6 buttons AB/CD/XY and 4 shoulder buttons?

[Granitehead]

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/8bde479a16376e81817831f727a7760e

Something like this would suit most people better than the current 4 button layout, wouldn't it?

It doesn't extend past the keyboard in any way and there is still a bit of room above the topmost key.

 

[Natsu]

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/8bde479a16376e81817831f727a7760e


Something like this would suit most people better than the current 4 button layout, wouldn't it?


It doesn't extend past the keyboard in any way and there is still a bit of room above the topmost key.

How about something like this? Link

 

[God Ginrai]

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/8bde479a16376e81817831f727a7760e

Something like this would suit most people better than the current 4 button layout, wouldn't it?

It doesn't extend past the keyboard in any way and there is still a bit of room above the topmost key.

It's really weird looking at these keyboard layout things because they are all square, but the layout of the buttons looks good from what I can tell.

-God Ginrai

 

[levi]

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/8bde479a16376e81817831f727a7760e


Something like this would suit most people better than the current 4 button layout, wouldn't it?


It doesn't extend past the keyboard in any way and there is still a bit of room above the topmost key.

How about something like this? Link

I'd rather the red buttons were moved up slightly to bring them closer to the blue buttons while keeping the bottom red button away from the keyboard to avoid accidental presses there.  A bit like this

Of course, we're still arguing using square buttons, and I wouldn't expect the actual buttons to be square or that size.  It's hard to see how much space is needed and where for these buttons, using this tool, but I trust ED to come up with an arrangement that is sensible when it comes to making the final layout.

 

[Granitehead]

Of course, we're still arguing using square buttons, and I wouldn't expect the actual buttons to be square or that size.  It's hard to see how much space is needed and where for these buttons, using this tool, but I trust ED to come up with an arrangement that is sensible when it comes to making the final layout.

Yeah, that's true, of course. I think it's pretty clear that everyone wants

1) as many buttons as possible while

2) keeping them easy to press without accidentally pressing another.

And that for the gaming buttons the focus is more on 2) and for the keyboard more on 1).

I think it's important to formulate this kind of goal, to make clear what we want to ourselves and others (that is, also ED). Does anyone have a different opinion on what the generalized goal should be?

And back to throwing around unrealistic layouts with square buttons: What about this? It makes ABXY even closer to what we have before and the red and blue button rows are nearer together.

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c20741cd3df0953b89d0e7ef37538409

 

[Caine]

Does anyone have a different opinion on what the generalized goal should be?

I am sure there are more requirements (some hard, some soft) than having as many buttons as easy to press as possible.
Perhaps we should do some requirements analysis in the keyboard layout thread (seems like a better place than this one).

<edit>Created a separate requirements thread for this</edit>

 

[_wb_]

I still think it's important that ABXY can be used like a secondary dpad.

 

[Natsu]

 I like the feel of the buttons that are on the 3ds.

 

[Klumpen]

Please don't reinvent the wheel, guys.

The best solution for 6 button layout has been found many years ago and can be found on the gamepads that where posted here.

A straight cross with two additional (sometimes slightly smaller) buttons a bit off the line to follow the natural thumb movement.

 

[God Ginrai]

And back to throwing around unrealistic layouts with square buttons: What about this? It makes ABXY even closer to what we have before and the red and blue button rows are nearer together.

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/c20741cd3df0953b89d0e7ef37538409

 The bottom row is too curved.

I still think it's important that ABXY can be used like a secondary dpad.

I don't see any reason we need that. All that restriction does is limit our options.

-God Ginrai

 

[Caine]

I still think it's important that ABXY can be used like a secondary dpad.

For me it is a nice to have. How would you feel about this if it would be the deal-breaker between 4 or 6 buttons?

 

[Granitehead]

Does anyone have a different opinion on what the generalized goal should be?

I am sure there are more requirements (some hard, some soft) than having as many buttons as easy to press as possible.

Perhaps we should do some requirements analysis in the keyboard layout thread (seems like a better place than this one).

We certainly should, I don't care where, doesn't really fit either thread, I guess.

 

[TrashyMG]

I still think it's important that ABXY can be used like a secondary dpad.

For me it is a nice to have. How would you feel about this if it would be the deal-breaker between 4 or 6 buttons?

I would rather have a 4 buttons setup like a d-pad then have 6 buttons that don't have this setup. best of both worlds would be to manage to have both.

 

[bzar]

I'd rather have 4 buttons if 6 means sacrificing the cross shape. A personal preference based on my use cases, of course.

 

[God Ginrai]

I still think it's important that ABXY can be used like a secondary dpad.

For me it is a nice to have. How would you feel about this if it would be the deal-breaker between 4 or 6 buttons?

I would rather have a 4 buttons setup like a d-pad then have 6 buttons that don't have this setup. best of both worlds would be manage to have both.

You would rather reduce the playability of other games than have the angle of your buttons changed?

-God Ginrai

 

[TrashyMG]

You would rather reduce the playability of other games than have the angle of your buttons changed?
-God Ginrai

Well that setup is limiting my playability.. on many games I setup movement on those buttons like a D-pad

 

[bzar]

I consider losing the cross shape reducing the playability of games in which I've grown accustomed to using a cross shape of buttons.

 

[WizardStan]

You would rather reduce the playability of other games than have the angle of your buttons changed?

Reducing the playability of 4 button games vs not improving the playability of 6 button games. At worst the playability of 6 button games remains unchanged. The prefect scenario has the addition of 2 buttons so 6 button gaming is improved and the cross pattern is maintained so 4 button gaming is not reduced.

 

[God Ginrai]

You would rather reduce the playability of other games than have the angle of your buttons changed?

-God Ginrai

Well that setup is limiting my playability.. on many games I setup movement on those buttons like a D-pad

 Name them. There are much more games designed for a 6-button pad than there are that used the ABXY buttons as a dpad. I can guarantee you that.

I consider losing the cross shape reducing the playability of games in which I've grown accustomed to using a cross shape of buttons.

Except the SNES did not have a cross shape that was symmetrical with the dpad.

If you notice in the picture above. The A and Y buttons are further apart from each other than the B and X buttons. This would actually be further out than the tips of the dpad it would supposedly be mirrored with according to your comments. But this distance was not frustrating for players, and they even regarded the SNES controller as a good controller. Why? Because good controls has absolutely nothing to do with symmetry. This is because it does not matter that the buttons make a cross shape to be symmetrical with the dpad, but that they form 2 rows that you can move your finger along to find your buttons.

-God Ginrai

 

[Tenka]

While I agree with the reasons God Ginrai suggests that a cross shape in the game buttons is unnecessary, I still think it should be kept, or at least remain much closer to the initial cross shape than the last couple pictured arrangements were.