Beta Galactic Artifact - Release B


The same as Dentrado, i built up everything nicely, press escape by accident, and can start over again. Very frustrating.

Love the game though :D
 
Oh, strange bug during a little Multiplayer. I found the artifact!!! :D
...but nothing happend:



the only left sector contained nothing but one Artifact. The white sign indicated it but when drive the ship over the artifact I didn't won the MP.
My buddy also played with me into the game. He found his artifact ner mine location but we had different destinations. He was able to pic up his artifact and won the game. Somehow my map was different displayed or wrong or something. :(
 
kidrdbz said:
Okay, so my brother and I really enjoy your game, but we ran into a problem...

After about an hour my brother had the location of the artifact narrowed down to the bottom left corner. He kept narrowing it down, until it gave him an area that had no stars... He continued to narrow it down, until the entire map was eliminated from possibly having the artifact...

He was playing a local game using the Windows version.
Rats. I thought I had completely eliminated this. I might have to organize some real testers with debug codes who can dump the information and see where the artifact is. It's possible a certain kind of information is getting wiped out.

I know there is a bug with information right now, the pie wedge problem. It's mentioned in the bug section of the manual. Basically expensive industrial artifacts can't be drawn properly as a pie wedge because the angle of the lines is 22.5 degrees, and the graphics primitives can only draw in integer degrees. The red area is drawn in the wrong place. Though I had assumed that the bug shows too much black area, it might not be true on one side of the pie wedge.

It's also possible that the black area was split, and there's some sliver of space somewhere that's impossible to see on the minimap or zoomed out. I've been caught by that a few times, but it's kind of like answering the "My computer won't turn on!" with "Is your computer unplugged?".

I'm going to assume that there is a glitch that allows a possible way to colour in the whole map, and write some debug code. If the entire map is truly coloured in, I'm going to have the program do a data dump, containing the location of the artifact plus all the information used to colour in the map. If anyone gets that debug code, I *critically* need that data so that I can repair whatever information is getting corrupted.

Might take me a while though. I'll try for Release C.

dentrado said:
Wouldn't it be possible to use signed binaries, so that the server checks the binary and only the official signed binaries can log in to the server?
Possible. How to you ensure the client doesn't lie when transmitting that signature back to the server?

(I'm not saying it's not possible, I've just not thought hard enough about how to pull it off).

If I can figure out a way to release the source without ruining the game for legitimate players, I'll be happy to do so. :) Maybe I'll go ask in the dev forums.

dentrado said:
Is there no way to continue the game after going to the menu? (pressing exit) I see only start local game, no continue. then i clicked (i don't remember on what) and then the game crashed, I was just about to find the artifact.
(and to others frustrated by escape quitting the game). Yes, Escape *should* behave this way, but the main menu is really a placeholder at the moment to allow for the choice between single and multi player, and escape quits the game for good.

Escape used to quit the application... Early on when I showed the game to a friend of mine he hit escape to get out of the alien menu (instead of home or *), and quit completely. I think it's the right key, but there should be some way to continue and possibly (as some have recommended) save single player games.

If you need to put things on hold for a bit, hit P to pause (in single player only).



fusion_power said:
Oh, strange bug during a little Multiplayer. I found the artifact!!! :D
...but nothing happend:

the only left sector contained nothing but one Artifact. The white sign indicated it but when drive the ship over the artifact I didn't won the MP.
My buddy also played with me into the game. He found his artifact ner mine location but we had different destinations. He was able to pic up his artifact and won the game. Somehow my map was different displayed or wrong or something. :(
When you found the artifact, did you get the victory screen?

Did you continue to see your buddy move even after you've won?

When your buddy won, did you see the consolation screen?

The closest thing I can think of is that you lost network connectivity to the server somewhere along the way and your client didn't tell you. I was having a game yesterday that behaved similar to this. Things were going great, I won the game, I got a victory screen, but then nothing happened. I checked and none of the other ships were moving. I checked even closer and the server appeared to had stopped... If I attempted to start a new network game the game would hang (with a tiny bit of the end of "Galactic Aritfact" from the main menu still displayed in the messages box). I restarted the server and all was well.

That being said, the server is still running this morning. If I had to make my best (but likely wrong) guess, there was some kind of hiccup where the server lost your connection somehow.

Now that I think about it, I recall this was the game where the victory screen seemed to flash away too quickly. Maybe that's similar to what you saw. There's a "between_games" boolean variable that checks if a new game is starting.. might be tripping early if there's some kind of network glitch.

If this happens again (to you or anyone here, can you first verify that your opponents are still moving?). When it does happen, can you send me a message and let me know the exact time when you won the game, and what your player name is, and your timezone? (I'm at GMT-8h, west coast north america) I can check the logs to see if/when your ship movement data stopped appearing on the servers.

I need to fix the server first though. I realized yesterday that times are logged to the server as HH:01:SS. Minutes aren't being stored, everything is 01. :) I can count forward from the start of each hour, but it's bloody annoying. :)
 
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Trevor Bradley said:
When you found the artifact, did you get the victory screen?
No victory screen. I found the artifact, moved to the planet but I didn't picked it up.

Trevor Bradley said:
Did you continue to see your buddy move even after you've won?
I saw him on his PC behind me moving near me, I don't know if I still was really online or if I saw him onto my screen moving his ship. He fond the artifact and won the match but it was not at the position where mine was.

Trevor Bradley said:
When your buddy won, did you see the consolation screen?
Possible that the screen appeared, I don't remember that. 60% YES I would say.

My screenshot was taken 8:25 PM West european Timezone (GMT +1h, Germany) but I think I've found the artifact between 8:15 PM and 8:25PM
Would be cool to get a message if there is no connection between the server and the players. The small Map screen makes it impossible to detect if other players are still moving.
Rename the Playername or add a specific name would be aslo great so we know who is actualy playing. Onto the screenshot you can see that I was "Golombek", maybe this helps you to find the bug. :)
 
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QUOTE
(and to others frustrated by escape quitting the game). Yes, Escape *should* behave this way, but the main menu is really a placeholder at the moment to allow for the choice between single and multi player, and escape quits the game for good.

Escape used to quit the application... Early on when I showed the game to a friend of mine he hit escape to get out of the alien menu (instead of home or *), and quit completely. I think it's the right key, but there should be some way to continue and possibly (as some have recommended) save single player games.



Just a simple "Are you sure you want to quit?" dialog box would be sufficient i think. For me anyway.
 
***************************************************

OK, I'm concerned this might get lost in the shuffle of all the bug reports, but I think I'll try this here instead of posting a new thread.

It's really awesome that everyone has been able to try out my game. Some of you genuinely appear to enjoy it. :) Several of you are gung ho on building stories 3, 4 and 5 of the skyscraper, but I have some concerns about getting the foundation in place. There are some serious issues with game balance that I feel I need to resolve, alongside the graphics, chat, and other upgrades people are clamouring for.

Some background: Multiplayer gameplay appears to be presently broken into three phases: Building up your ship (the race for cash and upgrades), the "shopping run" (finding many of the very best artifacts, in a dense region of stars), and the "end game" (trading for information and finding the artifact).

Here are the things that are on *my* mind, and I'd love to hear your opinion on them.

1) The early game, where you build up your ship, takes too long (especially for inexperienced players). It should be somewhat slow, but it can be a real struggle to get your ship upgraded. And there should be some level of reward for those players who only partially upgrade their ship, and head out early in search of information even without everything maxed out. Solutions here might include giving the player more cash at the start of the game, or making early upgrades cost less, or increasing the power of the early ship, or giving the player early access to upgrades before the game starts (say at a marketplace with all possible uprgades), or starting the player close to aliens at game start, or giving the player some marker as to closeby aliens at game start (see 3 below).

2) The end game doesn't take long enough. Players with maxed out ships are too fast, can too quickly race in to their target. Though there is some level of awesomeness in seeing where your opponent is (I've tried to play catchup in 2nd place racing to where the leader was (deducing the artifact was closeby), and that's led to some awesome last minute races. But it's my opinion this phase of the game should be slowed down by some mechanism. Solutions that come to mind are decreasing max ship speed, overall max jump with a fully upgraded ship, some sort of antagonistic force that holds the player back when they're fully upgraded (Pirates *don't* make sense here.. Unless perhaps they hid behind $$$ artifacts.. Hmm).

3) I need to figure out what computer upgrades do. There are a few obvious choices. Computer upgrades increase the distance at which you can see enemy ships. Computers allow you to intercept alien transmissions and steal enemy information as it is received. Computer upgrades allow you to hack into other players computers and steal their pre-existing information. There are a few other nifty suggestions here, such as computers should show your previous flight path, or computers should store the last location of visited Ancient, Industrialist, or Futurist homeworlds. I had some thoughts about computers containing "GPS" information, letting you know the location of alien worlds from afar. But I don't quite have the complete picture in my head as to what works in what balance.

4) I need to figure out what the heck to do with the overview panel, to the left of the minimap. Zoomed in, the star just needs to be cleaned up, that's OK. The idea is that when you talk to aliens, that 160x160 patch of screen will show talking aliens. When you find an artifact, some sort of graphic will show that you've found an artifact. I'm not sure what to do with this screen real estate when you're zoomed out. Having the sector number in there is obvious, but it's not clear what else should be in there. Something to do with the computer upgrades? Some sort of "ship radar"? There's not much space for anything. One other thing.. the fonts used in there are too small for the Pandora screen, so if anything is in there, the font is going to have to be larger (about the size of the message font).

I would really appreciate to hear your ideas on these issues.
 
Ok, so now im getting this error:
error while loading shared libraries: libvga.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

carn't find a Arch package, or the source of that lib tho, only RPM's.
 
Hessiess said:
Ok, so now im getting this error:
error while loading shared libraries: libvga.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

carn't find a Arch package, or the source of that lib tho.
Are all the Linux folks stuck on this libvga issue? I could recompile a dynamic binary, but you'll need...

SDL
SDL_gfx
SpriG
SDL_mixer
SDL_ttf
SDL_image
SDL_net

And with release A people reported all kinds of nasty issues getting SDL_gfx working.

Tell you what. I'll go down to my mythbuntu HTPC downstairs, grab all these packages and make a dynamic build against them. Then it's not going to mess up with the wrong package. You'll need to grab each of these packages and install them to play the game though.
 
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Hey, fix for the libvga issue on ubuntu(8.10):

sudo apt-get install libsvga1

it's working fine for me now :)
 
Yes, the game balance is one important thing. I once started in a really empty area between 2 spiral arms. While my buddy was in an area with many stars and finding one big artifact after another, I traveled through one empty sector after another. :( Without much artifacts or the Aliens for selling and buying stuff you will not be happy there. I had to quit and start again in a better place.
Each Ship should start in an area with at least a useful minimum of Artifacts and Alien Planets.

I find the end phase of the game not too easy, you can spend alot of time even when close to the Price Artifact. thats maybe because I have not found the best searching strategy yet. I wouldn't punisch players for getting in their end-phase. hard restirictions "just to make it not so easy" always killing the fun into a game.
My buddy once found the prize by clicking simply onto the right planet within a good bunch of Planets with artifacts, lucky one :D

Another problem: running out of fuel! AFAIK you can't travel to a planet out of range (red status), which is good. But I think a "yellow" fuel status would be an additional help to travel not too far and then have no more fuel to reach a Alien Planet if you stop in an area without a chance to refill. "Yellow" would indicate, that the destination is still in range but you will only have a small reserve of fuel left when you reach the Planet. The Reserve should be 10-30 Units of fuel maybe, has to be figured out.

I like your Ideas with the Computer Update. with 10 Update stages there are many options. :) It could start that you see the other players (until that, they only appear in a list or so but not onto the mini map). GPS, flight path, showing the route and the type of visited planets, sounds very useful for me and brings more fun into the game. The biggest update could be to steal informations from the other players...pretty useless in Single player but there could be other options for this update maybe.

"overview panel, to the left of the minimap" is not the main priority now I think. The Idea with the Alien faces is nice. The current informations like fuel and distances and coordinates are very useful (at least for me ^_^) and in this window there could be easily includes my Idea of the "yellow" distance/fuel state. Later in the future, the Planet graphics could be pimped and if you have too much time you could include the phantastic "rotating Planet" effect from Star Control 2. ;)

Screeny said:
A German manual is available, too:

http://readme.service.comoj.com/galactic/
enjoy!



Cool! :) I hope it will be always updated when the english version is updated.
 
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Trevor Bradley said:
Hessiess said:
Ok, so now im getting this error:
error while loading shared libraries: libvga.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

carn't find a Arch package, or the source of that lib tho.
Are all the Linux folks stuck on this libvga issue? I could recompile a dynamic binary, but you'll need...

SDL
SDL_gfx
SpriG
SDL_mixer
SDL_ttf
SDL_image
SDL_net

And with release A people reported all kinds of nasty issues getting SDL_gfx working.

Tell you what. I'll go down to my mythbuntu HTPC downstairs, grab all these packages and make a dynamic build against them. Then it's not going to mess up with the wrong package. You'll need to grab each of these packages and install them to play the game though.


Actually the need for large numbers of dependencies is what inspired me to create Quad-Ren, an easy to use 2D API over OpenGL.
I assume that you are using SDL_gfx for scaling?, why not use OpenGL instead, as it seams to be causing compatibility problems.

QUOTE
Hey, fix for the libvga issue on ubuntu(8.10):

sudo apt-get install libsvga1

it's working fine for me now smile.gif


Doesn't work on 64 bit (I have Arch on my 32 bit comp, and Ubuntu 8.04 64 on the outher one)

And would you mind macking a distrobution in Zip ,7z or tar format, The rar extractor on Linux seems to be incapable of maintaining directory structures, and dumps everything into one large messy folder.

I have managed to get this to run, after pinching libvga from the ubuntu deb then shovin it in /usr/lib, and manually sorting out the directory structure.
 
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Trevor Bradley said:
1) The early game, where you build up your ship, takes too long...

2) The end game doesn't take long enough. Players with maxed out ships are too fast...

3) I need to figure out what computer upgrades do...

4) I need to figure out what the heck to do with the overview panel, to the left of the minimap...

I would really appreciate to hear your ideas on these issues.
Ok, so I think Ill give my opinion. Of course disregard if its lame...

1) Yes it does, but then again, without the "grind" at the beginning, I'd feel that I didn't "earn" any of the upgrades at all.

2) True, very true. That's why I seldom go past level 8 or 9 on speed. But I think we do need options, so if we want to spend the money, then sure. I was thinking of a few things that might help; Instead of just giving us the Winning Artifact, maybe you could make a button called "Check for Final Artifact" (or something) then a cut scene of around 5 seconds of searching (possibly similar to my scan graphic) before its over, so at the end, you don't just bounce between planets, you have to be more careful with your time.

3) Well... Computers are a good thing, we all agree, but in space there is a limit to their usefulness. Maybe you can make a "What can I infer from the results of the alien scan" that further narrows down the search. You know, complex simulations run on the computer with the data results of what those aliens gave you, but in reality just a graphic of a few ones and zeros and an analyzer of sorts, then a few small completely random mini-hints are added. Maybe an option to "see the data" at a price after they give you the hint (all of what the sensor reported, not just the obvious answer), then you can use that data with older data to narrow down the search. The faster the computer, the less time it takes, and the more it helps. So with a level 10 computer, after every hint you could re-infer some results in a few seconds. I don't think that was very clear... If you can figure out what that means, then cool :)

2) I like the speed of the game (I can beat it in 8 to 15 minutes now) but if you add little 2 to 3 second graphics for everything, then we can get into the "feel" of what is going on, not just blind speed of fingers and quick thinking. (see my answer for 2, maybe this can happen on every planet, but shorter than for the final artifact)


Ill post this again, I like to look at it :D


 
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Hessiess said:
Actually the need for large numbers of dependencies is what inspired me to create Quad-Ren, an easy to use 2D API over OpenGL.
I assume that you are using SDL_gfx for scaling?, why not use OpenGL instead, as it seams to be causing compatibility problems.

And would you mind macking a distrobution in Zip ,7z or tar format, The rar extractor on Linux seems to be incapable of maintaining directory structures, and dumps everything into one large messy folder.

I have managed to get this to run, after pinching libvga from the ubuntu deb then shovin it in /usr/lib, and manually sorting out the directory structure.
I'm using SDL_gfx for what it was intended for: graphics primitives. I have to draw all those stars somehow, and not all of them are points. Scaling I use SpriG for, as SpriG is way faster than SDL_gfx's rotozoom. I've not decided to convert everything to SpriG (which apparently uses a different colour scheme), or move to OpenGL

Try rar x instead of rar e (or vice versa, I forget which is which) to preserve directory names. Maybe tgz is cross compatible enough for Windows and linux users and I'll try that next time. (Though only a Slackware user would dare say this.. :) (I'll likely go with zip, no worries... :)
 
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fusion_power said:
Yes, the game balance is one important thing. I once started in a really empty area between 2 spiral arms. While my buddy was in an area with many stars and finding one big artifact after another, I traveled through one empty sector after another. :( Without much artifacts or the Aliens for selling and buying stuff you will not be happy there. I had to quit and start again in a better place.
Each Ship should start in an area with at least a useful minimum of Artifacts and Alien Planets.

I find the end phase of the game not too easy, you can spend alot of time even when close to the Price Artifact. thats maybe because I have not found the best searching strategy yet. I wouldn't punisch players for getting in their end-phase. hard restirictions "just to make it not so easy" always killing the fun into a game.
My buddy once found the prize by clicking simply onto the right planet within a good bunch of Planets with artifacts, lucky one :D

Another problem: running out of fuel! AFAIK you can't travel to a planet out of range (red status), which is good. But I think a "yellow" fuel status would be an additional help to travel not too far and then have no more fuel to reach a Alien Planet if you stop in an area without a chance to refill. "Yellow" would indicate, that the destination is still in range but you will only have a small reserve of fuel left when you reach the Planet. The Reserve should be 10-30 Units of fuel maybe, has to be figured out.

I like your Ideas with the Computer Update. with 10 Update stages there are many options. :) It could start that you see the other players (until that, they only appear in a list or so but not onto the mini map). GPS, flight path, showing the route and the type of visited planets, sounds very useful for me and brings more fun into the game. The biggest update could be to steal informations from the other players...pretty useless in Single player but there could be other options for this update maybe.

"overview panel, to the left of the minimap" is not the main priority now I think. The Idea with the Alien faces is nice. The current informations like fuel and distances and coordinates are very useful (at least for me ^_^) and in this window there could be easily includes my Idea of the "yellow" distance/fuel state. Later in the future, the Planet graphics could be pimped and if you have too much time you could include the phantastic "rotating Planet" effect from Star Control 2. ;)
The old random ship start algorithm in Release A sucked. I replaced it with a new algorithm which should place you on a minor arm, 40 to 100% out from the center. It works better, but there's still better starts some places than others. And I believe the Linux randomization using rand is worse than the Windows one. It's probably time for me to extend my pseudo-random number generator (which determines deterministically a "random" position for all the stars) and use it to generate real "random" numbers...

Now that there's a German manual, check out the to-do list. Fuel warnings and fuel circles is top on the list. :)

I'm still thinking of how to organize the computer upgrades. I was thinking you'd only be able to see other players at a certain range. I'll ponder some of these other issues (including tracking your path), and see how they would fit in.

And I know the sector overview shouldn't be a priority, but it's been a nagging thorn in my side. In my notebook from a month ago, I have the various screen interfaces mocked up on paper and there's this big question mark on that part of the screen when the player is zoomed out. I didn't know what to put there then, and still don't know what to put there now. What goes there may be something interesting that affects gameplay (perhaps that thing that boosts play in the early going, and I'd rather figure it out sooner rather than later..
 
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... in other news, I've gone from being desperate for graphics aid to being overwhelmed by it. I've now had offers from (I believe) four people, and I'm torn as to what to do. I'm gratified by the assistance, but I want the game to have a consistent look in design.

In an awesome bit of news (and I don't want to ruin the fun of others who are sending in prototypes like mad), the first person to send me an email offering assistance was Pat Ferguson, who has worked with Ruckage on all of his fantastic GP2X games. He's sent in a replacement for the cargo icons and they're absolutely fantastic.

Pat's not committed to do everything (his time is limited), but I would like people to hold off a bit on prototypes until I can get this all sorted out.

I am starting to work out in my head what's going to happen for Release C, and I'm leaning toward a faster release cycle, only a few changes released sometime next weekend. Chat is high on the features to add. But I'm also going to have to add admin functionality, and the ability to kick rude players. Anyone willing to step up and help me watch over the server? (Not that I'm a puritan -- George Carlin is my hero, but my 11 and 8 year old daughters play this game, and I'm trying to find a balance).

Other features in Release C will likely be better detection of server going offline, and some sort of "blow up" if the screen goes entirely red (which will dump a file detailing all the information, something I'd need to get mailed back to me)... and fixing the high value industrialist data so that it's not incorrect zoomed in.... and likely "stick figure" or placeholder animations for aliens and finding artifacts.

Anything else that should be squeezed in there? Remember, more features means a longer release cycle. (Take a look at the Game Manual, Section 10: Release C and beyond for ideas as to what's critical)
 
Great game!
My suggestion for the graphic part is to develop a GUI (I don't know the precise meaning of this word and so I can't say if it already has one).
The actual interface is too DOS like. I know that you can like it, but a lot of people would like and be more captured by a modern style...
Maybe you can release two versions.
However thank you
 
Trevor Bradley said:
... in other news, I've gone from being desperate for graphics aid to being overwhelmed by it.
right, well then. ops. i wasted time putting this together then...
if you don't like it, oh well, i like the spinning grid thingy though (used c++ opengl for that)


 
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After playing the game, it would be good if ailians didn't hail you if you don't have anything to sell, espetilly early in the game where its hard to tell what a planet has on it. Also, it would be good if this would run full screen.
 
TheMonkey said:
...I can beat it in 8 to 15 minutes now...
:blink: HOW? My best was 28 Minutes in Single Player *sniff* :(

Trevor Bradley said:
Now that there's a German manual, check out the to-do list. Fuel warnings and fuel circles is top on the list. :)
To-Do list isn't translated (yet) but I can read the english list, no problem :)

I don't know how the game is coded but maybe the ships could start only in a region with at least a special number of Artifacts and matching Alien Planets in range

My buddy had the Idea to hide the $$ and $$$ Artifacts at the beginning of the game so you can't easily get a big hint so early in the game. There could be an little update system to find the better artifacts only with upgrading your ship sensors or so but I don't know if the game would be too hard if we only have the small Artifacts at the beginning. It's again all a matter of testing and Game Balance.

Yes, the game would benefit from an good scoring system. Not even the finder of the price can win but maybe there are game modes where you have to make the most money, finding the most artifacts (of a special type) and so on. Could bring much more fun into the game. :)

Another Crazy Fusion_Power Idea: A BLACK HOLE in the middle of the Galaxy! :D At least the Size of the smallest sector and every ship that comes to close (surrounding 8 Sectors) are really in Trouble. This also is a nice obstacle for the advanced players if they decide to travel straight through the galaxy center to reach the Artifact in the opposite corner of the Galaxy or want to farm all the many Stars in the Center of the Galaxy for easy money. :)
The gravity of the hole could effect the ships in a certain range around the hole, maybe they need more fuel to pass the area or the course is effected. I think a good galaxy needs a mean big black hole in the Center! ^_^
 
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