^

I wonder, if the Engine "eats" the Blender Level completely or do own calculations to improve performance. AFAIK you can optimize a level very well, when the Engine itself sets some objects (trees, pipes, decoration) into the scene so these Ojects have to calculated only once and then duplicated, Newer Unreal Engines work this way, the real Level is very empty if you disable all these additional objects. I was shocked when I realized, that you can't model everything in the Unreal Ed from UT2003, all the Decoration has to be modeled external and then set into the basic Level. \^_\^
However, I had made some basic environments with Blender in the past, it is a good way to start with a large grid and use the special brushes to deform the grid. Water is no problem with Blender but I don't know if the TINCS Engine has support for this. Also no clue how the Sky will be realized.
When I have my new Core 2 Quad PC, I think I start to test out the new Features in Blender 2.48.

EDIT: Very interesting, this new skills of the Blender Game Engine:
CODE
http://www.yofrankie.org/download/

 

[Muzz]

There is no such thing of a tri to quad feature, only quad to tri .

Butterman will correct me if I'm wrong but the only things that you modelers have to worry about is the meshes, the textures and animations and making sure they are the specifications he needs. Environmental effects are all coded by hand so having them in blender or any other program doesn't help one bit. Those features are for rendering high res film shizz.

The sky will be what we call a skybox, which is just a huge box with a texture applied to it. Its how they do it in every game.

Note i dont know blender so im speaking in general terms but i would be highly suprised and impressed if im wrong.

 

[Butterman]

There is no such thing of a tri to quad feature, only quad to tri .

Butterman will correct me if I'm wrong but the only things that you modelers have to worry about is the meshes, the textures and animations and making sure they are the specifications he needs. Environmental effects are all coded by hand so having them in blender or any other program doesn't help one bit. Those features are for rendering high res film shizz.

The sky will be what we call a skybox, which is just a huge box with a texture applied to it. Its how they do it in every game.

Note i dont know blender so im speaking in general terms but i would be highly suprised and impressed if im wrong.

That's correct. You can make models with a combination of triangles and quads too, the format can differentiate between the two without problems.

The map imported from blender will be a static mesh (with animation, if you get me).

We will probably do a sky box, but I was thinking about procedural clouds for some maps too.