The collapse is coming... one way or an other

Djoga'Ro

moonstruck
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Apr 3, 2016
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There's one made in Germany, probably doomed?
That's a great idea. Everybody I know already tries not to leave their car in the shade. Might as well use that sunlight.
 

kuru

Laptop und Trachtenjanker
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Yeah. Wish I had some money to pump into that project. I'd rather give it to those guys than any of the VW-Audi-Porsche etc. scumbags.
 
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PowerGod

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Anything that isn't a bloody Autobahnbatteriepanzer gets my vote.
Everything depends on the use case.
If I have to get a car just to use it in my city, then I'll just use a bicycle... and that definitely depends on how big is the city you are in, because if you need to travel too far with a car like that, there must be recharge stations during the route, and in most countries these things are still difficult to find / offers only slow recharge (like 24h for a charge) / doesn't accept common payment methods (credit cards and so on), and you'll have to make contracts with every distributor in every city...
I just hope for some good regulations on the matter in the next years...
 

levi

Still fresh, damnit!
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I think talk of 24h charge cycles is a bit FUD-like. Even the old Chevrolet Volt supported CCS charging, which would fill the battery from completely flat in about 3h as I understand it. Certainly if you plugged it in at home overnight, it'd be 100% by the morning.

In terms of top up charging while you're on the move, most people only charge to 80% or something, because the last 20% takes almost as long as the first 80%. But yeah, being signed up to use a specific charger and them not accepting new signups with a credit card I believe is still a problem, assuming you don't have a Tesla, where they've largely worked these things out already and built enough chargers for their current owners and more.

And I think most electric cars built in the past 20 years could manage a trip from one edge of London and back. If I simplify the shape of Greater London to a circle, it's radius would be 22km, so a trip from one edge across a diamater and back would be 88km, which is well within the range of a Bolt or an original Leaf, although an inefficient road layout will have an effect on the distance. But I think it's safe to say it's only when travelling between cities that you might need to consider stopping on the way for a top up, but one of the benefits on electic cars is that you can set off in the morning with 100%, unlike a petroleum car where you need to go to a station to fill up, and if that's not exactly on your way then it involved a detour. Most electric top up stations are on the motorway network, as far as I've seen.
 

PowerGod

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I think talk of 24h charge cycles is a bit FUD-like. Even the old Chevrolet Volt supported CCS charging, which would fill the battery from completely flat in about 3h as I understand it.
Yeah, IF the charging station supports it too, and most the the ones that were placed because of national funds were not so advanced, but are still in place instead of better ones...
 

ible

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charging infrastructure is one big advantage to Tesla -- navigation will tell you when/where to stop when you put in somewhere too far, so you don't even have to think about it* -- though the 3rd-party chargers are welcome. some car companies are complaining that infrastructure solutions do not exist, but are doing nothing to create new charge points. but lack of infrastructure certainly hinders adoption.

* at least on well-traveled routes. i drove up from Mountain View, CA, to Seattle, WA, with no problems. lowest battery at 11% for one particularly long stretch.
 

sebt3

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This is how your electric cars are made.
Electric car does polute do be build (and a lot) even if just because of the batteries (not counting the metal work, since any oil based car would be the same here). Oh by the way, it depend on child labor...

My initial point was : there's no way out. If we ever manage to fix one side of the problem, fixing it would make the other side way worst
 

Kev2442

Still French
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42 (Loire) is the answer.
I don't think it's just a matter of technology. We need to change our way of life as well. We need to stop producing useless stuff to fill needs that we artificially create. We need to stop considering that maximizing the use of resources and human labor is the way forward.
Yeah that. While cars definitely are better efficiency/pollution -wise now, most of our everyday stuff is plenty sufficient for our needs. Including electronics. Software optimization can go a long way to mitigate obsolete tech. We know that better than most thanks to the Pandora. But multi-platform and economical software development is the norm (for a reason after all).

So let's stop buying new, and focus on durable/second-hand objects... after we get our Pyras, of course. :p

A few years ago I came across Jacque Fresco and his resource-based economy. This could be one of the ways out. The biggest problem is that to make a significant change, we'll have to work against human nature. Most individuals are greedy in some way. We'd have to enforce a collectivism of rationalized decisions first. Then we can do something about the issues we're facing. As long as we live in a materialist world, and it is oriented towards individual profit, we can't overthrow the forces at hand without a miracle (collective epiphany or divine intervention, whichever you'll find most likely).

The miracle of the Internet is that we now know : everyone of us think they aren't big enough to make a change.
 

ible

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This is how your electric cars are made.
Electric car does polute do be build (and a lot) even if just because of the batteries (not counting the metal work, since any oil based car would be the same here).
it's true that EVs produce more emissions to build than gas cars, but they more than make up for it over the lifetime of the vehicle. lifetime emissions matter more, obviously :). like i said earlier, emissions to produce electric vehicles will also decrease over time as the grid becomes cleaner. companies that use renewable energy to create their batteries also make a difference (Asia doesn't do this like in the US).

Oh by the way, it depend on child labor...

My initial point was : there's no way out. If we ever manage to fix one side of the problem, fixing it would make the other side way worst
it's odd to single out electric cars when most of modern lifestyle involves child labor. let's agree to get that down to zero, of course, but let's not pretend gas cars are better in this regard.

i'm generally optimistic that we can fix things as we go. of course new problems will arise, but that's how it always is. resolving to just stop solving problems because we will always have them is a bit fatalistic.
 

comradekingu

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They also make up for it in lowering that very number since it is getting more efficient, and not buying into the industry of ICE-based repairs.

Electric cars that are not owned by the grid, and ideally autonomous has a chance of competing with bicycles. The idea of one person in a car, that is parked most of the time doesn't work better because that car is electric.
 
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