Using a Pyra as a 4g modem?

sleepy

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Hey,
I've preordered the 4gb wifi version and was thinking if i could use the pyra as a 4g modem for my other computers I might ask if I could upgrade.

Does anyone have any insight if this would work and if so work well enough?

Thanks
 

docbroke

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As much as I understand, you want to connect to internet using 4G sim in pyra and create a wifi hotspot for other devices to connect to that. It should work. I don't know about current status of software development so I am not sure if it will work immediately after you get your Pyra.
 

levi

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I think it depends more on hardware. The wifi chipset inside the pyra will need to support either acting as a hotspot to connect to or perhaps acting in ad-hoc mode will be enough. Then it's all down to software; broadcasting DHCP offers and rerouting packets to the 4G chip, but if you can't connect in the first place it's not worth working on the software.
 

Grench

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What you are describing is using the Pyra as a bridge router.

@levi is right - the main dependency is likely to be whether the WiFi chipset can be run in 'host mode'.
 

Swordfish II

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Should work via hostapd. Worst case you could likely connect via bluetooth or usb instead of wifi and share the connection
 
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levi

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Should work via hostapd. Worst case you could likely connect via bluetooth or usb instead of wifi and share the connection
That's interesting. I'll have to have a play with that, but thus far unless you count the wifi card and the ethernet port built into the motherboard, so unless I wire them up I've only the one way to get online. The Pyra should resolve that quandry and make it well worth a test.
 

Swordfish II

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That's interesting. I'll have to have a play with that, but thus far unless you count the wifi card and the ethernet port built into the motherboard, so unless I wire them up I've only the one way to get online. The Pyra should resolve that quandry and make it well worth a test.
You could do your computer > ethernet> usb adapter > pyra
 

oskda

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I've preordered the 4gb wifi version and was thinking if i could use the pyra as a 4g modem for my other computers I might ask if I could upgrade.
Do you have flat-rate 4G data? Or very generous (big and good ratio price/GB) 4G data?

I like having 4G modem on Pyra but I think it will be outdated in some years, not for speed (more speed is not so important), but for flat-rate.

With 5G, when it be well deployed, we will surely get flat-rate data tariff with good price. It will be like having your home broadband connection (cheap, fast and flat-rate) in all place (first all urban places and later all places with enough people). So I think 4G modem have no bright future, if flat-rate tariffs only goes on 5G, as 5G is designed to very high density letting flat-rate data for all people.

I think in some years we will end using 5G cellphone to get data for Pyra, more than 4G modem in Pyra. And it will be not for "more speed" but for flat-rate first.

Ideally Pyra modem had to be in a daughter card, like CPU. In this way it would be upgradeable with 5G, 6G modem, and you will have only one Pyra machine in production (now you have Pyra without modem, Pyra with modem for US, Pyra with modem for EU/other...).

5G will change all in coms.
 

Elw3

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Yes switchable modem cards would have bee a great idea, now its too late.
Anyway, 5G is bullshit and likely wont see much usage in the next decades.
Providers wont couple plans with transfer methods and all phone towers keep the older tech alive so there is no reason to worry about the modem getting outdated.
My own modem mostly runs on 2G or 3G, sometimes switching to 4G when loading a site.
So my point is all the transfer methods are used together anyway, software just picks what has the least downsides to the usecase and 5G has a lot of them, namely worse signal strengh while consuming more power.
I excpect 5Gs only advantage to be a shorter ping time, for comparison 3G has 400ms and 4G 80ms right now (on a slow tower tho).

On topic: On the pandora it was easy to share the network by just ticking a few boxes in the network icon, i see no reason why that should not work on the pyra.
 

levi

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I like having 4G modem on Pyra but I think it will be outdated in some years, not for speed (more speed is not so important), but for flat-rate.

With 5G, when it be well deployed, we will surely get flat-rate data tariff with good price. It will be like having your home broadband connection (cheap, fast and flat-rate) in all place (first all urban places and later all places with enough people). So I think 4G modem have no bright future, if flat-rate tariffs only goes on 5G, as 5G is designed to very high density letting flat-rate data for all people.

I think in some years we will end using 5G cellphone to get data for Pyra, more than 4G modem in Pyra. And it will be not for "more speed" but for flat-rate first.

Ideally Pyra modem had to be in a daughter card, like CPU. In this way it would be upgradeable with 5G, 6G modem, and you will have only one Pyra machine in production (now you have Pyra without modem, Pyra with modem for US, Pyra with modem for EU/other...).
There are other things on that main/periperhal board that are becoming outdated, arguably even faster than the modem. For example it has two USB-A's on it and two micro-USBs. It even charges by micro-USB which is very 2018 or earlier.

I'm nore sure telcos will be able to charge a flat rate for 5G data to be honest. All previous cell comms generations were meant to fall back to the older generation when a signal couldn't be found (except for 2G I guess), so I'd expect 5G to fall back to 4G when it can't get a 5G signal, when you're out in the sticks for example. Traditionally at least operators charge you a set amount per MB or what have you regardless of what technology you used. Obviously on newer generations you can burn through your money more quickly, but that's just an artifact of the technology; you're not getting any more data over time for the same money. I can't see why they wouldn't continue to run it like that on 5G to be honest. Maybe the ubiquity of 5G bandwidth in big cities will encourage them to offer cheaper bundles where you can get all you can eat for a certain price, and rely on most people being in big cities with 5G support, but how quickly that will come I don't know.
 

Elw3

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I am all for using a gameboy link cable instead USB when they keep changing it every year.
 

Swordfish II

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Do you have flat-rate 4G data? Or very generous (big and good ratio price/GB) 4G data?

I like having 4G modem on Pyra but I think it will be outdated in some years, not for speed (more speed is not so important), but for flat-rate.

With 5G, when it be well deployed, we will surely get flat-rate data tariff with good price. It will be like having your home broadband connection (cheap, fast and flat-rate) in all place (first all urban places and later all places with enough people). So I think 4G modem have no bright future, if flat-rate tariffs only goes on 5G, as 5G is designed to very high density letting flat-rate data for all people.

I think in some years we will end using 5G cellphone to get data for Pyra, more than 4G modem in Pyra. And it will be not for "more speed" but for flat-rate first.

Ideally Pyra modem had to be in a daughter card, like CPU. In this way it would be upgradeable with 5G, 6G modem, and you will have only one Pyra machine in production (now you have Pyra without modem, Pyra with modem for US, Pyra with modem for EU/other...).

5G will change all in coms.
I hacked my phone and tether to a router to provide home internet on an unlimited plan.

100mbps for $20 a month. Works well.
 

oskda

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There are other things on that main/periperhal board that are becoming outdated, arguably even faster than the modem. For example it has two USB-A's on it and two micro-USBs. It even charges by micro-USB which is very 2018 or earlier.
Outdated CPU/SO is not a a problem as it is in a daughter card and it will be updated.

Using USB-A and micro-USB is not a problem because you don't lost functionality, USB-C is only "faster" (speed or charge) but no other benefit, no disruptive change.

On other side 5G will be disruptive, it will change all in mobility because you go from previous limited mobile connection to UNLIMITED.

If you don't get 5G you will lost flat-rate internet on the go. For most of us it doesn't matter it is faster or with less delay (it will be crucial for other uses, of course), what it matters it will be flat-rate and reasonably cheap. It will be like having your home broadband connection near everywhere (except if go to unpopulated areas). Of course it will take a few years to get 5G well deployed and flat-rate data as normal, but I am sure it will be and Pyra has modem fixed on motherboard.

I'm nore sure telcos will be able to charge a flat rate for 5G data to be honest. .... I can't see why they wouldn't continue to run it like that on 5G to be honest. Maybe the ubiquity of 5G bandwidth in big cities will encourage them to offer cheaper bundles where you can get all you can eat for a certain price, and rely on most people being in big cities with 5G support, but how quickly that will come I don't know.
I am watching how from time ago it is cheaper to talk by cell phone than by a fixed line. In my country a fixed line only for voice cost about 16€ and you don't have unlimited calls to mobile phones (only to fixed lines). Mobile line with unlimited calls to mobile or fixed lines cost only 7€ on some operators. It is half price and you can talk not only on home, but anywhere.

Do you remember when we had to pay for minutes/seconds (even for call start) calling with cell phones? Now it is history if you want because they can offer cheap flat-rate voice.

Today (with 3G/4G) telcos can offer flat-rate voice on mobile, but they can't offer data flat-rate (really unlimited in all aspects). With 5G, when well deployed, they will can offer really unlimited data flat-rate on mobile. And they will offer it simply because they will earn more money in that way.

For example actually I have a 10€ plan with unlimited voice and 5GBytes data. I won't pay more for more GB of data because it isn't unlimited, but I would be glad to pay for example 20€ or even 30€ for a plan with unlimited data (only possible in future with well deployed 5G).


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I hacked my phone and tether to a router to provide home internet on an unlimited plan.

100mbps for $20 a month. Works well.
You are lucky if in your company in your country can offer $20 for unlimited data.

Is it really unlimited or does it has some limitation?

In my country only 2 companies offer flat-rate data but it much more expensive and it has some limitations (for example you can't use too much P2P).
 
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Grench

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5G is a hype wagon. Range is measured in hundreds of feet with line of sight. Won't pass well through walls, trees, snow, heavy rain or even car glass. To really get good use out of it, you will likely need a home bridge router with a rooftop mounted highly directional antenna (Yaggi or even a dish) pointed right at the servicing tower - which will need to be line of sight to your home. The bridge router would then service WiFi in the home - and your phone would be VOIP on the WiFi (Much like Google Fi does now). Actual connections of 'real 5G' directly to your phone -might- be possible in an office setting if everyone had short walled cubicles and line of sight to a bridge router - which then hit another back-haul.

Personally, I don't care much if my phone's data rate gets any faster than it is now. I have 5Ghz WiFi pretty much everywhere with 2.4Ghz back fill secondary networks for when I'm too far from the router. What I use of truly mobile data is while driving for nav or looking something up while out and about. 4G works fine for that.

Your mobile carrier wants the 5G bands for service to homes with dedicated rooftop antennas (and additional rented hardware) locked on their tower so that they can compete for the 'last mile' with cable and telcos for your home internet connection. It is near-on worthless on a phone itself for anything but sales hype.
 

levi

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Outdated CPU/SO is not a a problem as it is in a daughter card and it will be updated.
...snip...
If you don't get 5G you will lost flat-rate internet on the go. For most of us it doesn't matter it is faster or with less delay (it will be crucial for other uses, of course), what it matters it will be flat-rate and reasonably cheap. It will be like having your home broadband connection near everywhere (except if go to unpopulated areas). Of course it will take a few years to get 5G well deployed and flat-rate data as normal, but I am sure it will be and Pyra has modem fixed on motherboard.
Yes, it's fixed on the motherboard, if you want to use that term, but the motherboard is also designed to be replaceable in the way that the CPU board is.

I am watching how from time ago it is cheaper to talk by cell phone than by a fixed line. In my country a fixed line only for voice cost about 16€ and you don't have unlimited calls to mobile phones (only to fixed lines). Mobile line with unlimited calls to mobile or fixed lines cost only 7€ on some operators. It is half price and you can talk not only on home, but anywhere.

Do you remember when we had to pay for minutes/seconds (even for call start) calling with cell phones? Now it is history if you want because they can offer cheap flat-rate voice.
Yes, we only have a land line here to allow for people to call us, and because without it you're limited to a single cable operator for your internet.

Today (with 3G/4G) telcos can offer flat-rate voice on mobile, but they can't offer data flat-rate (really unlimited in all aspects). With 5G, when well deployed, they will can offer really unlimited data flat-rate on mobile. And they will offer it simply because they will earn more money in that way.

For example actually I have a 10€ plan with unlimited voice and 5GBytes data. I won't pay more for more GB of data because it isn't unlimited, but I would be glad to pay for example 20€ or even 30€ for a plan with unlimited data (only possible in future with well deployed 5G).
SIM only contacts on three (UK) come in from 20GBP (about 23EUR at today's money). They claim in their advertising that it's truly unlimited, but that's advertising for you, but it may still be okay for my Pyra needs I dunno. Actually at present I use an as-you-eat PAYG SIM that charges me 3p per MB, but I use data so infrequently on the go and even then mostly use a site that can give me the train times in about 10KB per time I check. Maybe for my Pyra I'll need to go on some kind of contract though.
 

oskda

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5G is a hype wagon. .....

Your mobile carrier wants the 5G bands for service to homes with dedicated rooftop antennas (and additional rented hardware) locked on their tower so that they can compete for the 'last mile' with cable and telcos for your home internet connection. It is near-on worthless on a phone itself for anything but sales hype.
At some point in 2020 even mid-rangers phones will have 5G. Even Mediatek plans 5G SOC for mid 2020. Carries are adapting cell network for 5G. But you say it is wordless, only hype.

I am sorry but I think you are totally mistaken. You think it is hype but it will be really disruptive. Of course it will take years to complete 5 network so that it be "real". Even it is possible I will avoid 1st gen modems as next gens will be better and more efficient, but in some moment it will no hype but disruptive. And in that moment we will have a 4G fixed modem inside our Pyra.

When 5G SA (Standalone), not 5G NSA, be enough deployed in some areas, we'll can know if it works on mobile phones or if it only works with highly directional antennas :) We will know if you were right or wrong.

When DIGITAL 2G mobile connections were introduced coverage was much worse than old analogue mobile connections. I remember how 2G had cuts on coms (from like metal sound to simply cutting connection) while in the same place analogue was working perfectly. Then some people said 2G was worse because a lot of reasons. For example one reason was that, as digital, information is received perfectly or not received while analogue information is received with more or less noise, but received and usually totally understandable. With time 2G/3G cell phone surpassed analogue cell phone and cell phone were dropped :)

Even you say they want to compete in the last mile, and while it could be true in some areas, in others at some moment it could be possible each lamppost can have a 5G antenna, so they wire last mile to cover each lamppost and only save a few meters from lamppost to your house, not last mile.

PD: I'm sorry as mostly I don't use imperial units so I don't know feet unit. Even I don't know how much long mi feet is :) I use international metric system and this is an international forum. I know inches as it is *bad* used for displays (bad because it is used for a diagonal, while diagonal doesn't indicate display size: it changes with same diagonal but different aspect ratio, so we had to use surface unit, no diagonal size).
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Yes, it's fixed on the motherboard, if you want to use that term, but the motherboard is also designed to be replaceable in the way that the CPU board is.
Of course, at some point ED will have order a new design for a new board if he want to change 4G modem for 5G/6G (or other fixed parts on motherboard). But it isn't the same like changing daughter board because changing motherboard you are dropping a lot of parts you don't need to change.
 
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lukey

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The thing is: The normal 5G Base-Stations also have 4G as well. Also I doubt that the carriers will limit their plans to only 5G.
 
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