Paypal?


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MDave said:
It's not you who has to pay more if you use paypal, its the seller. Unless the extra cost is passed to the customer instead. https://www.paypal.com/us/cgi-bin/webscr?cm...&countries= . Now for 3000 units at £200 / $330 each, thats a quite a chunk paypal is taking away. Sellers would either have to increase the price to make up for the extra cost, passing the cost to the customers, or not use paypal at all saving money for either side. Fingers crossed Craig gets something sorted out with paypal though so paypal don't charge extra fees.

I don't think the discussion is getting out of hand, btw. I think it's a rather healthy and informing one for those misinformed. ;)

EDIT: Typo fixes.

I'm 100% aware of that, but you're missing my point. I'm saying that as a buyer, I'd be willing to pay extra to make up for the seller's fees of buying via PayPal. Do you see my point now? Perhaps I should've made it more clear. :p

Chip, I understand why people don't like PayPal, but that's not the issue at hand. The issue is whether or not it should be used as a payment option, and being a major proprietor of online transactions, they should be. The only substantive issue with allowing PayPal as a payment option that anyone has been able to come up with up to this point is that there are extra seller's fees for Craig and Co., but as myself, Tom', and others have pointed out, there could easily be a small price-hike when paying via PayPal to make up for these fees. Why is that such an outrageous request?

To clarify, I'm NOT trying to attack anyone here personally, you guys are all cool in my book. :D I'm just trying to find out why there's so much disdain for something that won't affect you. I mean, if PayPal were a payment option, it's not like all the "haters" would have to use it, no?
 
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b._.o._.b

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craigix said:
We do accept it but as Squidge said the problem is they have a habit of suspending accounts if you get too much in them. But I'll give them a call and see what I can arrange (if they actually have a phone line).
Finally the oracle has spoken!

You can call paypal but I think they respond pretty fast by mail as well.
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_contact-phone

I don't mind paying extra for the paypal service. Buying a creditcard will cost me probably 30 Euro / year. We don't have free creditcards in the Netherlands.
Would be nice if you could let us know on short notice, so we non-creditcard users can get one before the 30th if paypal will not be an option. Thanks!
 
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Azure

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CronoTriggerfan, it would be against PayPal's User Agreement if Craig charged people more just for using PayPal.

QUOTE
4.6 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions.
 

MDave

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Azure said:
CronoTriggerfan, it would be against PayPal's User Agreement if Craig charged people more just for using PayPal.

QUOTE
4.6 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions.
Ouch, thats a major bite in the ass. Why would paypal have such a thing in place? People better start getting ready for other ways of paying then.
 
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Chip

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CronoTriggerfan said:
The only substantive issue with allowing PayPal as a payment option that anyone has been able to come up with up to this point is that there are extra seller's fees for Craig and Co., but as myself, Tom', and others have pointed out, there could easily be a small price-hike when paying via PayPal to make up for these fees. Why is that such an outrageous request?

The bigger reason is the one that Craig mentioned himself. Paypal can and does arbitrarily lock accounts, preventing you from retrieving your money. If 500 people buy Pandoras with Paypal and they lock the account for "Suspicion of fraudulent activity", that's $165K down the tubes. There might not be any Pandoras with a loss like that.

Looks like MDave beat me to the punch with another of Paypal's absurd restrictions. They don't allow sellers to backcharge customers for the Paypal fees. That money has to come out of the seller's pocket.

So like I said, your best course of action is to investigate a more legitimate means of payment. I'd suggest you withdraw your funds from Paypal and set up a bank transfer, but Paypal would likely take 2-3 weeks to give you your money :(
 
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Well, damn, this looks like it's going to be increasingly difficult... :( Would one of those Visa gift cards work as payment, and if so, would it be possible to buy one directly with the money in my PayPal account? I mean, I'm still praying Craig can offer PayPal, as I really don't think the service is as dystopian as you're making it out to be, but I understand the complaints.
 

Prometheus

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CronoTriggerfan said:
Would one of those Visa gift cards work as payment, and if so, would it be possible to buy one directly with the money in my PayPal account?
If you're meaning one of those top-up'able pre-paid MasterCard/Visa debit cards, GunPei2X's post here seems to shed a bit of light on that issue, with a quote from an article on the beasties, which mentions that some of them can be topped up via PayPal. Might be worth a look.

EDIT: The article linked by GunPei2X also has a link to rundowns of the various cards available, which will probably help, too.
 
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Blah

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Those visa gift cards aren't bad and provide a little extra security, too. Just don't get one from Green Dot as they're a pain in the ass to deal with. Get one from a real bank.
 

Perky_Goth

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craig, I know how much paypal sucks (and I'd like to have a fight over whether the other internet love child (godaddy) is worse) and if others won't give you money, I certainly will.
As long as it doesn't have shit for controls like the gp2x... such a waste, since I never got used to it... OTOH, I have no excuse to not try and dpad-mod it now...

(back to lurking... love the community, but got tired of the gp2x and, well, some of the discussions)
 

Megamixman

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Prometheus said:
CronoTriggerfan said:
Would one of those Visa gift cards work as payment, and if so, would it be possible to buy one directly with the money in my PayPal account?
If you're meaning one of those top-up'able pre-paid MasterCard/Visa debit cards, GunPei2X's post here seems to shed a bit of light on that issue, with a quote from an article on the beasties, which mentions that some of them can be topped up via PayPal. Might be worth a look.

EDIT: The article linked by GunPei2X also has a link to rundowns of the various cards available, which will probably help, too.



I believe paypal themselves offers something similar. In the end those cards have to act the same, so it should be fine. You dont HAVE to go to a bank of the gift cards. Most major retailers are now in the business of selling them as well.
 
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b._.o._.b

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For people in the Netherlands: if you are ANWB member you can get a VISA or Master card for 11,50 E.
I will call them tomorrow and find out if it is possible to receive a card before the 30th.
 

kanzlr

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the reason why sellers are not allowed to charge buyers for using paypal is the same that credit card companies (Eurocard/Mastercard/Visa/etc.) state: if it costs more, buyers often won't use it. that would mean a loss for the credit card companies and paypal. it is as easy as that.

regarding the account freezing: I had my account frozen for 4 months because i received a few small payments (10 or so) that summed up to € 2000,--

PayPal told me they will only re-open it if i send them my power-bill to confirm my name/adress (!!!!).
I did that three times and I wrote more than just a few mails to their support. You know what? I couldn't use paypal during that 1/3rd of a year. bad for my eBay business.

I fully understand craigix on this.
 
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kanzlr said:
PayPal told me they will only re-open it if i send them my power-bill to confirm my name/adress (!!!!).
I did that three times and I wrote more than just a few mails to their support. You know what? I couldn't use paypal during that 1/3rd of a year. bad for my eBay business.

I fully understand craigix on this.

That's a bad situation and all, but how does it affect you if PayPal is an offered payment option? No one's forcing you to use it. If your account is locked up, you're not going to be able to send money anyways, PayPal doesn't just freeze accounts mid-transaction, as many here are trying to say.
 
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gaterooze

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CronoTriggerfan said:
That's a bad situation and all, but how does it affect you if PayPal is an offered payment option? No one's forcing you to use it. If your account is locked up, you're not going to be able to send money anyways, PayPal doesn't just freeze accounts mid-transaction, as many here are trying to say.
Let's say craigix gets 1,000 orders through Paypal, that's $330,000 -- and Paypal locks the account before the money can be withdrawn. What if they need that cash to fund production of the Pandora materials? The whole venture would be screwed. No Pandoras for anyone.
 
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cosurgi

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Craig, please jut make sure that you are using some reliable, well tested service for online payments. Not some crappy, little known service :)

Please make sure that VISA is supported, I'll get very upset if it turns out that I can't pay with my visa :)
 

joa

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a daft topic, get someone to pay for you and pay them back....

obvious ;)
 

Squidge

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kanzlr said:
the reason why sellers are not allowed to charge buyers for using paypal is the same that credit card companies (Eurocard/Mastercard/Visa/etc.) state: if it costs more, buyers often won't use it. that would mean a loss for the credit card companies and paypal. it is as easy as that.
My local garage, corner shop, and several other shops near me all charge between 2% and 3% of the total transaction value if you pay with a credit card, or 50p if you use a debit card. You are right that people often won't use these methods because of this, but that's exactly what the shops want - the more people that pay cash, the more profits they can make by fiddling the tax books. It's a lot more difficult with electronic transactions as theres a log.

CronoTriggerfan said:
That's a bad situation and all, but how does it affect you if PayPal is an offered payment option? No one's forcing you to use it. If your account is locked up, you're not going to be able to send money anyways, PayPal doesn't just freeze accounts mid-transaction, as many here are trying to say.
Lets turn this around, what if Craigix's account is locked up for 6 months? There could be over a hundred thousand pounds that is completely unusable, but people will still want there Pandoras or a refund. It could bankrupt him.

cosurgi said:
Craig, please jut make sure that you are using some reliable, well tested service for online payments. Not some crappy, little known service :)

Please make sure that VISA is supported, I'll get very upset if it turns out that I can't pay with my visa :)
I suspect he'll be using protx.
 
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satanic virus

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I have bought 2 GP2X's from Craig in the past using PayPal & hope this payment option will be available for the Pandora. If not, I better get my Visa account in order :eek:
 
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