Our New Machine, Pandora

[andmaz]

£200 is about right especially with the power this SOC will hopefully give.

Look at the Tapwave Zodiac - it was £350 at launch with significantly less power and potential - I personaly bougth it for £165 without a second thought - did not buy before as was already very happy with my GP32 (I still have and use both).

 

[realyst]

I'm sure craig is counting on sales in america.

Why? Most of the GP2X owners seem to be in Eurasia.




Hey hey hey! Canada here! Ya know, Britain's bastard child with the large land mass

But hey, I actually like the OMAP price point so far

 

[A_SN]

$400 is way too much.

$400 may be too much, but -L-200 isn't. Things cost more over here, that is a very reasonable price for such a powerful machine. Since most of the GP2X community seems to be European, American-style ultra-cheap pricing isn't that important.

hehehe... Ya, it's definitely a matter of perspective... $400 is more than twice the cost of a PSP in North America, but only -L-40 more than a PSP in Europe - quite a difference, no? But I don't think most of the North American market for this system will balk too badly at a $400 price tag, if the system lives up to its incredible promise. The design is really, really going to be important, tho'... You could never sell a GP2X for $400, no matter how powerful the system inside was - it's too ugly to be an "object of desire". But look at Apple: they package a crap cell with a $200 iPod, give it an uber-slick design and they can't keep the things on the shelves at $500 a piece. Make it beautiful as well as powerful, and you will sell them.

To fusion_power : It's not the software that makes such a device's value, it's its potential. A powerful machine with no software but with a large touchscreen, wifi and good controls, etc.. is worth more than a limited machine (say, an Apple Macintosh from 1993) with a lot of software to it.

This isn't true in the "real world" - if you have to produce a report or surf the internet, a '93 Mac will do you better than a super computer with no browser or text edit software. In the world of gaming, it's well known that you need the software to sell to more than the Hardcore...


Not in the world of homebrew, where people (included yourself) quickly enough port and dev a lot of stuff

 

[naples39]

I think eolair has a pretty good analysis and hits the real issue spot-on of the choice to be made by the makers.

I guess I just have a different approach to this then everyone else. I don't want a 'jackknife' product. The simple fact is that I'd be willing to bet 95% of the readers here are here because of retro games (retro being broadly defined to include psx and n64). I know personally I'm here for that reason.

When you get into all these other functions and higher prices you are competing with a world of other products. Sure the GP2X and craigulator can do mp3s and video, but if I want that, I'm going to use my soon-to-be-purchased 80gb iPod for $250. If I want a networking device with anywhere wifi and other stuff, I'll buy an 8gb iPhone which is coincidentally $400. Or if I really want a full internet/chat/network experience over local wifi I'll just use one of my laptops which I almost always have access to.

What I think most people in this thread fail to appreciate is that they are the most dedicated power users of an already insider crowd, and upping the price and power of the machine is really pushing the craigulator into a different market than the GP2X. Again, that isn't necessarily a bad thing, but you WILL lose existing customers, and that doesn't make them spoiled, or make them silly Americans. If craig can muster any marketing, he'll almost surely gain some other customers too with a powerful jackknife product, but as I said in the first line, the pre-existing market of gp2x users are all here for the primary purpose of retro games and IMO that should be the beginning and end of the conversation when designing the machine.

(It also wouldn't be fair if I didn't mention that the American price now seems to be a significantly reduced $330-ish. That does make it a lot more tempting to me, but still beyond anything I could recommend to a wider audience and any friends.)

So happy birthday Craig, and good luck with whatever decisions you make about the device. To all my other new friends, feel free to flame away. h34r:

 

[Hyperpc]

Using the OMAP chip may result in a system which would be around £199. Opinions?

waaaaa :huh: £ 170 is the highest the handheld should be we don't want it to rival a 360 now or do we? :blink:

 

[X-Code]

At this point, I will suggest that someone sets up a poll

We as users should tell the developers of this new machine what we really want.

I want the OMAP because I'm insane and would love that BRUTAL performance.

BUT. I won't kill myself if we end up with the glorious i.MX31, as it would also make me happy

 

[Hyperpc]

At this point, I will suggest that someone sets up a poll

We as users should tell the developers of this new machine what we really want.

I want the OMAP because I'm insane and would love that BRUTAL performance.

BUT. I won't kill myself if we end up with the glorious i.MX31, as it would also make me happy

We all drooling over this powerMy Webpage but when will this machine come out? Remember the gp2x is slowly dieing so lets hope this wonderful machine comes out soon (2008 max) :rolleyes:

 

[Julius]

199pound (e.g. ~299euro) would be very hard on the limit of what I would be willing to pay. In other words: something like a bad dpad or some other error and it is a no go.

It would help though if the touchscreen was good enough to act as a digital scetch-pad (e.g. several levels of pressure sensitivity and a high input precision).

But actually I would be more likely to buy such a device, than one with the slower chipsets...since the OMAP one could actually be usable as a laptop replacement... the others would be "just a gaming device" (which I kind of "grew" too old for)

edit: Besides... if that would enable DS emulation it would surely be a BIG plus.

edit2: If it was to act as an Laptop replacement it would be really beneficial if there was an inexpensive way to connect a monitor to it (E.g. VGA port or similar), and not just a tv-out!

 

[cappuchok]

On one hand, if it is mainly going to be a homebrew gaming handheld then £199 might seem like too much. But I think the choice would also depend on how much cheaper a i.MX31 based device would be.

*snip*

On the other hand, if this device could replace a real linux handheld computer I would choose the OMAP3430 in all cases. Gaming, music, video, surfing, calender, email, possibly VoIP, etc. For such a device £199 is nothing.

Suggestion: Being able to plug a USB headset with mic into the device would be a great addition (VoIP, voice recognition, voice recorder, etc)

A very balanced and insightful analysis, I agree 100%. I'm expecting that if this device (as for names, how 'bout "VersaTile" (playing on the "brick" theme) )does end up with the OMAP3430 at £199, it will be the most powerful and versatile handheld ever, admittedly with a strong focus on emulation and gaming, but nevertheless also so much more than that, and I can't see any other handheld competing with it for years, especially considering it's open nature.

But as someone also said, at £199 the components, sturdiness and build quality had better all be top-notch as it's right at the very edge of what many here say they're willing to pay (myself included).

And yeah, some way of attaching a headset with a mic, or having a built-in one, really opens up a lot of possibilities such as VoIP that would further add to the versatility of the device.

Having said that, I'll be happy with the device whichever of the two chips is chosen, but if it's the i.MX31 the potential and longevity of the device will be considerably less than an OMAP3430-based device, and thus had better be a fair bit cheaper than £199, maybe around £150 (which would, perhaps unfortunately, also make it a direct competitor to the GP2X F-200).

 

[tolax]

As an 'outsider' just hitting this thread via Engadget I think you should go for better specs and a higher price.

I use the DS and PSP for retro gaming.

If this unit was better for emulation that then PSP and had a good webbrowser (let me run runescape for example) and has some useful utilities such as an ebook reader, support for skype etc then I would happily pay $400 for it.

If you really spec out the unit you'll pick up a lot of techy buzz that will get you sales from the CNET/Engadget crowd. Whether that is a bigger niche market than the younger crowd who would baulk at the higher price. I don't know.

Anyway - one vote for a powerful $400 machine.

 

[TelcoLou]

the CNET/Engadget crowd.

 

[Squidge]

I can understand why with comments like this:

QUOTE
the psp is better looking, has a better screen, seems to be much higher quality construction


errr, it's not released yet :blink:

 

[Rivroner]

I can understand why with comments like this:

QUOTE
the psp is better looking, has a better screen, seems to be much higher quality construction


errr, it's not released yet :blink:

We have a Joker in the forum i supposse.

Or can he see the future ? :blink: :lol:

 

[Javacat]

^^^ for anyone interested the Engadget article is here.

 

[kermit]

I have a question for Craigix....

Are you selling this machine at cost or for a profit?

 

[Kowalski_GT-R]

Hi all,

first time poster, but long time lurker on here; I just Thought I'd share my two Eurocents worth....


OMAP3430 at £199+ VAT sounds good enough for me as long as price doesn't inflate during developement. I am 31 and live in Italy.

good work to the devs and bring us that wonderful device....

ciao,

Andre

 

[Goity]

I have a question for Craigix....

Are you selling this machine at cost or for a profit?

It's probably best that he doesn't answer this, but I assume at profit since he needs to live

 

[Squidge]

OMAP3430 at £199+ VAT sounds good enough for me as long as price doesn't inflate during developement. I am 31 and live in Italy.

It's £169.36+VAT (£199 inc vat).

 

[JyCet]

What is the estimation for system with i.MX31 ?

Someone know if ARM Cortex-A8 (65nm) need 300mW @ 600MHz or 1GHz ?

ARM11 need 0.6mW/MHz (130nm) but i.mx31 is in 90nm and freescale write 40% energy save from 130nm to 90nm :s
If so, I suppose AMR11 core of iMX31 need around 192mW @ 532MHz

Edit:
funny ARM920 core need 192mW @ 240MHz
(0.8mW/MHz in 180nm)

 

[atomicthumbs]

^^^ for anyone interested the Engadget article is here.



Hey, the article I submitted made it onto Engadget! And they corrected a few mistakes when I told them about it (not made by GPH, I am not a developre, etc.).