The Pandora Photos!

[ashdjones]

I can't help it, but i'm starting to lose a little confidence in this project - things just don't seem to be progressing the way they should do. Maybe i'm wrong, and this is one of those projects where everything comes together at the last minute to form the full picture?

Where's the GUI? I read that it was already better than the GP2X one, but it hasn't even been shown. How about a desktop OS or some linux apps?

I think the problem is people are being kept in the dark because all the smaller developments aren't seen as news-worthy, so maybe there should be a seperate blog for more 'boring' technical news (i'm a programmer so it would interest me).

 

[Squidge]

I can't help it, but i'm starting to lose a little confidence in this project - things just don't seem to be progressing the way they should do. Maybe i'm wrong, and this is one of those projects where everything comes together at the last minute to form the full picture?

To be honest, how many other projects do you normally see from such an early stage? You typically only hear of new devices when they are almost complete, so for Pandora, you would typically only just start hearing about it now.

Where's the GUI? I read that it was already better than the GP2X one, but it hasn't even been shown. How about a desktop OS or some linux apps?

Video grabs of various Linux apps (admittingly, mostly, if not all, emulators) have been released.

 

[ashdjones]

I can't help it, but i'm starting to lose a little confidence in this project - things just don't seem to be progressing the way they should do. Maybe i'm wrong, and this is one of those projects where everything comes together at the last minute to form the full picture?

To be honest, how many other projects do you normally see from such an early stage? You typically only hear of new devices when they are almost complete, so for Pandora, you would typically only just start hearing about it now.

Where's the GUI? I read that it was already better than the GP2X one, but it hasn't even been shown. How about a desktop OS or some linux apps?

Video grabs of various Linux apps (admittingly, mostly, if not all, emulators) have been released.


I would describe early as last January, but the due release date is in one or two months time isn't it? Based on events so far and the current state of progress, i'm expecting a January launch personally.

Yes, the emulator videos were hugely encouraging! It was probably the thing that convinced be to buy a Pandora from the first batch, but that was quite a while ago now wasn't it?

I thought that 100 dev-kits were issued? Are there 100 projects on the go or is everyone working on the kernal stuff?

 

[chad78]

Well, You obviously haven`t seen the other thread yet, That should cheer you up.
Link or it didn't happen. And I can say that as there are other non-Chad members who have no idea what you're talking about.

I would describe early as last January, but the due release date is in one or two months time isn't it? Based on events so far and the current state of progress, i'm expecting a January launch personally.
The question is - January of what year.QUOTE
Yes, the emulator videos were hugely encouraging! It was probably the thing that convinced be to buy a Pandora from the first batch, but that was quite a while ago now wasn't it?
Yes, and little has been shown since.QUOTE
I thought that 100 dev-kits were issued? Are there 100 projects on the go or is everyone working on the kernal stuff?
That's another one of those "You have to speak Pandora to understand" misleading statements. They offered "Up-to" 100 units. Probably about 15 - 20 were actually shipped. Up to 100 is the same as 15, in the same way as "we're shooting for an April-May release" means sometime within the next 5 - 10 years.

 

[Tensuke]

Where's the GUI? I read that it was already better than the GP2X one, but it hasn't even been shown. How about a desktop OS or some linux apps?

I too am getting slightly annoyed by the lack of showing anything about the GUI, but I would MUCH rather see a nice video of the full(or, at least mostly done) GUI than a few random videos.

I thought it was evident that my post was not devoted to archos devices as a rivals for Panda. I guess I should have better expressed myself. I just wanted to say that Panda is not the only one out there. I'd prefer to have a more expensive Nokia n900 that infinite Panda development process. But I guess andora1: pandora2ut4.png zealots will chose the second option .

Actually, I wouldn't really buy those things...As cool as they are, they're just not what I'm looking for.

 

[chad78]

Here's some more "Reality"

"Full working Prototype by August in time for Leipzig" - reality - empty shell with no keyboard.

And, BTW - it was NOT qualified by a "might" or a "we will try to" or any such KYAC statement. Here is the quote in full.

We will have real, fully working, prototype Pandora systems in Aug which will be taken to a few shows in the UK and Germany.

I think Channel4 in the UK want to do a little feature on the Pandora so you may also see it there.
Oh wow. Would you look at that. It doesn't say "Prototype" - my bad. It says "prototype Pandora SYSTEMS" - as in PLURAL. Real, fully working systems. Empty box with no keyboard. Yeah - that's the same thing.

 

[trooper]

Well, You obviously haven`t seen the other thread yet, That should cheer you up.
Link or it didn't happen. And I can say that as there are other non-Chad members who have no idea what you're talking about.

I would describe early as last January, but the due release date is in one or two months time isn't it? Based on events so far and the current state of progress, i'm expecting a January launch personally.
The question is - January of what year.QUOTE
Yes, the emulator videos were hugely encouraging! It was probably the thing that convinced be to buy a Pandora from the first batch, but that was quite a while ago now wasn't it?
Yes, and little has been shown since.QUOTE
I thought that 100 dev-kits were issued? Are there 100 projects on the go or is everyone working on the kernal stuff?
That's another one of those "You have to speak Pandora to understand" misleading statements. They offered "Up-to" 100 units. Probably about 15 - 20 were actually shipped. Up to 100 is the same as 15, in the same way as "we're shooting for an April-May release" means sometime within the next 5 - 10 years.

Chad promply explodes. :rolleyes:

But, Before you do, Here is that thread/post i was on about, If you haven`t seen it already.

Trooper

 

[chad78]

Well, You obviously haven`t seen the other thread yet, That should cheer you up.
Link or it didn't happen. And I can say that as there are other non-Chad members who have no idea what you're talking about.Here is that thread/post i was on about, If you haven`t seen it already. And, how, exactly, does a new bug make me happy? Is it because of the spin of Craig "If we had [done what we promised and] released the Pandora already, we'd have to recall them."? Sheesh, dude. If they had released in *APRIL* like they said, we would have had at least 4 months with the Pandora before they were recalled. Heck, they might have been based on a different batch entirely and not even had the bug.

The way you worded your statement, lead me (and apparently others) to believe that there was a thread documenting the finished GUI. Show me that thread, and I'll be happy.

 

[_VWV_]

Chad promply explodes. :rolleyes:

But, Before you do, Here is that thread/post i was on about, If you haven`t seen it already.

Trooper


Aha, I see now thank you. The gui is so cool they had to use neon to accelerate it. So they simply can't show us the gui because of this bug. Very nice!
edit: typo

 

[CronoTriggerfan]

Dear CronoTriggerfan what makes you think you'll be preodering andora1: without having seen the gui? Do you still hope those estimates about preodering are right? You can't preoder air and you can't preoder your dreams they will have to show us a fully working MK1 device. And according to what I've recently seen a semi assembled device from which you have to take out a PCB to turn it on with no gui can't be considered as beta version, because beta should be fully assembled and working prototype. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think there's plenty of time left before you can preoder something, so that the gui will be completed before preodering starts.
You haven't seen it yet, and neither have I. It's good news that we at least know what they're basing the GUI off of, but as Chad stated, they've yet to show us something. I trust the devs to release a sweet project when it comes out, but I'm skeptical whenever they set benchmarks for themselves.

"I'll believe it when I see it."

 

[Squidge]

Oh wow. Would you look at that. It doesn't say "Prototype" - my bad. It says "prototype Pandora SYSTEMS" - as in PLURAL. Real, fully working systems. Empty box with no keyboard. Yeah - that's the same thing.



The box wasn't actually empty until Ed removed the PCB for the purpose of the demonstration, so it was good enough

 

[FRZ]

Oh wow. Would you look at that. It doesn't say "Prototype" - my bad. It says "prototype Pandora SYSTEMS" - as in PLURAL. Real, fully working systems. Empty box with no keyboard. Yeah - that's the same thing.



The box wasn't actually empty until Ed removed the PCB for the purpose of the demonstration, so it was good enough
Why do you have to remove the PCB from the case to connect it in the demos? Won't we be able to connect the Pandora to an external display without removing it from the case?

 

[CoMiKe]

Why do you have to remove the PCB from the case to connect it in the demos? Won't we be able to connect the Pandora to an external display without removing it from the case?

They've already said that the Pandora doesn't work inside the case because of the LCD cable (that is far too short or far too long, I don't exactly remember).

 

[Thecko]

A decent camera used by someone without knowledge can generate some fantastically poor pictures (much worse than a camera phone in some instances)

That's very true! I've got a DSLR and I still suck

 

[Thecko]

Camera flash isn't the cure-all you may think. I can't use it for a couple reasons when I take photos.

1. The flash bounces off a part of the object and makes it so you can't see anything.

Off-camera flash - the bounces are to do with the angle of light hitting them, if you've got an external flash unit you can raise it and angle down, or better yet, 'bounce' the flash off a near-by object (the wall or ceiling for example).

2. The flash wears out the batteries.

Buy better batteries

3. The flash needs to recharge.

True .... buy a better external flash unit

You really need some high intensity lights and some kind of light diffuser: http://strobist.blogspot.com/2006/07/how-t...oto-studio.html


You don't need mega expensive equipment to take reasonable shots in tungsten lighting - for example if you want to diffuse the light from your built-in flash just get a bit of toilet/kitchen roll... or a small piece of translucent plastic and hold it there manually.

 

[Megamixman]

Well, You obviously haven`t seen the other thread yet, That should cheer you up.
Link or it didn't happen. And I can say that as there are other non-Chad members who have no idea what you're talking about.Here is that thread/post i was on about, If you haven`t seen it already. And, how, exactly, does a new bug make me happy? Is it because of the spin of Craig "If we had [done what we promised and] released the Pandora already, we'd have to recall them."? Sheesh, dude. If they had released in *APRIL* like they said, we would have had at least 4 months with the Pandora before they were recalled. Heck, they might have been based on a different batch entirely and not even had the bug.

The way you worded your statement, lead me (and apparently others) to believe that there was a thread documenting the finished GUI. Show me that thread, and I'll be happy.


If they released it in April, you a.) wouldn't have working wifi or USB. b.) wouldn't have any base besides maybe a working linux kernel. Quit your whining and wait. I'm not saying that craig and co can just break all promises. They just haven't promised anything. The fact is, this IS what happens when you're dealing with a combination of new architectures, SoC, Silicon, etc. People like you who are purely consumers need to take a chill pill. You don't have any understanding of what the process is like.

Pandora devs aren't here to make you happy Chad. Get over it. The world doesn't revolve around you.

 

[parag0n]

If they had released it in April, it would have been an MMSP2 device with no keyboard, a touchscreen, and wifi.

It would have been a GP2X F-200.

 

[chad78]

If they released it in April, you a.) wouldn't have working wifi or USB. b.) wouldn't have any base besides maybe a working linux kernel. Quit your whining and wait. I'm not saying that craig and co can just break all promises. They just haven't promised anything. The fact is, this IS what happens when you're dealing with a combination of new architectures, SoC, Silicon, etc. People like you who are purely consumers need to take a chill pill. You don't have any understanding of what the process is like.

Pandora devs aren't here to make you happy Chad. Get over it. The world doesn't revolve around you.
You don't say? Really? I don't see what that has to do with anything. Fact is - there's a very good chance I'm not going to buy the thing. Making me happy and revolving around me doesn't have anything to do with this conversation. Get over it, Megamixman. Stop talking about crap you don't know anything about.

You say Craig never made promises - I've given at least 2 quoted examples of where he did exactly that, and broke them both.

Do you know how many idiots stood up and defended the Fantom team? How about the Duke Nukem Forever team? They both had blurry photos, half-assed "working demos" and beta versions. And yet, 10 years later, (for Duke Nukem at least) there is no product.

The first "we're shooting for a ____ release" was February ... of 2008. The Pandora team (at some point) thought (or at least lied and told us they thought) it was possible to have a keyboard, wifi, touchscreen, usb, ARM powered device 6 months ago. So whatever crap you're spewing out about it not having all these features doesn't make a bit of sense. The only feature they've added since I've been following this thing (which was in Feb or March, I believe) was BlueTooth. All the other features (Wifi, touchscreen, keyboard, etc.) were already a part of the design.

Don't try to rewrite history. Don't make this about me. It's not about me. Never has been. Everyone sets me up like some kind of strawman. I find it funny at times and maddeningly annoying at other times. Who cares if I'm an idiot, a whiny baby, or whatever insult-of-the-week you want to throw at me. That doesn't change the fact that the Pandora team hasn't delivered a thing since those few dev units they sent out months ago. And, apparently, those neither worked properly, nor come close to the so-called "final design" that they are "feverishly working on day and night in order to meet their non-deadline deadlines."

Nobody knows what the keyboard is going to (maybe?) look like. Nobody knows what the GUI that was supposed to be demoed 3 months ago looks like. Nobody has seen one actually work in the case. Nobody has any kind of idea when the thing will ship (if ever). Nobody has seen it do anything. All those demo videos people point to are on Mk0 units, which, as I already stated are completely different from the hypothetical Mk1 units - and didn't even function as a completed unit themselves.

First Feb/Mar - then Apr/May - then June/July - then August - now NOVEMBER? And that was before this Neon bug garbage.

There's no way I'd preorder with their floating released date. If you've got $330 or whatever it cost in your currency to have floating in the ether for untold months - cograts! I don't have that kind of money to throw away on a product that has the consistency of Schroeder's cat.

In case you missed it - yes, I am straight up calling the Pandora Vaporware. It meets all the guidelines for the term. And it will up until the day when and if it actually appears in the hands of consumers.

Make fun of me all you want. Until you have a Pandora in your hands, you know I'm right. Make all the excuses you want. The fact is, if so much of this is out of their hands - how in the world do you expect them to deliever at all? And if they do, how do you expect them to honor the "we'll replace it if it doesn't work" guarrentee. Are you going to be just as patient and understanding when it takes them 2, no 3, oops, sorry - vendor feel through - make that 5, crap! Damn FedEx! 7 - okay, there's a new bug - um 9... Months to replace your Pandora that you pre-ordered 2 months before it came out.

Like I said, I doubt I'll get one. I know for a fact I won't pre-order.

Prove me wrong. Please. I'll be happy to eat crow as I'm watching the election results come in on my RSS feed reader on my shiny new Pandora. (US Presidential elections are in November, in case you didn't get the reference.) But I highly, highly doubt that will happen.

 

[ashdjones]

I think the above poster is entitled to his opinion, and to express it, but he seems to have gone too far now in my opinion.

 

[CronoTriggerfan]

I think the above poster is entitled to his opinion, and to express it, but he seems to have gone too far now.

Can you blame him? Not that I agree with what he's saying (to a degree I do), but the people who are lashing back with such venom are just as bad as he is. I find it ironic that if anyone will get banned due to this, it'll be Chad, when in all actuality there are a number of people who, during the course of this discussion, have been even bigger douches. Really, I haven't encountered an argument here that hasn't turned into some angry, crap-spewing thread. Look at it now, there's TWO threads that have turned into it.

Ideologically, those of you who would wait forever for Pandora are just as bad as people who abandon it at the first sign of waiting. It's the extreme end of the spectrum either way, and it's really starting to piss me off. Makes this forum not very fun.