Current Keyboard Layout

[TrashyMG]

Your head must still be spinning from where , and . are then and please don't share what the spacebar is doing to you.

No because they're exactly were they are on the Pandora. 

You do realize having Escape there lets us move both backlight brightness controls to the left side, opposite from where keyboard Fn/Meta is, which is good for those people who won't use the shoulder button Fn/Meta often?

 
Okay so why can't the brightness control end up on the right side? I just don't see how the lack of using the shoulder button FN/meta key would be restrictive if ESC was on the left... 

 If you'd rather press two buttons Fn then q for it though...   

I can live with Fn+Q, That doesn't bug me at all. 

 

[Haraldur]

Fn+Q is just about acceptable for ESC on the Pandora because the Q is a corner key. On the Pyra, that is not the case (at least, on most the the keyboard layouts I have seen). Fn+Q on the Pyra is WORSE than Fn+Q on the Pandora.

 

[TrashyMG]

Fn+Q is just about acceptable for ESC on the Pandora because the Q is a corner key. On the Pyra, that is not the case (at least, on most the the keyboard layouts I have seen). Fn+Q on the Pyra is WORSE than Fn+Q on the Pandora.

True, I just was picturing it in my mind were it is on the Pandora. 

 

[comradekingu]

I see where this is going, nice try Dr. Dvorak.

 

[Saber]

You do realize having Escape there lets us move both backlight brightness controls to the left side, opposite from where keyboard Fn/Meta is, which is good for those people who won't use the shoulder button Fn/Meta often?

 
Okay so why can't the brightness control end up on the right side? I just don't see how the lack of using the shoulder button FN/meta key would be restrictive if ESC was on the left... 

Press Fn(with your right thumb of course) on your Pandora and then reach up to your 8 button and tap it with the same thumb. Now go back down and with your right thumb press Fn again go back up and hit the 9 button. Congratulations, you just changed your keyboard backlight from low to medium. 

Press Fn(again with your right thumb) on your Pandora and then, now with your left thumb, press the 3 button. Now press Fn(with your right thumb) again and press the 4 button(with your left thumb of course). You've now done exactly same thing and changed your keyboard backlight from low to medium but both thumbs have worked as a team in unison.

Sure we could have gone into Fn Lock and used one thumb, but you'd still be traveling your right thumb north to south across the right half(and every single time you'd like to change your backlighting) of your device, if you use just the keyboard Fn/Meta which some are prone to do and if the backlight controls are on the right upper side.  

 

[_wb_]

I only want to toggle the keyboard backlight on or off. I see no use for intermediate brightness levels.

 

[comradekingu]

http://www.hughski.com/colorhugals.html seems more viable if there is a constant need to keep changing backlight, so that you wont actually have to take even a small break from your game.

The only need I see for precision controlling of brightness while you are doing something is fullscreen colour-calibration, which by its nature would be affected by showing the control-panel at the same time.

 

[TrashyMG]

You do realize having Escape there lets us move both backlight brightness controls to the left side, opposite from where keyboard Fn/Meta is, which is good for those people who won't use the shoulder button Fn/Meta often?

 
Okay so why can't the brightness control end up on the right side? I just don't see how the lack of using the shoulder button FN/meta key would be restrictive if ESC was on the left... 

Press Fn(with your right thumb of course) on your Pandora and then reach up to your 8 button and tap it with the same thumb. Now go back down and with your right thumb press Fn again go back up and hit the 9 button. Congratulations, you just changed your keyboard backlight from low to medium. 

Press Fn(again with your right thumb) on your Pandora and then, now with your left thumb, press the 3 button. Now press Fn(with your right thumb) again and press the 4 button(with your left thumb of course). You've now done exactly same thing and changed your keyboard backlight from low to medium but both thumbs have worked as a team in unison.

Sure we could have gone into Fn Lock and used one thumb, but you'd still be traveling your right thumb north to south across the right half(and every single time you'd like to change your backlighting) of your device, if you use just the keyboard Fn/Meta which some are prone to do and if the backlight controls are on the right upper side.  

For one brightness controls are not something that are used so much were this is a big enough deal to care about moving a thumb a little extra distance.... I may even use my left thumb on the right side of the keyboard like I often do on the Pandora. As a vi user I hit the ESC button a LOT, I would like it to be on the side I'd expect it to be... 


The Pandora has a sticky fn button, you hit it once and the next key press will use the fn+whatever... no need to hold it or use fn+lock... However I'm not sure if anything like this will be on the Pyra though...

 

[Saber]

You do realize having Escape there lets us move both backlight brightness controls to the left side, opposite from where keyboard Fn/Meta is, which is good for those people who won't use the shoulder button Fn/Meta often?

 
Okay so why can't the brightness control end up on the right side? I just don't see how the lack of using the shoulder button FN/meta key would be restrictive if ESC was on the left... 

Press Fn(with your right thumb of course) on your Pandora and then reach up to your 8 button and tap it with the same thumb. Now go back down and with your right thumb press Fn again go back up and hit the 9 button. Congratulations, you just changed your keyboard backlight from low to medium. 

Press Fn(again with your right thumb) on your Pandora and then, now with your left thumb, press the 3 button. Now press Fn(with your right thumb) again and press the 4 button(with your left thumb of course). You've now done exactly same thing and changed your keyboard backlight from low to medium but both thumbs have worked as a team in unison.

Sure we could have gone into Fn Lock and used one thumb, but you'd still be traveling your right thumb north to south across the right half(and every single time you'd like to change your backlighting) of your device, if you use just the keyboard Fn/Meta which some are prone to do and if the backlight controls are on the right upper side.  

For one brightness controls are not something that are used so much were this is a big enough deal to care about moving a thumb a little extra distance.... I may even use my left thumb on the right side of the keyboard like I often do on the Pandora. As a vi user I hit the ESC button a LOT, I would like it to be on the side I'd expect it to be...

...

If you can overcome the fact the Pandora , and . and the spacebar are not where you "expected" them to be initially then surely you haven't reached your adaptive threshold and can also adapt to hitting the top uppermost right key versus the top uppermost left key(now with your dominant thumb assuming you are not a lefty). 

As for keyboard backlighting, some will take advantage of this feature and some will ignore it for the most part, but we shouldn't make it more difficult for the former group. 

I only want to toggle the keyboard backlight on or off. I see no use for intermediate brightness levels.

Last I heard there was low, medium, and high. Okay to be wrong though.

 

[TrashyMG]

If you can overcome the fact the Pandora , and . and the spacebar are not where you "expected" them to be initially then surely you haven't reached your adaptive threshold and can also adapt to hitting the top uppermost right key versus the top uppermost left key(now with your dominant thumb assuming you are not a lefty). 

Just put the ESC key on the left. 

 

[Saber]

If you can overcome the fact the Pandora , and . and the spacebar are not where you "expected" them to be initially then surely you haven't reached your adaptive threshold and can also adapt to hitting the top uppermost right key versus the top uppermost left key(now with your dominant thumb assuming you are not a lefty). 

Just put the ESC key on the left. 

Or say to hell with tradition, which doesn't properly apply to a handheld, and keep it on the right for overall ergonomics. 

 

[TrashyMG]

If you can overcome the fact the Pandora , and . and the spacebar are not where you "expected" them to be initially then surely you haven't reached your adaptive threshold and can also adapt to hitting the top uppermost right key versus the top uppermost left key(now with your dominant thumb assuming you are not a lefty). 

Just put the ESC key on the left. 

Or say to hell with tradition, which doesn't properly apply to a handheld, and keep it on the right for overall ergonomics. 

Okay, but we'll see how it turns out when it's voting time.

 

[Saber]

If you can overcome the fact the Pandora , and . and the spacebar are not where you "expected" them to be initially then surely you haven't reached your adaptive threshold and can also adapt to hitting the top uppermost right key versus the top uppermost left key(now with your dominant thumb assuming you are not a lefty). 

Just put the ESC key on the left. 

Or say to hell with tradition, which doesn't properly apply to a handheld, and keep it on the right for overall ergonomics. 

Okay, but we'll see how it turns out when it's voting time.

Voting doesn't concern me as popularity is fleeting after all the cheering is done but the actual work is found to be suboptimal in practice.

As I said, you all will have to live with the layout you've chosen. I won't necessarily be there at the start of it so it won't affect me, but when/if some of these other enhancements I've been reading about make it onto the keyboard, you can thank a lack of participation and foresight into why, as you said earlier, people "haven't thought things through" and these things don't work as well beyond the dreams and polls of solidarity.  

 

[Saber]

If only we could have two keyboard Shift keys...

7.0b: http://i.imgur.com/aCja1yR.png

Spoiler

Or we could remove keyboard R.Shift in 7.0b and put Escape on the key to the left above it and move Tab where keyboard R.Shift was. ( and ) could switch places then with $ and % I suppose.

***Unlike 7.0, please understand this is not an official proposal. Just a brainstorming exercise of what could be. 

 

[pmprog]

I don't get it. Why are people still putting "Left" shift on the right hand side of the keyboard, and "Right" shift on the Left shoulder?

Or in Sabre's above, it's even more stupid by having shift on both sides of the actual keyboards with the left and right on opposites.

 

[TrashyMG]

I don't get it. Why are people still putting "Left" shift on the right hand side of the keyboard, and "Right" shift on the Left shoulder?

Matching Pandora's nuances I suppose?

 

[_wb_]

I don't get it. Why are people still putting "Left" shift on the right hand side of the keyboard, and "Right" shift on the Left shoulder?

Matching Pandora's nuances I suppose?

Yes. On the Pandora, L1 and R1 are RShift and RCtrl, so if we want to be backwards compatible, that's also how it should be on the Pyra.

Note that in my proposal:

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/5c6f3a84973475c04208892efc45ea9f

the keyboard Shift (which is LShift) is on the left, so at least that one makes sense.

Mentally I pronounce the RShift, RCtrl, RAlt, RMeta on the shoulder buttons as "RearShift", "RearCtrl", "RearAlt", "RearMeta"

 

[Saber]

I don't get it. Why are people still putting "Left" shift on the right hand side of the keyboard, and "Right" shift on the Left shoulder?


Or in Sabre's above, it's even more stupid by having shift on both sides of the actual keyboards with the left and right on opposites.

_wb_ answered the first part here so I won't repeat what he said about Right Shift on Left Shoulder. Yes, it follows the Pandora convention.

For the second part where you ignorantly called the fictional layout I posted above stupid because Left Shift with Right Shift are reversed on the keyboard, it's because with two Right Shifts you can't remap one without affecting the other, so by placing Left Shift on the right hand side the buyer is given the option to remap the Left Shift to another key of their choosing(Pause, Print Screen, a localized vowel, or whatever). Understand now?   

 

[comradekingu]

I see a lot of myself in you Saber, for good and bad. Eventually I decided to submit these three:

1. Efficiency     Best English default

2. Convenient  +3 at the cost of +4

3. Doublewide  Because aspiring to ideals and going against them are equally hard.

 

[pmprog]

For the second part where you ignorantly called the fictional layout I posted above stupid because Left Shift with Right Shift are reversed on the keyboard, it's because with two Right Shifts you can't remap one without affecting the other, so by placing Left Shift on the right hand side the buyer is given the option to remap the Left Shift to another key of their choosing(Pause, Print Screen, a localized vowel, or whatever). Understand now?

No, that still makes no sense (to me), but then so does most of these keyboard threads, so carry on anyway... I'll retreat to my hole, and watch for ED's final layout