Openpandora Ltd (UK) Struck off email
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Ian J
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Well done that man.
stuart
Member
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Ok - I have now I've filed a court claim. They now have 14 days to respond to that claim but they won't be allowed to strike off the company with a county court claim in progress from a creditor.
If anyone else wants to do this (UK) it can be done online here: https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk and the court fee is £25 which you can add to your claim.
I was hoping to upgrade via ED, just needed to wait to have the funds but the link he sent out is not working now, hopefully there's still a way I can get a Pandora.
I'm doing this because of the principle of the thing. I feel cheated and lied to. If I do end up getting anything back from the legal action I will donate it to the pandora fund.
If anyone else wants to do this (UK) it can be done online here: https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk and the court fee is £25 which you can add to your claim.
I was hoping to upgrade via ED, just needed to wait to have the funds but the link he sent out is not working now, hopefully there's still a way I can get a Pandora.
I'm doing this because of the principle of the thing. I feel cheated and lied to. If I do end up getting anything back from the legal action I will donate it to the pandora fund.
I can bring some light into the CC tunnel, as I also discussed that with an employee from CC this year at the FOSDEM.
It was an issue of both sides.
The CEO of CircuitCo has a similar behaviour than Craig has.
Which means: Promises are being made just to calm down the other party.
You can imagine what that means for the production team and the production itself.
These days, the CEO mainly stays out of production and things work a lot better.
Craig promised parts to be delivered within weeks (he also always did that with the iControlPad...).
Manufacturing companies planned the production and had parts missing - and that quite a few times.
Quite a mess, if you ask me.
CC at one time didn't believe anymore parts would come when they had been told they will.
This lead to the nub issue - remember when the nubs needed to be improved (which took 6 months) and we made the deal with CC to populate all the PCBs upfront, so that they will be finished shortly after the nubs finally arrive?
Well, that's where the CEO came in... he always told us they're producing PCBs (which they didn't do), just to keep us calm.
And when the nubs finally arrived and they started to populate the PCBs again, they were too old and that caused many failures.
CC is to blame for the failures AFTER the nubs arrived. Had they populated the PCBs as promised, they would've worked.
I am also angry for the lies to calm us down.
On the other side, Craig is to blame for promising them parts over and over again that never arrived, so CC got pissed off at one time.
Both Craig and the CEO are pretty good selling people things, but not so good with organizing huge projects.
It was really bad luck - if one of them wouldn't have been like that, things would've been different.
The production is not that expensive though.
It's the parts - and they had been paid upfront by Craig. With 1000 non-working PCBs, that's about 200.000 USD, so a huge loss.
It was an issue of both sides.
The CEO of CircuitCo has a similar behaviour than Craig has.
Which means: Promises are being made just to calm down the other party.
You can imagine what that means for the production team and the production itself.
These days, the CEO mainly stays out of production and things work a lot better.
Craig promised parts to be delivered within weeks (he also always did that with the iControlPad...).
Manufacturing companies planned the production and had parts missing - and that quite a few times.
Quite a mess, if you ask me.
CC at one time didn't believe anymore parts would come when they had been told they will.
This lead to the nub issue - remember when the nubs needed to be improved (which took 6 months) and we made the deal with CC to populate all the PCBs upfront, so that they will be finished shortly after the nubs finally arrive?
Well, that's where the CEO came in... he always told us they're producing PCBs (which they didn't do), just to keep us calm.
And when the nubs finally arrived and they started to populate the PCBs again, they were too old and that caused many failures.
CC is to blame for the failures AFTER the nubs arrived. Had they populated the PCBs as promised, they would've worked.
I am also angry for the lies to calm us down.
On the other side, Craig is to blame for promising them parts over and over again that never arrived, so CC got pissed off at one time.
Both Craig and the CEO are pretty good selling people things, but not so good with organizing huge projects.
It was really bad luck - if one of them wouldn't have been like that, things would've been different.
CC didn't charge for PCBs they haven't delivered, that's true.
The production is not that expensive though.
It's the parts - and they had been paid upfront by Craig. With 1000 non-working PCBs, that's about 200.000 USD, so a huge loss.
Exophase
Nothing good will ever come of Exophase.
Even if CircuitCo didn't charge OpenPandora Ltd for boards not delivered they'd still be out the cost of the parts, which would dwarf the assembly costs CircuitCo would normally charge. Even in the case where it's boards that CircuitCo went ahead and didn't populate due to recognizing oxidization they'd still be out the cost of those PCBs. I would assume they at least sent back the parts for those, if not that's a huge oversight and something Craig should have insisted on. Unless these are all boards that CircuitCo did populate but are holding on having determined they're defective.
If they populated 500-600 boards that were damaged primarily due to PCB oxidization I would hold CircuitCo accountable, unless they reported this to Craig who gave the go-ahead to populate them anyway. But who's to blame for the boards becoming damaged in the first place? Given ED's story, I think that CircuitCo was wrong to claim they were populating boards when they weren't, but why should they have been required to populate them then wait indefinitely for the nubs to arrive? If they negotiated a change in the order so the PCB assembly was done without the nubs and then delivered to the customer that'd be one thing, but I'm alarmed that they'd really agree to keep the boards in their own storage indefinitely. At some point they should have said no and sent them back.
And were the nub contacts themselves not also in risk of oxidization, or did the design make this a non-issue?
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Finally! Nice work Stuart, I'll be interested in hearing your progress.
To everyone else who Craig owes money: Stop listening to the people here who are suggesting Craig might not have/hasn't done anything illegal. Frankly, they have no idea what they're talking about and they're doing you a disservice. File a small claim just like Stuart has done and in addition file your objection to OP UK Ltd being struck off. It's the only way Craig is going to be held to account for anything.
slaeshjag
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Nubs are soldered manually with more flux, and they have bigger, less tightly packed pads.
Oxidation is mainly a problem with fine-pitch BGA packages, as we're talking tiny pads at .5 mm spacing. This is where bad solder wetting really causes havoc.
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vcoleiro1
Hardcore Member
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I've always wondered about that story re CC not populating the boards until the nubs came. ED, is that something your aware of directly via comms with CC, or via Craig?. Are you sure Craig asked them to do it? - Just to clarify , not saying anything either way
Secondly. I remember Craig making a comment one day along the lines that he had made a cut price deal with CC to populate the boards , and at the low price agreed, they would do the population during times when they had no other work.. I've always thought this could have attributed to the issue.
Secondly. I remember Craig making a comment one day along the lines that he had made a cut price deal with CC to populate the boards , and at the low price agreed, they would do the population during times when they had no other work.. I've always thought this could have attributed to the issue.
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With an employee from CC this year at FOSDEM.
I was communicating with CC back when the nub issue happened (it was the first time I talked with them), therefore I know they lied to me (they confirmed to me PCBs are in production).
On the other side, I've experienced myself with Craig when I organized the iCP manufacturing in Germany that parts didn't come when he promised them.
GC had to move the production date a few times because of missing parts.
So I KNOW CC lied to us, and I have no reason to not believe they didn't get the parts when they were announced, as I had the same experience later.
It all made sense what that guy told me.
Wrath Of Khan
Soul soother...
Id pretty much figured that cc didnt get certain parts in time and craig just lied about it. Based on the icp2 stuff.
Hồng Thất Công
Đả Cẩu Bổng Pháp
Hmmm.. I don't know about this. Maybe the entire banking industry is run by...the cops that's why they are not chasing after themselves
A bit... yes...
ExquisiteCorpse
Member
What actually happened with the icp2?
As fair as I can tell, Craig failed to manufacture the cases and swivel clamps and never ordered the nubs, keymats, dome stickers etc etc and he is refusing to account for the money. It's a pretty safe assumption he blew the cash and has nothing to show for it.
I considered this, but I emailed about it and they said that I needed to have an address in the UK. Do you have an address in the UK, or did you find some way around that?
stuart
Member
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- Jun 2, 2010
- Messages
- 93
@Linopoly I'm in the UK, I should think it is trickier if you are not. A USA company shut up shop owing me $500 and, although the MD was still contactable I was advised that it would be almost impossible and defiantly not financially worth it to try taking any action.
It's almost certainly a waste of time though.
The LTD company will not have any assets, maybe they've gone because of the issues early on, or maybe they've been moved elsewhere to fund other things, I doubt the HMRC or Companies house can be bothered to investigate.
Sad - I've said it before - Those who thought they were helping by putting up money and being patient, only to become the problem, then to end up with no pandora and no refund. I was going to take advantage of the upgrades that ED generously offered to pre-order customers but I didn't have the funds last month and this month they are no longer available.
Hard not to feel bitter.
It's almost certainly a waste of time though.
The LTD company will not have any assets, maybe they've gone because of the issues early on, or maybe they've been moved elsewhere to fund other things, I doubt the HMRC or Companies house can be bothered to investigate.
Sad - I've said it before - Those who thought they were helping by putting up money and being patient, only to become the problem, then to end up with no pandora and no refund. I was going to take advantage of the upgrades that ED generously offered to pre-order customers but I didn't have the funds last month and this month they are no longer available.
Hard not to feel bitter.
