Wll Pandora Be Backward Comapatible With F200 And Gp32?

[chad78]

How do you think most of the open source software got to where it is today, Not from a single programmer, Obviously.
My point was, which is easier to find - a whole lot of people to do a lot of similar tasks, or one person (or one small group of people) to make one program? Or, let's put some completely made up numbers with it - 1 guy does 100 hours of work on a GP2X emulator for the Pandora. - or 50 guys do 5 hours of work to get 50 app/games ported. Now - finding a few people to do 5 hours of work is pretty easy - finding 50 - not so much. But if one person bit the bullet and did the bulk of the work to get the GP2X Emu done, then all 50 of those games - plus the however many others - are playable, not just on the Pandora - but in theory, on other Linux devices/systems as well.

• One way calls for 100 man hours - the other calls for 250.
• One calls for just one person to be convinced its worth doing - the other calls for 50.
• One ends up with every (or almost every - no emu is perfect) GP2X game being available - the other ends up with only those ported being available.
• One opens the door for other systems to emulate the GP2X - the other benefits only the Pandora.

-- Again, I know my opinion doesn't mean squat. But if the GP2X is anywhere near as awesome as half the people on here seem to think it was - I would like access to its library, not just some cherry picked arbitrary games. Same goes for the GP32.

I'm not really concerned either way, as I will most likely just be playing emulators of commercial systems, and using it as a UMPC. I just think the most efficent and effective way would be an emulator.

Let me put it this way - I'd like to see the emulator first, and then those uber-kuhl games that could benefit from being ported to Pandora native can be ported, to take advantage of it's power and controls.

 

[Squidge]

1 guy does 100 hours of work on a GP2X emulator for the Pandora. - or 50 guys do 5 hours of work to get 50 app/games ported.

You really think it'll take 5 hours to port a single gp2x app?

 

[gaterooze]

Let me put it this way - I'd like to see the emulator first, and then those uber-kuhl games that could benefit from being ported to Pandora native can be ported, to take advantage of it's power and controls.

I think you underestimate how long it would take to write that emulator from scratch and have it work in a playable form.

You're also not seeing this from the devs' point of view. You're asking some poor sod to do "100 hours" hard slog (it would likely take far, far more than that), instead of a bunch of guys doing a quick port then optimize at their leisure with user feedback.

EDIT: don't get me wrong, I would love to see a GP2X emulator!

 

[TaG]

You really think it'll take 5 hours to port a single gp2x app?
I know it will vary, but roughly how long would it take (ballpark)?
If a dev ports one app, does it in anyway help to make the next port quicker or is each port a completely new beginning?

EDIT: don't get me wrong, I would love to see a GP2X emulator!
Me too but it sounds unlikely, given that the Pandora is only one generation on. Is it any more likely that we could see a GP32 emulator, assuming there were somebody motivated to do it? ie port GP2X apps, emulate GP32.

 

[Orkie]

I reckon you could be churning out 10 ports a day from the GP2X quite easily, provided the source were in a state which will compile.

 

[God Ginrai]

Of course, ports are always better than emulating it. But, as we saw with the porting of apps from the GP32 to GP2X, not all of the apps get ported. I don't think anyone here was suggesting abandoning the process of porting GP2X games for an emulator, (although I admit that chad's post sounded like that) but we would like to cover all bases by having an emulator so that we don't lose the things that don't get ported.

-God Ginrai

That`s true, But i still own a GP32, So i suppose it doesn`t affect me as much as most, Apart from where the GP2x`s software is concerned that is, Stuff that wasn`t ported from the GP32, ie, Original software for the GP2x.

Trooper


See, I never owned a GP32. I had a friend on IRC who kept talking about how it was such an amazing console, and then after a while when I was thinking about purchasing a GBA Linker, I remembered the GP32, so I looked it up and found out about the GP2X (which was about to come out) and the XGP. Of course, I went for the GP2X because it seemed a more open console, and got a First Edition.

Every once in a while, I would look at the GP32 file archive and feel a twinge of regret when I looked at the games that didn't make it to the GP2X.

Now, something akin to Wine (coded specifically for GP2X binaries, tho') might work, seeing as how the Pandora and the GP2X have similar architectures, but I don't know for sure.

Problem is, most emus and game either hack the hardware directly, or use an SDK which does so. So you have the hardware frame buffer, lcd controller, blitter, gpio and sometimes even the second processor to worry about. It could be done, but patching the mmu to catch those addresses goes against Linux, and throwing linux out on the Pandora is a big disadvantage.


I was wondering about some of those things. :\

-God Ginrai

 

[Tobriand]

There are two things people are neglecting in this thread.

The first: A gp2x emulator will need more MHz and therefore more power than ported games.
After all, emulation always needs more power than the original system, and more power means greatly reduced battery life. One of the main reasons to play native ports is precisely because you can play them for a lot longer than an overclocked emulator. That's true on the 2x, where you'll often have to overclock emulators, but quite frequently be able to seriously underclock games, and it'd be even truer on Pandora. I'll pass on a 600MHz tetris clone, thanks.

The second: Fenix will amost certainly get ported
Not only that, but a large proportion of those 2x games that are worth porting were written in Fenix because it's easy to write in. Considering moving a Fenix game from the GP32 to the GP2x was a matter of editing one line in a plain text script once the runtime was ported, that removes quite a large incentive for creating an emulator. Of course, lots of games aren't in Fenix. But most of those are by people who I suspect will end up porting them sooner or later to Pandora anyway.

 

[God Ginrai]

There are two things people are neglecting in this thread.

The first: A gp2x emulator will need more MHz and therefore more power than ported games.
After all, emulation always needs more power than the original system, and more power means greatly reduced battery life. One of the main reasons to play native ports is precisely because you can play them for a lot longer than an overclocked emulator. That's true on the 2x, where you'll often have to overclock emulators, but quite frequently be able to seriously underclock games, and it'd be even truer on Pandora. I'll pass on a 600MHz tetris clone, thanks.

I don't see how we are neglecting that fact. It's referred to right here:

A GP32 / GP2x emulator would be useful for the few games that aren't ported to Pandora. However, if it is possible, it would be better making a port than playing that game in an emulator: you could underclock the Pandora an save battery.

However, the reason we are not actively pursuing this argument is because our main concern atm is the size of the library, not the drain of the programs.

Tho' this is one of the reasons that I agree that ports are better than emulating it, when possible.

The second: Fenix will amost certainly get ported
Not only that, but a large proportion of those 2x games that are worth porting were written in Fenix because it's easy to write in. Considering moving a Fenix game from the GP32 to the GP2x was a matter of editing one line in a plain text script once the runtime was ported, that removes quite a large incentive for creating an emulator. Of course, lots of games aren't in Fenix. But most of those are by people who I suspect will end up porting them sooner or later to Pandora anyway.

I have 5 SD cards for my GP2X: 1 512MB and 4 1GB cards. I have one Fenix game on them. I know that Fenix is a good idea, but most of the games I like are not Fenix games. It's a severe oversight to think that Fenix being ported solves everything. That's like thinking that porting a JVM would solve everything.

-God Ginrai

 

[Esn]

I wish Blue Angelo would get ported, personally. That was the last released commercial game for the GP32, and it was pretty amazing (despite the "Franglais" dialogue translation) and quite big. It was a platformer/RPG developed by Virtual Spaghetti and published by Shibuya Interactive at the end of 2004, but apparently this guy named Adriano Baglio actually made the whole thing (his name doesn't appear anywhere online, just in the game credits).

It was also released on GBA later on, but the graphics on that version aren't nearly as impressive:

Not too many people played it, though, because it cost 45 euro plus shipping from France. I think it would've done much better if sold as a download for a lower price.

 

[nubie]

-- Again, I know my opinion doesn't mean squat. But if the GP2X is anywhere near as awesome as half the people on here seem to think it was - I would like access to its library, not just some cherry picked arbitrary games. Same goes for the GP32.

BUY THEM!! They cost less than $100 (at least the GP2X does). I don't really know how many of the games are worth playing. If you want to play them just buy the system they are played on:

USA:
http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?satitle=gp2x

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?satitle=gp32

UK:
http://shop.ebay.co.uk/items/?_nkw=gp2x

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/items/?_nkw=gp32

Frankly for $300 you could probably pick up both. I recommend it in fact, that way you will learn about the system firsthand. Matter of fact, see if you can find a friend with a Vectrex and check out just what we are giving up with this transition to LCD/Plasma/DLP technology (I wonder if we will ever get it back someday with the move to laser displays?)

The second: Fenix will amost certainly get ported
Not only that, but a large proportion of those 2x games that are worth porting were written in Fenix because it's easy to write in. Considering moving a Fenix game from the GP32 to the GP2x was a matter of editing one line in a plain text script once the runtime was ported, that removes quite a large incentive for creating an emulator. Of course, lots of games aren't in Fenix. But most of those are by people who I suspect will end up porting them sooner or later to Pandora anyway.

That is exactly my first thought. Thanks Tobriand. . . Thobriand.

Most of the games are not written from scratch, they are compiled. If it only takes a line or two and a recompile With the Engine(s) ported over (once, and maybe some bugfixes), then I do not relish an entire system emulator, it would just be messy and silly.

 

[Sphinxter]

1 guy does 100 hours of work on a GP2X emulator for the Pandora. - or 50 guys do 5 hours of work to get 50 app/games ported.

You really think it'll take 5 hours to port a single gp2x app?


Would that be more or less likely than producing a finished emulator from scratch in 100 hours? b-)

 

[Exophase]

Maybe chad78 has also forgotten that a lot of people who did software for GP2X are planning on doing Pandora versions themselves.

 

[God Ginrai]

-- Again, I know my opinion doesn't mean squat. But if the GP2X is anywhere near as awesome as half the people on here seem to think it was - I would like access to its library, not just some cherry picked arbitrary games. Same goes for the GP32.

BUY THEM!! They cost less than $100 (at least the GP2X does). I don't really know how many of the games are worth playing. If you want to play them just buy the system they are played on:

USA:
http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?satitle=gp2x

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?satitle=gp32

UK:
http://shop.ebay.co.uk/items/?_nkw=gp2x

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/items/?_nkw=gp32

Frankly for $300 you could probably pick up both. I recommend it in fact, that way you will learn about the system firsthand. Matter of fact, see if you can find a friend with a Vectrex and check out just what we are giving up with this transition to LCD/Plasma/DLP technology (I wonder if we will ever get it back someday with the move to laser displays?)


And everyone who is buying the Pandora happens to have the money to spend on all of these systems? I don't know what kind of household you live in, but most people don't have $600-$700 they can just go and spend on handhelds. I certainly don't.

Not to mention carrying around all of these things together would be a bitch.

Also, that US GP32 search didn't turn up any GP32s, only that the international search had some. (which are the same 4 that showed up on your UK search) Did you even LOOK at the searches before posting the link?

-God Ginrai

 

[Razahyder]

I am from Pakistan and I have 360 (Ring of Death) Wii, DS, PSP anf F200. My 360 unfortunatly is official un repairable

 

[jmetal88]

I'm from the US and I have a Dreamcast.

 

[trooper]

I am from Pakistan and I have 360 (Ring of Death) Wii, DS, PSP anf F200. My 360 unfortunatly is official un repairable

^That is very of topic.

But, Anyway.

Have you tried the towel fix for the 360 ?. It worked for me. Gotta be worth a try.

Trooper

 

[Iorgy77]

I am from Pakistan and I have 360 (Ring of Death) Wii, DS, PSP anf F200. My 360 unfortunatly is official un repairable

^That is very of topic.

But, Anyway.

Have you tried the towel fix for the 360 ?. It worked for me. Gotta be worth a try.

Trooper


Why because he is from Pakistan he automatically has towels? not cool man, not cool.

 

[Mjlink]

Don't forget your towel...

 

[Squidge]

 

[Sphinxter]

There was a topic?