Our New Machine, Pandora

[Turnip]

Eh? So we're not having shoulder buttons now? Practically every console since the SNES has had shoulder buttons. What's the problem?

When was the last time you spotted a PDA with shoulder buttons?


:blink: Who wants a gaming PDA anyway? Have you done any market reserch at all? Can you tell me how many other gaming handhelds that havent been 100% dedicated games machenes have been succsessful? (apart from phone's, adding a phone would work.) If you think that adding some flimsly little pull out keyboard is going to increase its appeal to gamers your wrong. Your suggestion that it shouldent have shoulder buttons and be more PDA like further displays that you have no understanding of what will sell and what wont. Get a grip.

 

[Tobriand]

Something tells me Squidge isn't serious about no shoulder buttons... not least because the ones on both the 2x and the gp32 were so useful. I just can't see it...

 

[Squidge]

I never said it wouldn't have shoulder buttons, I just replied to Billy Lee's seemingly random post, asking a question (since we are unsure of whether this thing is a PDA, Console, or combination. I'm betting on the later)

 

[Turnip]

I never said it wouldn't have shoulder buttons, I just replied to Billy Lee's seemingly random post, asking a question (since we are unsure of whether this thing is a PDA, Console, or combination. I'm betting on the later)

Fair enough.

My feeling is that it should be a console 1st, PDA distant, distant second if at all.

 

[prairiefire]

Yeah but no one is going to buy it for the multimedia capabilities.

My GP2X is sufficient for the retro games I play, but I'd seriously consider buying this for it's multimedia and PDA capabilities. I don't just use my 2X for games, I've made great use of the video player on flights and gmu for any time i'm on a road trip. I see this carrying on with the new device.

 

[Tobriand]

I must say, I'm getting to the stage where I'd be more and more appreciative of PDA-esque abilities. Ok, it should definitely be a gaming device first a foremost, but don't go against PDA-like functions just because all other PDAs have been really bad at gaming.

All that has to be done is to make sure this one is designed with gaming in mind first and PDA things second.

Oh, and the whole keyboard debate thing, definitely in favour of a keyboard, and only for gaming purposes. The lack of a keyboard has always been a serious reason for me not to get into Amiga, ST, and C64 emulation, let alone things like text adventures and FreeSCI/Sarien...

 

[supaimposter]

£199 is a real good price , i dont want to buy a machine that is only just better than the GP2X , i wanna see a real leap farward.
Please try and use the latest tech , i want a handheld that will kick the arse of anything else.

 

[jmetal88]

So without the VAT this thing would come to about $333? I would pay that, definitely, although it would dissuade me from buying at launch and I would probably wait a month or so.

 

[prairiefire]

I'm really glad that this is being developed.

Take a look back at 2001 when the ipod was first released for $400 for an mp3 player. Many people on the mac forum showed scepticism and doomed the ipod to "obvious" failure. Some people showed excitment too. It sort of goes to show you that you never can tell how successful something will be, before it's launched.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=500

It's interesting to read this and compare with "our new machine"

 

[Exophase]

As far as I'm concerned, I don't see a good reason why it can't excel at being both a gaming device and a PocketPC like device that does more routine things. I think the biggest reason why we haven't seen things like this is not because it's difficult or even really more expensive, but because the big devs are trying to target specific markets.

They probably see the PDA buying crowd as adults and the game playing crowd as kids. Of course these days that's not true, and a lot of adults want a PDA that can emulate old games comfortably too.

Only device I know of to really push this properly was the Zodiac. Its failure might have scared others off, but I think it was a good idea with some big mistakes thrown in.

 

[Turnip]

As far as I'm concerned, I don't see a good reason why it can't excel at being both a gaming device and a PocketPC like device that does more routine things. I think the biggest reason why we haven't seen things like this is not because it's difficult or even really more expensive, but because the big devs are trying to target specific markets.

They probably see the PDA buying crowd as adults and the game playing crowd as kids. Of course these days that's not true, and a lot of adults want a PDA that can emulate old games comfortably too.

Only device I know of to really push this properly was the Zodiac. Its failure might have scared others off, but I think it was a good idea with some big mistakes thrown in.

There's only a problem having as a pocket pc if that gets in the way of the gaming controls, such as not having shoulder buttons. It should look and feel like a games console, not a PDA, because PDA's are boring.

 

[Orkie]

Why would it? All you need for a PDA is a touchscreen, and the keyboard is nice too.

 

[0-bake]

Ah, i don't like these Hybrids.
Handhelds are for gaming, mp3-players are for music and PDAs are for PDA stuff.

I don't like to carry my handheld to listen to music nor would i like to take my handheld to do some serious stuff like calendar, dates, notes, etc.
Thats why i never used internet on my PSP. Why should i use internet on such a device? Thats what a PC/Laptop is made for. The PSP would mean minor capabilities or a compromise.
What can top the comfort of a (i don't wanna start a mp3-player war) mp3-player? The PSP? The NDS? The new machine? I don't think so. a tiny device just for listening music is already perfect. I don't need a bigger, heavier and slower (booting) device for it.

If you want to use a handheld for other stuff like gaming, do it. But please don't design a gaming machine for beeing a second choice buisiness PDA or a second choice mp3-player.

 

[Turnip]

Why would it? All you need for a PDA is a touchscreen, and the keyboard is nice too.

I didnt say it would I said if it did. And the keyboard really should be detatchable...

 

[J201605]

theres no way to realistically do that... there are some ideas that just couldn't really be implemented that keep getting thrown out like the hybrid dpad and joystick. If it was detachable then the unit would fall over if you tried to prop it up like a laptop. Even if you had a stand which would just make it completely ridiculous then you could only use it seated and not for quick aim messaging or for text entry in games while your standing up.

 

[Turnip]

theres no way to realistically do that... there are some ideas that just couldn't really be implemented that keep getting thrown out like the hybrid dpad and joystick. If it was detachable then the unit would fall over if you tried to prop it up like a laptop. Even if you had a stand which would just make it completely ridiculous then you could only use it seated and not for quick aim messaging or for text entry in games while your standing up.

Ive seen phones with detatchable keyboards. The way you stop them falling over is by holding them in your hands.

B)

 

[Exophase]

As far as I'm concerned, I don't see a good reason why it can't excel at being both a gaming device and a PocketPC like device that does more routine things. I think the biggest reason why we haven't seen things like this is not because it's difficult or even really more expensive, but because the big devs are trying to target specific markets.

They probably see the PDA buying crowd as adults and the game playing crowd as kids. Of course these days that's not true, and a lot of adults want a PDA that can emulate old games comfortably too.

Only device I know of to really push this properly was the Zodiac. Its failure might have scared others off, but I think it was a good idea with some big mistakes thrown in.

There's only a problem having as a pocket pc if that gets in the way of the gaming controls, such as not having shoulder buttons. It should look and feel like a games console, not a PDA, because PDA's are boring.


PDAs are boring because they pretty much all follow the same design (hell, they even use that same pathetic square d-pad thing in like every PocketPC and UMPC ever made). I guess one of the other things is that PDAs are supposed to be portrait friendly, but since DaveC really wants that for games too..

 

[God Ginrai]

You could always add gp32 style tits

It would also make the unit more comfortable to hold

That looks pretty awesome. If they DID decide to add extra shoulders, I'd like it to be this way.

@JackD: You could have little stand things that come out of the non-keyboard part of the console and it would work, it would prop it up, as long as it's designed right.

-God Ginrai

 

[Vorporeal]

So, I read through most of the 78 pages of this thread. I found a lot of good, interesting, functional ideas; I also found a lot of flaming and arrogant bullshit. I came up with a (in my opinion) decent idea for layout of the d-pad/analog stick.

Someone mentioned this, but I feel like it could be reiterated and adjusted.

D
D A D
D

The buttons on the d-pad would surround the analog stick, as shown. To make sure that the buttons and the stick don't get in the way of each other, there would need to be some spacing between the buttons and the stick. The shortened distance between the d-pad buttons and the analog stick would make for easier, smoother control when playing a game that used both (like some PSX games). Also, to alleviate issues with the analog stick protruding from the surface of the system too far, the possibility of a slightly recessed analog stick should be considered, one where the "stick" is recessed into the device so that the pad your thumb is placed on is nearly level with the surface of the device (possibly slightly higher).

Thoughts?

 

[Yrx]

So, I read through most of the 78 pages of this thread. I found a lot of good, interesting, functional ideas; I also found a lot of flaming and arrogant bullshit. I came up with a (in my opinion) decent idea for layout of the d-pad/analog stick.

Someone mentioned this, but I feel like it could be reiterated and adjusted.

D
D A D
D

The buttons on the d-pad would surround the analog stick, as shown. To make sure that the buttons and the stick don't get in the way of each other, there would need to be some spacing between the buttons and the stick. The shortened distance between the d-pad buttons and the analog stick would make for easier, smoother control when playing a game that used both (like some PSX games). Also, to alleviate issues with the analog stick protruding from the surface of the system too far, the possibility of a slightly recessed analog stick should be considered, one where the "stick" is recessed into the device so that the pad your thumb is placed on is nearly level with the surface of the device (possibly slightly higher).

Thoughts?

I thought this would be cool, but it would be really hard to engineer, at least if the d-pad is going to remain a d-pad (as opposed to PSP d-buttons).

In the end, they'll figure something out that works, so I guess til then...