A physical Dummy, Power Usage and MIPI


comradekingu

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How about making a bigger battery compatible with existing latch holes?

That way people not wanting to lug around that bigger battery can also have a compatible case.

Also if a better battery technology becomes available at the same size its a quick swap and possibly some firmware changes away from working.

Becoming a mipi member is where my quest into things mipi ended. Membership would make sense for testing new screens in the future too.
 

Exophase

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Generic switch mode power supplies at the right voltage and with a range of barrel jack connector bits are usually readily available at hobbyist electronics stores. (at least around here)
Sure, getting one isn't hard per se, but still not as easy as a decent USB based charger.

I remember several years ago I was looking for one at Radio Shack to power my GP2X, but the problem was that most of them didn't put out nearly enough current (commonly just a few hundred mA instead of 1A) The one I had to get that could was not cheap. This case was a little different though, since it used AA batteries there was no way it could boot in some kind of low power mode where it just let you gradually charge the battery.

I find it to be of great benefit to know which of all of my chargers, is the one that has enough to power to charge it while using it, without following the cable down behind my bed to see which one it is.

µUSB some in many variations, and tablets are the only devices that comes with a charger that has comparable output to a PSP charger. And the PMIC will also have to figure out what the safe amount of current is for the charger used. If not, one low quality charger later and you could have a fire. And no, just because you can buy one in a store, it doesn't mean it's safe.

Also, with the market here seemingly flooded with poor quality USB chargers, I don't trust anyone anymore :p
Poor quality chargers are a problem, I agree. That's why I never used the charger that came with my JXD S7300, because it was known to start fires. But that was one with a barrel connector.

Is there a problem still if ED supplies a good microUSB charger instead of a good charger with a barrel connector?

I actually had a bad experience with a barrel connector AC/DC supplies once. I was working on a $20,000 dev board that took 5V input, and right next to it was an FPGA evaluation board that took 12V input. Lo and behold, both used the same barrel socket, and I think you can see where this story is going. Fortunately we only had to replace a blown current protection diode to get the very expensive dev board working again. This might sound like an unlikely cautionary tale but really you always have to be careful that these adapters are the right voltage before using them. With USB connectors you're at least extremely likely to be dealing with 5V or nothing regardless of what's on the other end of that plug.
 
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slaeshjag

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I'm not saying that the barrel jack chargers are immune to the issue. It's just that as they are very big business by now, cheap imported ones do find their way...

If it boils down to one provided by ED; my main issue would probably be that I'm a clumsy fuck who'd use the wrong µUSB lead from time to time :p
 

Neelix

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Is there a problem still if ED supplies a good microUSB charger instead of a good charger with a barrel connector?
 You mean aside from the issue I already mentioned with not being able to use the wall charger and USB slave mode at the same time?

This might sound like an unlikely cautionary tale but really you always have to be careful that these adapters are the right voltage before using them. With USB connectors you're at least extremely likely to be dealing with 5V or nothing regardless of what's on the other end of that plug.
 

@prometheus- the non-standard power adapter (although deceivingly usb compatible) doesn't work off usb ports because it needs like 6-7v or something silly, if you plug in a normal device into the part that plugs into the wall with the usb shaped hole you will blow out your device.. so be careful... ( I love my wife very much )
- Neelix
 
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Exophase

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You mean aside from the issue I already mentioned with not being able to use the wall charger and USB slave mode at the same time?
But I was addressing slaeshjag who said he'd rather have a barrel connector than any microUSB port at all. That compromise kind of makes your problem moot.

@prometheus- the non-standard power adapter (although deceivingly usb compatible) doesn't work off usb ports because it needs like 6-7v or something silly, if you plug in a normal device into the part that plugs into the wall with the usb shaped hole you will blow out your device.. so be careful... ( I love my wife very much )
What was this device? I've never heard of something like this happening. The makers were idiots.

Suffice it to say, with USB you will ALMOST definitely get 5V. With some barrel connector you could be getting anything.
 

matzesu

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Seems like the Simcard Slot, is fullsize, and the Headphone Set on the Back of the System (should be great for the Dock)..

I load my Galaxy Note 2 whit the USB Sharger which came whit the phone, and it works great, so no problem whit USB here..

If the Case will be abble to hold the bigger Batterie whitout problems, i think this shouldnt be a Problem for me..

How long will it last, if i play Tetris ???
 

Askarus

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I wouldnt mind if the Pandora becomes a little bigger to fit a bigger battery.
 

Natsu

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Seems like the Simcard Slot, is fullsize, and the Headphone Set on the Back of the System (should be great for the Dock)..
If that's the case he can sell adapters.
I rather have the phones in front.
 
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thatgui

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As you can see, on the back there are two big USB 2.0 Host Ports as well as a Micro USB 3.0 OTG Port (which will also be used for charging the unit).


Then you can see a Micro HDMI Port and the headphones / headset port.


We originally had a USB / eSATA-Combi port planned, but we couldn't find a one that suits our needs (Surface mount).


Also, size would be an issue - we could either fit normal size USB ports or one USB / eSATA-Combi port.


It's probably more useful to have two USB Ports (to connect a mouse and keyboard, for example, or two game pads, etc.) than an eSATA Port - especially as most externa harddisks probably use USB.
I never really used the barrel jack for charging, an eSATA device nor any of the signals the ext port of the Pandora presents but all of them seem a lot more usefull to me than a second USB port :mellow:
 

British

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Out of curiosity... regarding the power adapter, logic and cost notwithstanding, would it be possible to have both USB charging and a barrel connector (with the barrel having priority over USB) ?

I tend to prefer barrel connectors, as I'm old-school like that, but if we can have both, all the better.
 

thatgui

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Sorry for the (almost) double post, forgot something

Still, we are thinking of increasing the battery size a bit to get more capacity into it - without increasing the case size too much, of course.
Reagarding several aspects of increases:
- what size increase is assumed to be realistic and how much additional batterylife will the Pyra get through that

- how would that effect device weight, altough I value batterylife a lot, I personally deem the Pandora already beeing on the edge of "too heavy"

- will the device height be increased due to that (hope not)?
 
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matzesu

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How long can i play Super Mario Land whit the bigger Batterie ??

Anyway, i need a second sim card for the Pyra, so its no problem if its full size..
 

CrazyIvan

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@ED

What about combined SIM/MicroSD slot? Is it decided that pyra won't have one? Or maybe it doesn't matter for initial case design?

Bigger battery is certainly a good idea, if anything it will increase standby time compared to pandora. I don't like charging my portable electronics once a day or two but it would be great to be able to charge only once a week or at least thrice per two weeks when it's mostly in standby mode
 
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_wb_

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As you can see, on the back there are two big USB 2.0 Host Ports as well as a Micro USB 3.0 OTG Port (which will also be used for charging the unit).
That sounds really good! Two big USB ports is really nice (I didn't expect there would be room for that!), and microUSB 3.0 OTG is really nice to have.

I'm slightly worried about the mechanical wear on the microUSB port since it would be used for charging and it's the only super high speed port available.

Then you can see a Micro HDMI Port and the headphones / headset port.
Is Micro-HDMI decided? No DisplayPort? Are there particular reasons for this choice?

Would Micro-HDMI give a strong enough mechanical connection to allow using the Pyra as a controller while being plugged in to a TV/monitor/beamer?

Headphone jack at the back side also was surprising to me. I guess front or back doesn't make a big difference when holding it as a handheld.

We originally had a USB / eSATA-Combi port planned, but we couldn't find a one that suits our needs (Surface mount).

Also, size would be an issue - we could either fit normal size USB ports or one USB / eSATA-Combi port.

It's probably more useful to have two USB Ports (to connect a mouse and keyboard, for example, or two game pads, etc.) than an eSATA Port - especially as most externa harddisks probably use USB.
 I agree that two USB ports are more useful than one USB/eSATAp combo port. The USB 3.0 port offers nearly the same speed as eSATAp.

If there is no practical way to expose the SATA interface as an external port, is there a way to use it internally? It would be a waste in my opinion to just not use such a fast interface. This would be a cool way to end the eMMC vs micro-SD debate for internal storage: use a tiny embedded SSD (e.g. something like this: http://www.innodisk.com/Product/ProductDetail.aspx?SUQwMT0wMDEmSUQwMj1lZTU5MTNlMC1iYTM5LTRkMDYtYWRmZi0zMzE4ZjVhMTU4YmImSUQwMz0mSUQ9ZTAzZmY3MzgtMGE4MS00MGU1LWFiNTItNDQyMjk1NWEwMTQzJmRmbF9JRD0wMDE%3d) for the internal storage. It's faster than what is possible with eMMC, and we can even keep the micro-SD/SIM combo too. With one fast, non-upgradeable internal storage (SATA SSD), and one not-that-fast upgradeable internal storage (microSD), it would be extremely future proof. You could, for example, have the root filesystem and maybe a swap partition on the SSD and e.g. /home and /usr/local on the internal microSD card.

Just dreaming out loud here, but that would be really cool!

Still, we are thinking of increasing the battery size a bit to get more capacity into it - without increasing the case size too much, of course.
Could there be a way to do that while still allowing it to run on a Pandora battery? No need to find a way to put a Pyra battery in the Pandora (that constraint restricts the design of the new battery too much), but the other way around could be a nice feature.
 

Askarus

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If there is no practical way to expose the SATA interface as an external port, is there a way to use it internally? It would be a waste in my opinion to just not use such a fast interface. This would be a cool way to end the eMMC vs micro-SD debate for internal storage: use a tiny embedded SSD (e.g. something like this: http://www.innodisk....mRmbF9JRD0wMDE=) for the internal storage. It's faster than what is possible with eMMC, and we can even keep the micro-SD/SIM combo too. With one fast, non-upgradeable internal storage (SATA SSD), and one not-that-fast upgradeable internal storage (microSD), it would be extremely future proof. You could, for example, have the root filesystem and maybe a swap partition on the SSD and e.g. /home and /usr/local on the internal microSD card. Just dreaming out loud here, but that would be really cool!
That is a real good Idea in my opinion.

How big is the power consumption if the nano 'SSD?

Can we even boot from the SSD?
 
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bzar

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Aren't there also ways of attaching SD-cards to SATA with some controller in between? Couldn't we this way get an upgradeable storage with speed and capacity only limited by SATA (and the controller) and the used SD card?
 
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